A Lee taper crimp die question

[Juan Jose]

I was thinking of loading 148 gr lead wadcutters.
I happen to have a generous supply of .38 Spl. wadcutter brass.
This brass is made for taper crimps, and low velocity target wad cutter loads don't require roll crimps (or so I've read.)
Taper crimps seem to preserve case life (45acp brass lasts a looooong time, anyway!)
So I want to give the taper crimp a try.
I also want to switch to a carbide sizing die for obvious reasons.
I can buy a set of Lees for much less than replacing the sizing die on my current set.
When I looked up info on Lee 38 dies (from several sites) I read that a taper crimp is unnecessary on the newer Lee 38 die because the sizing die adequately performs the taper crimp.
I could not find a listing for 38 taper crimp die from Lee dealers.
Want I want to know is, is this true? Will a current production Lee sizing die taper crimp?

Thanks!

[Gillie Dog]

Your best bet is to call Lee and ask them.

Revolver cartridge dies usually come with roll crimp and auto cartridge dies usually come with taper crimp. So yes, a taper crimp die would be advised to taper crimp a 38 special. But.........................

Lee will answer your question from the "horses mouth".

GD

[tranders]

In my opinion your roll crimp die will work fine. When I load wadcutters in 38 Special I just kiss the case mouth with the roll crimp die just enough to remove the bell from the expander die.

Sorry, don't know about the Lee taper crimp die.

[W.R.Buchanan]

The sizing die won't crimp at all it is for sizing the case. The seating die is the one that will.

Randy

[Juan Jose]

Thank you! I sent Lee an email and will report what I learn from them.

[bedbugbilly]

The size die is for sizing the case - not crimping. My Lee set puts a roll crimp on my 38 spell. I do have a separate Lee die that is labeled as a "taper crimp" die - it is also labeled as doing 357 Mag and 357 Max.

Check with Lee for sure on the 38 spel. dies. I bought my Lee 38 Spl. taper crimp die from Titan. They may be able to tell you as well.

The only time I have used my Lee 38 special taper crimp die that I bought from Titan is for taper crimping StarLine 360 DW brass that I have used in my 357 Handi Rifle that has a deep chamber - I used the StarLine 360 DW brass (Dan Wesson) rather than ream the chamber to 357 Max as the 360 DW brass is longer than 357 Mag but shorter than 357 Max and being that that the Handi Rifle is a single shot, a taper crimp works fine. In my particular 357 Handi Rifle, the StarLine 360 DW brass works fine.

I do load a bit of 38 Colt Short and 38 Colt Long. I have the Lee die set for that and IIRC, that die set puts a taper crimp on the brass. I have never checked but they may use a 9mm seating die/crimp die in that set - which would put a taper crimp on the cartridge. I know you are looking to switch to a carbide sizing die for your 38 brass (at least that is how I am interpreting your post). Does your 38 spl. die set that your are currently using with you WC have a seating die that also taper crimp? Or does it roll crimp? If you have a 9mm seating/crimp die, you might remove the seating stem, set the seating/crimp die of your current set out and seat the WC - then try tape crimping with the 9mm seat/crimp die and see if the taper crimp gives you a crimp that is satisfactory? Or, the 9mm seat/crimp die may not work as the body would be too short?

[str8wal]

In my opinion your roll crimp die will work fine. When I load wadcutters in 38 Special I just kiss the case mouth with the roll crimp die just enough to remove the bell from the expander die.

Sorry, don't know about the Lee taper crimp die.

What he said ^^^

You can adjust the amount of crimp to from nothing to a heavy roll.

[jetinteriorguy]

148 gr wadcutters do not need a crimp. Just seat them almost all the way into the case and remove the bell on the case mouth and your good to go. Of course this is assuming your not loading them to real high levels but just to target levels. I've shot thousands of these over 2.8 gr of Bullseye and they shoot great.

[metricmonkeywrench]

I have both the Lee Factory Crimp Die and the Taper crimp die. I crimp seperate from bullet seating. The biggest diffrence between the two is that the Lee taper crimp dies DOES NOT have the carbide sizing ring that may in some cases swage the bullet/case when crimping. I have just started toying with wadcutters and use the taper crimp die to take out the case bell.

[Guesser]

25 years ago I bought a 38/357 taper crimp die from Midway. It was a Lee and cost 5$+/-; been using it ever since. HBWC and some other designs as well, good tool.

[noylj]

You should have a slight roll crimp. You load them either flush or just below flush with the case mouth (so you put a very slight roll crimp so the rounds drop in the cylinder easily and the bullet doesn't move) or you seat so you roll crimp in the crimp groove.
If you look at a factory round, you can verify this.
There is no benefit to a taper crimp.
If you want to buy a die, buy the Redding Profile Crimp die. That die alone shrank my group size by about 1/2" at 25 yards.

[mdi]

I was thinking of loading 148 gr lead wadcutters.
I happen to have a generous supply of .38 Spl. wadcutter brass.
This brass is made for taper crimps, and low velocity target wad cutter loads don't require roll crimps (or so I've read.)
Taper crimps seem to preserve case life (45acp brass lasts a looooong time, anyway!)
So I want to give the taper crimp a try.
I also want to switch to a carbide sizing die for obvious reasons.
I can buy a set of Lees for much less than replacing the sizing die on my current set.
When I looked up info on Lee 38 dies (from several sites) I read that a taper crimp is unnecessary on the newer Lee 38 die because the sizing die adequately performs the taper crimp.
I could not find a listing for 38 taper crimp die from Lee dealers.
Want I want to know is, is this true? Will a current production Lee sizing die taper crimp?

Thanks!

Personally, I've not heard of nor see 38 Special brass for dedicated wadcutter use. I believe Lee dies sets use he crimp that is normally used on a particular cartridge; revolver die sets include a roll crimp, and pistol die sets include a taper crimp (at least this is true for the 5 Lee dies sets for handguns I own). Since a light target load with wadcutters don't require a crimp to hold bullets in place any crimp die that will straighten out and remove the case mouth flare will work. A roll crimp die can be used "lightly", no need for the roll crimp die to form a roll on the case. But if you're set on a taper crimp, just purchase a taper crimp die for the 38 Special... https://www.google.com/search?q=tape...hrome&ie=UTF-8

[metricmonkeywrench]

Midi, check out this link on wadcutter specific brass: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-in-a-Model-27

Here is a picture of a piece I cut in half to see the wall thickness difference. Note where the web ends compared to a standard case

[mdi]

Well, that's a new one on me. I reloaded my first 38 Special in '69, and now have somewhere between 2.000 and 2,500 38 Special cases. There are "normal" differences between manufacturers, some may be thicker, but not one could be described as wadcutter brass and there is nothing on the headstamp to determines a singular use; wadcutters (out of boredom last week I cleaned, sized and sorted about 500 cases. no mention or indication of "wadcutter"). But I could be wrong, I was wrong once in 1985...

[DougGuy]

I would roll crimp also, never have taper crimped for a rimmed revolver case. Taper crimp die for a 9mm should work for what OP wants to do with it. Simple enough.

[str8wal]

I was wrong once in 1985...

You too?

[Wayne Smith]

I have read, here and Handloader, that 38 Special brass with a chanellure(Sp?) or two are wadcutter brass. I have never heard of these using a taper crimp.