50 State Legal Silenced Muzzleloader

[Petrol & Powder]

Muzzleloaders(pre-1898 firearms) are not "non-firearms", they are antique firearms and they fall under a very specific exemption(s)/definition(s) in the U.S.C. and the C.F.R..

Many states consider them a firearm and have specific laws that convicted felons can't own muzzleloaders or use them for hunting. I can also make a pretty good bet that if you murder someone with a muzzleloader every state in the nation will consider it a firearm in relation to the murder charges.

Very True in Virginia. Any device originally designed to launch a projectile by explosives means is a firearm in Virginia.

A pre-1898 firearm may not come under the authority of the 1968 Gun Control Act but if it fits the description above, it's still a firearm in Virginia.

So while you can order a black powder cap & ball revolver and have it shipped to your front door (in Virginia) without any FFL involved; you cannot legally possess that cap & ball revolver if you're convicted felon.

If you use that cap & ball revolver (or muzzleloader rifle, shotgun , etc.) to commit a robbery; that will be "use of a firearm in the commission of a felony" (at least in Va.)

If you possess that cap & ball revolver while selling cocaine or meth you will be committing the crime of simultaneous possession of a firearm and illegal drugs.

If you carry that cap & ball revolver onto school property it will be considered a "firearm"

The examples go on but you get the point.

Just because federal law may permit some activity doesn't automatically mean the state cannot prohibit that same activity.

[Harter66]

Ohh the irony in these two sentences...


Why would I possibly want to cut back to one case of powder a week, why would I limit my reloading and shooting that much? If you meant beer, I haven't touched a drop of that nasty stuff in years and years.


If you have to drive a 16 y.o. truck to afford to own a couple cans and pay the tax you might consider doing something about your income...
If suppressors are the good toys, you and I definitely have a different idea of what the good toys are.

My trucks are 18-22 yr models old because they start every morning and there's no payments .

This is as stupid an argument as clays shooter having their britches in a bunch because someone wants a magazine extension in a shotgun that will hold more than 3 already . It's obvious that they've never hunted chucker in the west or they would be in line for the doubl full box drum conversion on that side 12 round beasty .

If you don't like the hunting ethos of using of a caseless 50-120 with a muffler and CF primers don't shoot it in the field . Go be happy hunting with a stick pointed with your self knapped flint/obsidian knife you spent days finding the perfect rock to make . If that's your thing more power to ya .

If the quiet , reduced smoke , 209 primed , scoped 45-120 gets just 1 AR spray and pray kid interested in the history of the rifles and the history surrounding them it's a win . I can certainly see where the suppression would draw their attention .
Volcanic glass makes a very sharp cutting tool .
Bronze is more durable .
Iron holds a better edge but rusts .
Stainless steel doesn't rust , takes and holds an edge and won't break if you drop it .
What's in your pocket ?
Don't even get me started on bows .

[Eldon]

Interesting that with the exception of NV, even members in non-slave states are well conditioned to make the approved responses.

They have no facts to dispute what the maker of this suppressed MZ has to say.

IF (I have a faint hope) the feds decide to treat Suppressors as a firearm, there is some hope that the states, faced with huge health care costs, may follow. It could provide them yet another way to tax honest people by licencing them as they do hand guns.

Never underestimate the ability of politicians to abandon sacred principals if they can get more money from the public.

Going to the FREE GOVERNMENT FUNDED range today to try out some new loads in my SUPPRESSED Kimber Adirondak 6.5 CM.

Have tags for: sheep, moose, deer, antelope, elk and wolf ----- busy fall !

Gee wonder why I left NY 20 years ago ?

[StolzerandSons]

Interesting that with the exception of NV, even members in non-slave states are well conditioned to make the approved responses.

They have no facts to dispute what the maker of this suppressed MZ has to say.

IF (I have a faint hope) the feds decide to treat Suppressors as a firearm, there is some hope that the states, faced with huge health care costs, may follow. It could provide them yet another way to tax honest people by licencing them as they do hand guns.

Never underestimate the ability of politicians to abandon sacred principals if they can get more money from the public.

Going to the FREE GOVERNMENT FUNDED range today to try out some new loads in my SUPPRESSED Kimber Adirondak 6.5 CM.

Have tags for: sheep, moose, deer, antelope, elk and wolf ----- busy fall !

Gee wonder why I left NY 20 years ago ?

Hello Pot, meet Kettle.

[Harter66]

In regard to the legality .
I have no grounds to make that call .
I do know that in NV I can have a cap and ball or an ML 700 mailed to the house USPS .
I can walk out the door at Scheels, Cabela's and Moes bait and tackle without an NICS or a 4473 on the above .
From an unfortunate situation with an X I know that removing them from the abode is a CYA at the Judges choice if there is an infraction of a TRO and that a cop serving isn't willing to even try to make that call .

Because ML and C&B are not firearms in NV I would expect them to be treated with an integral suppressor the same as a Gamo Black Cat Whisper integral suppressor air rifle . Proof of 18 , 21yr in Clark county pay your money hit the door . But there is a certain pistol grip 14" shotgun that kind of opened a can of worms recently nevermind the expanded background check mess . So I would say all bets are off and if you buy one here be ready to reach compliance with a disassembly destruction of the assembly and a cut and crown .

Nevada may have joined the Union on 10/31/1864 as a Yankee state but there was a literal ton of silver shipped to the south . See the unedited version of the history of the UNLV Running Rebels . We had plenty of Coolies here too . While the slave issue was a nil issue in the state even today as seen in the Bundy cases we struggle with states rights and making our reps stand for what 80% of the land and 25% of the population were trust deeded .

I have a couple of raw spots also .

[StolzerandSons]

NRS 202.253  Definitions.  As used in NRS 202.253 to 202.369, inclusive:

1.  “Explosive or incendiary device” means any explosive or incendiary material or substance that has been constructed, altered, packaged or arranged in such a manner that its ordinary use would cause destruction or injury to life or property.

2.  “Firearm” means any device designed to be used as a weapon from which a projectile may be expelled through the barrel by the force of any explosion or other form of combustion.

3.  “Firearm capable of being concealed upon the person” applies to and includes all firearms having a barrel less than 12 inches in length.

4.  “Motor vehicle” means every vehicle that is self-propelled.

https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-...l#NRS202Sec253
https://vegasinc.lasvegassun.com/new...-antique-guns/

[Harter66]

So a Beeman air rifle with too much oil in it is a firearm ?

Any oxygen introduced into a precharged air rifle that requires a petroleum lubricant would be a firearm then too.

Under those sections every every FFL in the state is commiting dozens of felonies every day .
Who knew .......I guess that is why we pay lawyers .

[StolzerandSons]

I didn't write the law, just telling you what it is. If you don't like it talk to your legislators.

[Pavia]

Any object used to assault someone can be considered a weapon... cane, rock, pen knife... etc.

[Harter66]

As of today the rifle in question is still good to ship to the door here in NV
Per DAs in 2 counties .

[Pavia]

I'll live without a wall or healthcare reform if Congress and Trump can pass and sign the Hearing Protection Act

[Smoke4320]

Personally never had an issue with the old health care system..
others did .. and I do like the ban on not insuring pre-existing conditions but what we have now is a joke and allowing government to take over in a single payer system would only be worse
Look at all the VA problems ..

so roll back healthcare with some stipulations. Get Lawyers out of healthcare with a max lawsuit cap and give us the hearing protection act ..
then work on a greatly simplified tax system something that's one or 2 pages a senior in high school can fill out correctly and massively lowers the tax rate .. Then sit back and watch the economy explode in a year to 1-1/2

[Edward]

Ohh the irony in these two sentences...


Why would I possibly want to cut back to one case of powder a week, why would I limit my reloading and shooting that much? If you meant beer, I haven't touched a drop of that nasty stuff in years and years.


If you have to drive a 16 y.o. truck to afford to own a couple cans and pay the tax you might consider doing something about your income...
If suppressors are the good toys, you and I definitely have a different idea of what the good toys are.

I think every one has a value system ,obviously yours is different than the O.P.s or mine .But don"t even for a minute think yours is better or the only way!(It ain"t ) and I drive an old ford that gets me to the airport several times a year to spend lots of money with my bows /guns hunting in different places and getting the most fun I can have in the time I have left.Part of my plan was drive what works /don"t waste money needlessly and take time to do what"s important with those who are important and never mock another mans labor (unless he"s an employee) and doesn"t do the job .As the employer I got to do that occasionally but that always came back to me ,being I hired/screwed up in the 1st place

[StolzerandSons]

I think every one has a value system ,obviously yours is different than the O.P.s or mine .But don"t even for a minute think yours is better or the only way!(It ain"t ) and I drive an old ford that gets me to the airport several times a year to spend lots of money with my bows /guns hunting in different places and getting the most fun I can have in the time I have left.Part of my plan was drive what works /don"t waste money needlessly and take time to do what"s important with those who are important and never mock another mans labor (unless he"s an employee) and doesn"t do the job .As the employer I got to do that occasionally but that always came back to me ,being I hired/screwed up in the 1st place

I wasn't saying my value system is better than anyone's, I was and still am pointing out the irony(almost hypocrisy) of someone telling the rest of us we are conditioned and live in slave states while proudly proclaiming the tax he paid for an item the gov't should never have regulated and screaming about the use of a gov't funded range. I wasn't mocking his labor, I pointing out his contradictory statements.

Why didn't you admonish him for his comments about where we chose to live or about his comments about the rest of us being conditioned? I don't think his "cases" comment was about buying powder but I notice you didn't say anything to him about the assumption that the rest of us buy to many "cases", so we can't afford to pay the Tax for a "can."
You might want to go back and re-read the whole thread.

As for driving old trucks my current truck is a 1954 Ford F-250 but like everything I have bought in my life I paid cash for it.

[Elkins45]

Wow, this really went off the rails didn't it?

[M-Tecs]

Legal challenges http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...ss-which-ones/

[StolzerandSons]

Okay you are all right and the manufacturer who has invested a ton in this is wrong.

He has no attorneys and knows nothing LMAO !

As far as the states go --- if you chose to live in a state run by loons, having a suppressed BP rifle is the least of your problems !

Legal challenges http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...ss-which-ones/

I'm shocked I tell you, just shocked...
What was that Eldon, what were you saying about the manufacturer and their lawyer(s)? Guess they are going to spend some more money on lawyers...
Please guys tell me again how they are "legal everywhere" or how they are "non-firearms", I was just about to believe you.

[Eldon]

They are 48 state legal AS FAR AS THE FEDS ARE CONCERNED.

If you live in a slave state, probably not.

IF you really cared about your freedom more than your status you would relocate.

When NY dove off the cliff (Senator Clinton) we moved to WY and FL and are enjoying our freedom and improved standard of living.

Those who stay in slave states are like the Jews who stayed in Germany ------- not IF, only WHEN.

I could not sell my 1911 Ithaca single trap in CA (the worst slave state) because it has a real ivory bead front sight,

Probably would be sent to a "re-education" camp after my prison term was up.

[Texas by God]

No thanks, seems like it would be a huge mess in that can after a dozen shots. Besides I like the way a muzzleloader sounds.

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Amen!

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[StolzerandSons]

They are 48 state legal AS FAR AS THE FEDS ARE CONCERNED.

If you live in a slave state, probably not.

IF you really cared about your freedom more than your status you would relocate.

When NY dove off the cliff (Senator Clinton) we moved to WY and FL and are enjoying our freedom and improved standard of living.

Those who stay in slave states are like the Jews who stayed in Germany ------- not IF, only WHEN.

Slave states like FL? Because last time I checked I had more carry freedom in KS than you have in FL.
Have you gained the right to open carry in FL yet? http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...pen_carry.html
Can you concealed carry in FL without a permit/license?

In KS I have constitutional carry, I can open carry or concealed carry without having to ask the permission of the state or pay for a conceal carry permit/license.

Tell me that one again...so apparently you only care about your status or do you plan to relocate? Or maybe you just chose to trade your freedom for a Gov't funded range?