ID'ing Swaging Dies

[openbook]

I bought a lot of swaging equipment, and have been piecing together what I can. I wanted to ask for some expert help after spending quite a bit looking into this myself. Here's the first pic.


This setup came with one small horizontal press that is either a Corbin Silver or a Ted Smith SAS Mity Mite. There are 15-20 dies and probably 50 punches. Not a single one of the dies is marked. One and only one punch has markings on it, and that one says "224 C." As you can see in the first picture, there are two different kinds of threads on the dies. Here's a close up to show the difference in the threads.


The coarser threading on the left appears to be 9/16 in diameter and 18 threads per inch. The finer threads on the right are 5/8 and 22 threads per inch. The 5/8 ones fit the press.

Here's a nice set of 44-40 (.427 diameter) punches and a core seater.



I've had some trouble figuring out the hardware for the punches. The two pieces on the left in this picture fit into the floating punch holder:

But the other pieces have me baffled. They are knurled rings threaded on the inside. The threads don't seem to fit anything else in the kit (the third piece, far right, is smooth outside and inside, the central cavity does not go all the way through, and the small horizontal hole is threaded).



I have two primary questions so I'll start with those. First, does anyone have a lead on what the coarsely threaded, 9/16 diameter dies might fit? They don't fit anything in the collection I've got here. Alelord's thread, that I resurrected last week, has pictures of some dies that look similar, down to the cutouts on top for putting a wrench on them. I would really like to figure out what kind of press these 9/16 dies went to.

Second, what are the knurled rings that are threaded on the inside? Those threads don't fit anything in the kit. The holes of varying sizes would hold some of the punches I've got.

These pictures are only about 20% of the pieces I've got. I also have the press itself with its floating punch holder and a four-cavity .200 diameter core mold. This equipment all came from an estate. It's evidently seen a lot of good use in its time. There are at least nine different calibers here. I'd like to figure out a way to make it work again.

One last pic. This set could be for 257 Roberts or 25-06.

[garandsrus]

The knurled ring with the internal threads should be for a floating punch holder. Does your punch holder have both internal and external threads? The punch would have a shoulder so that it doesn’t fall out of the die. The shaft of the punch goes through the hole.

Your last picture shows a punch. If it is the same size as the point form die, that is the die it goes to. If it fits inside a jacket, it is for the core seat die. You probably need a second punch for the die set.

The longer punches are used with the threaded dies. They will eject the case when the press handle is lowered. The short punches go in the floating punch holder and enter the threaded die to form a “stop” so that raising the press handle either seats the core or points the bullet.

The best thing you can do is to measure the punch diameters and group them by size. Then find the threaded dies that they are a good fit to. A set of dies will be two or three threaded dies and at least two punches. There could be more. Some of these dies might be for lead bullets. If so, they can have punches for different nose profiles. It looks like one of your pictures is a SWC nose punch.


A plastic tackle box organizer will help to keep everything straight when you get there.

[SSG_Reloader]

I'd double check the 5/8 threading. It should be 5/8-24 not 22, but someone correct me if I'm wrong.

+1 to organzational boxes. Separate all the 9/16 and 5/8's first.Was there a list of all the calibers in the lot? Id identify all the point form dies first and then start backtracking from there by identifying the core seat dies next (with their punches).

I have no idea what those other knurled nuts are.Looks like they are also some sort of way to capture punches in another type of punch holder. What inside threading are they?

[openbook]

I'd believe they're 5/8-24, it was a bit tough to tell whether there were 11 or 12 in the half-inch I counted (because the threads taper off at the end). There was no list of calibers but there were a number of small plastic bags with calibers marked on them. However, most of what was in the bags was wrongly sorted.

[Bent Ramrod]

Often the dies without the wrench flats are made to screw by hand into what looks like a hollowed-out 7/8"x14tpi reloading die for use on a standard reloading press. If you have any such bodies like that in the other 80% of the stuff you have, you might see if they screw in. Seating punches for such dies are made to fit into the ram, so the bottoms should look like those of snap-in shell holders.

There should be punches of various sorts and sometimes a spring to retract them after they have been pushed down for ejection. That stuff goes into the die holder before you screw the die insert in. A knurled capped rod is usually included which slides into the top of the die assembly so the seated core or the pointed-up bullet can be tapped out of the die with a wooden or leather mallet.

Some makers supplied a frame which clamps to the press ram and goes over the die so the backstroke on the press pushes the knurled rod down to eject the swaged core or bullet. No mallet is then needed.

Most of those little one-man bullet swage die shops didn't mark their dies; if the box was lost, all the info went with it.

[openbook]

Thanks for your replies. I wasn't able to get more pictures uploaded until today. Here first are a couple pics of my press:



Next is the floating punch holder. The bolt in the top allows adjusting the depth of the external punch.


And here's the floating punch holder disassembled.


I've sorted through most of the set and grouped the punches and dies by size.

The knurled ring with the internal threads should be for a floating punch holder. Does your punch holder have both internal and external threads? The punch would have a shoulder so that it doesn’t fall out of the die. The shaft of the punch goes through the hole.

Yes, the punch holder has external threads, but they are much too big for the knurled rings with internal threading. Here's a picture of the lock ring, which fits the floating punch holder external threads, next to those knurled rings:

I have no idea what those other knurled nuts are.Looks like they are also some sort of way to capture punches in another type of punch holder. What inside threading are they?

I'm not sure; their threads don't seem to fit anything else in the set. I also thought they were for the external punches but can't figure out how to use them.

Often the dies without the wrench flats are made to screw by hand into what looks like a hollowed-out 7/8"x14tpi reloading die for use on a standard reloading press. If you have any such bodies like that in the other 80% of the stuff you have, you might see if they screw in. Seating punches for such dies are made to fit into the ram, so the bottoms should look like those of snap-in shell holders.

There should be punches of various sorts and sometimes a spring to retract them...

I don't have any hollowed-out die bodies like that, unfortunately. Maybe I can machine one that will let me use the several dies that don't fit the press with my reloading presses. Also, I don't have any punches that have bases like snap-in shell holders. I do have a spring that came with the other stuff. It's got a taper, so it's wider at one end. I don't think it would be needed with this press, because this SAS/Corbin press has holes for the stop pin that makes the internal punches eject the swaged core or bullet.

[Bent Ramrod]

On my Corbin set, the spring goes into the core seating die body between the plunger and the pin, so the plunger will spring back and the pin will retract automatically when the core is ejected. The point forming die doesn’t have one; the skinny ejection pin pushes up into the die again when the jacketed core is inserted. These are both for die assemblies that fit in a standard reloading press.

I found an incomplete set of Bahler swaging dies (still in the box, which is the only reason I know that they are Bahler) that had a punch arrangement that mounted on the press ram with a (missing) internally-threaded flange with hole in center that apparently was made to screw over the assembly so the punch would “float” a little in the hole. I made a replacement, but I haven’t tried the set out yet. Those flange parts you show might be for something like that.

Your press is a “Mity-Mite,” made by Shooters’ Accessory Supply when Ted Smith was the proprietor. He wrote a booklet called The Bullet Swage Manual, which I believe is still available from Corbin’s, the successor company that bought Smith out when he retired. You might check Corbin’s website out, and maybe send them the pictures; ask if a copy of the Manual (which has drawings of the setup and parts, IIRC) is still available, and request a description of what the other stuff is for, and if they can supply anything that’s missing. I know the dies with the wrench flats screw into the ram of the “Mity-Mite” behind a punch arrangement that ejects automatically when the press lever is raised back. And the base punch, as you have observed, goes into the headstock of the press. But I haven’t messed with the setup for a while, and memory gets fuzzy. Along with his diemaking skills, Richard Corbin is also a historian and quite knowledgable about a lot of the old-time one-man bullet die operations and their products.