Lee PrecisionReloading EverythingMidSouth Shooters SupplyInline Fabrication
RepackboxSnyders JerkyTitan ReloadingWideners
RotoMetals2 Load Data
Page 1 of 6 123456 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 107

Thread: Winchester LP primer problem

  1. #1
    Boolit Master oldhenry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Albany, GA
    Posts
    911

    Winchester LP primer problem

    My preferred pistol primer is Federal, but they're about impossible to find locally or on line now. The Winchester & CCI primers are OK, but the CCIs are slightly harder & I don't like to use them in my DA revolvers (I shoot my DA revolvers in DA). I've never had any particular problem with the Winchester primers........I loaded up on them during the Clinton years. That supply is now exhausted & the recent supply: lot#GKL594G is difficult to seat.......sometimes almost impossible to seat.

    Are any other members of the forum having problems with WLPs? The problem persists with all different brands of brass.

    Henry

  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master
    white eagle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    718 miles E. of Wall Drug
    Posts
    6,173
    never had a problem with win primers
    use them all the time
    Hit em'hard
    hit em'often

  3. #3
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Deep South Texas
    Posts
    12,820
    The Winchester large pistol primer has been my go to primer for 40 years with zero problems. I would look to your cases as the source of the problem.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master tazman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    west central Illinois
    Posts
    7,703
    I only have trouble seating primers in S&B cases and military cases. Everything else is no problem.
    I use on press priming and Winchester primers. This is for 45 ACP.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Soda Springs, Idaho
    Posts
    1,093
    I use lots of WLP primers in 45 ACP and everything else that requires a LP primer, no problem. I also have several thousand Federal LP primers but that's another story.

    Dick

  6. #6
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    What method are you using to seat them?
    On press.?.what type and brand?
    (A member complained once that his were tough to get them to seat to depth each time and do it the same every time...his shell plate was a bit loose.)

    Are they tough/impossible to seat in multiple different case brands?

    Tough to get them to press in.?. as in it takes excessive force?
    Or do you mean tough to get them to seat at the same depth each time?
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  7. #7
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    le Cannet south of FRANCE
    Posts
    366
    i have a lot of S&B 45 acp cases impossible to seat any primers 's brands

  8. #8
    Boolit Buddy
    CASTER OF LEAD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    WEST ARKANSAS
    Posts
    335
    I am currently using a stash of WLR, WSR,AND WSP . Only brass I have issues with is S&B. Lake City, some Federal cases are hard to seat them ,but as mentioned in an earlier post I looked to the brass. I hand ream the LC,&FC that present the issues and problem is gone. I Hand prime almost exclusively. If it don't feel right I never force the issue. Simply find out why it is so hard to prime ,and either fix the issue or toss the brass. YMMV - CASTER
    In regards to shooting safety.Until you are ready to fire, keep your booger hook off the bang switch.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    WNY
    Posts
    2,505
    I've always found that when I had a "primer" problem it was the brass. I've used countless thousands of WLP and every other brand and never found anything I couldn't use. Some were just a tiny bit tighter than others but still seated well with just a bit more pressure. Bad brass.....whole different story. You simply can't get two pounds of sugar in a one pound bag.

  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    I think I take too much for granted when these questions arise...

    Proper brass preparation doesn't just include throwing the dirty brass in the tumbler, it also includes proper preparation and inspection of the cases and the primer pockets too. Since one of my presses is a progressive I have to deprime and then clean the cases before the brass hits the press...time does not dictate how I load ammunition, quality of the reload does. But, I am retired and am not forced to take shortcuts.

    In my mind, I think of this as being part of the basic 'A B C's' of handloading but given how many who use the progressives and are always pressed for time...they run batches of brass and never see the primer pockets much less clean or trim/ream them. How would they know some of their inventory needs a little special, out of the ordinary attention to detail...?

    I am not saying that this is the situation of the OP but...this 'always in a hurry world' we are caught up in is detracting from our craft.
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

    Rattlesnake Charlie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Victor, CO
    Posts
    1,379
    I use a RCBS case deburring tool on every primer pocket. Just a little helps reduce those few that catch when starting the primer. All get the primer pocket reamed/cleaned with the Hornady primer pocket tool. Takes care of those military crimped primer pockets and those few that really are tight or not quite deep enough. When I can't remember if I have already prepped the primer pocket I check it with a primer pocket swage gauge from UniqueTek. Quick and easy to use.
    http://www.uniquetek.com/product/T1521

  12. #12
    Boolit Master oldhenry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Albany, GA
    Posts
    911
    Thanks for all responses.
    The caliber that I'm currently loading is .45 Colt. The 1st batch involved Winchester & WW cases that have many firings, so I attributed the problem to the brass. I then loaded about 200 un-plated Star Line cases with intermittent issues. I'm now into Star Line plated cases & intermittent problems surfaces again. These cases have no more than 2-3 firings with low pressure loads.
    The priming seems to require too much effort & I can't feel it bottom. I used my Sinclair PP uniformer sparingly (it's for LR) & no problem with it entering the pocket.
    I've double checked the container & it's clearly marked to be pistol primers (I suspected rifle primers).
    I'm priming on the Dillon 550. I have a RCBS bench mounted priming tool......I'll see if it has the same problem.
    Once again, thanks for the input.
    Henry

    P.S. All of these cases were de-primed, wet tumbled, then CC tumbled & each flash hole cleared individually before loading. Those that had any residue in pocket were cleaned with my Herters primer pocket cleaner (a great tool).
    Last edited by oldhenry; 08-17-2017 at 10:47 AM.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    MN
    Posts
    707
    WLP is all I use in pistol cases that take a large primer and never had a problem seating one.

  14. #14
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    Quote Originally Posted by oldhenry View Post
    Thanks for all responses.
    The caliber that I'm currently loading is .45 Colt. The 1st batch involved Winchester & WW cases that have many firings, so I attributed the problem to the brass. I then loaded about 200 un-plated Star Line cases with intermittent issues. I'm now into Star Line plated cases & intermittent problems surfaces again. These cases have no more than 2-3 firings with low pressure loads.
    The priming seems to require too much effort & I can't feel it bottom. I used my Sinclair PP uniformer sparingly (it's for LR) & no problem with it entering the pocket.
    I've double checked the container & it's clearly marked to be pistol primers (I suspected rifle primers).
    I'm priming on the Dillon 550. I have a RCBS bench mounted priming tool......I'll see if it has the same problem.
    Once again, thanks for the input.
    Henry

    P.S. All of these cases were de-primed, wet tumbled, then CC tumbled & each flash hole cleared individually before loading. Those that had any residue in pocket were cleaned with my Herters primer pocket cleaner (a great tool).
    It's starting to look like something is amiss on the Dillon...
    The only brass problem I've had recently is oversize diameter rims on Win. .45 Colt.
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  15. #15
    Boolit Master Gtrubicon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Northern ca
    Posts
    545
    I have problems with Winchester 45 colt and 454 casual brass, no matter what brand primers. I use an rcbs hand held priming tool, have also used a lee hand held. I think they are very tight primer pockets for those two calibers. I've tried many different brand primers but still come to the same conclusion. I have never had any issues with starline or rp brass for 45 colt.

  16. #16
    Boolit Grand Master
    9.3X62AL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Redlands, NorKifornia
    Posts
    11,551
    Winchester brass has had a reputation for over-tight primer pockets in a few calibers for me over the years. 9mm Luger has been the worst for me--no matter what make of primer, the things resist seating. I got the 9mm brass for free, and after all manner of gymnastics to remedy the matter I gave up--concluded that the W-W brass was priced correctly (worthless)--and bought R-P brass for the caliber. It processes wonderfully.

    W-W and CCI primers are far easier to find locally than are other makes. They make up 80% of my primer usage, and Federal #215s and Remington #6-1/2 take up the slack for a couple given applications. Primer seating issues seldom crop up for me, and I don't suffer them gladly. After 150+ years of cartridge tech, this is a thing that the makers need to get right. Starline brass has been utterly trouble-free in this venue (and others). SL is slowly taking over my cartridge inventory--it is much better stuff.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  17. #17
    Moderator Emeritus

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    7,620
    Henry, FWIW, here's a "me too" for those who don't have problems with seating WW primers, and I've used an awful lot of them. They've long been the most common primers available locally, plus some CCI's. Federals have only had sporadic availability here. And I've always found that any problem seating primers was "user error," and indeed, there's been some of that. Most military brass has a crimp that MUST be removed before being able to seat primers without undue problems. This only takes a one-time treatment with one of the primer pocket REAMERS that are commonly available and not very expensive at all. These cut the primer pocket to uniform dimensions, but again, cutting ANYTHING with ANY sort of cutter inevitably must rely on the user's skill, sense of "feel," and attention to detail. Nothing with any cutting tools is "fool proof."

    As someone noted above, we live in a world today of instant gratification and having most things done FOR us rather than BY us. This makes all of us who reload kind'a "special," at least in a way. But everyone who reloads has a learning curve to go through, and those who are in too big a hurry often find it's a frustrating experience. But it really doesn't need to be. Just approach it from the perspective that OS OK does - as a craft and a pleasurable and very interesting and crafty hobby/past time, and you'll begin to really enjoy it a LOT more. A WHOLE lot more!

    To seat well, the primers MUST be aligned pretty well square with the primer pockets. This way, they're aligned together, and much less force is needed to seat them, and loading also goes significantly faster. Reloading is a repetitive pursuit, and once you've learned the process, by simply paying better attention to the details, it's likely that your primer seating will go MUCH faster and more pleasurably. It worked that way for me. It's been 55 years since I reloaded my first cartridge, and I'm STILL learning. And I've found no better place to learn stuff than this board.

    Reloading is a process that we have to learn, because it will NOT ... not ever .... work the way we WANT it to just because we want it to. We have to learn to pay attention, focus and do things repetitively the way they tend to work best. That brings satisfaction and much pleasure. When you pay attention and focus, and don't discount the "little things," it's really amazing how much faster and better things go at the reloading bench. I know. That's how I learned, and I suspect most all of have learned. So relax and ENJOY your time at the bench, and it'll turn into something enjoyable instead of just another chore that HAS to be done to shoot more. Whatever problem you run into will have a logical and almost always pretty simple solution. it's just a matter of understanding what we're doing, as we do it, and putting our minds to the task at hand, and not on other stuff that happened that day. Letting one's mind drift is a good way to potentially blow up a gun or do something you won't like very much! Relax and enjoy, and the whole pursuit changes its whole nature for you.

  18. #18
    Boolit Buddy
    CASTER OF LEAD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    WEST ARKANSAS
    Posts
    335
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackwater View Post
    Henry, FWIW, here's a "me too" for those who don't have problems with seating WW primers, and I've used an awful lot of them. They've long been the most common primers available locally, plus some CCI's. Federals have only had sporadic availability here. And I've always found that any problem seating primers was "user error," and indeed, there's been some of that. Most military brass has a crimp that MUST be removed before being able to seat primers without undue problems. This only takes a one-time treatment with one of the primer pocket REAMERS that are commonly available and not very expensive at all. These cut the primer pocket to uniform dimensions, but again, cutting ANYTHING with ANY sort of cutter inevitably must rely on the user's skill, sense of "feel," and attention to detail. Nothing with any cutting tools is "fool proof."

    As someone noted above, we live in a world today of instant gratification and having most things done FOR us rather than BY us. This makes all of us who reload kind'a "special," at least in a way. But everyone who reloads has a learning curve to go through, and those who are in too big a hurry often find it's a frustrating experience. But it really doesn't need to be. Just approach it from the perspective that OS OK does - as a craft and a pleasurable and very interesting and crafty hobby/past time, and you'll begin to really enjoy it a LOT more. A WHOLE lot more!

    To seat well, the primers MUST be aligned pretty well square with the primer pockets. This way, they're aligned together, and much less force is needed to seat them, and loading also goes significantly faster. Reloading is a repetitive pursuit, and once you've learned the process, by simply paying better attention to the details, it's likely that your primer seating will go MUCH faster and more pleasurably. It worked that way for me. It's been 55 years since I reloaded my first cartridge, and I'm STILL learning. And I've found no better place to learn stuff than this board.

    Reloading is a process that we have to learn, because it will NOT ... not ever .... work the way we WANT it to just because we want it to. We have to learn to pay attention, focus and do things repetitively the way they tend to work best. That brings satisfaction and much pleasure. When you pay attention and focus, and don't discount the "little things," it's really amazing how much faster and better things go at the reloading bench. I know. That's how I learned, and I suspect most all of have learned. So relax and ENJOY your time at the bench, and it'll turn into something enjoyable instead of just another chore that HAS to be done to shoot more. Whatever problem you run into will have a logical and almost always pretty simple solution. it's just a matter of understanding what we're doing, as we do it, and putting our minds to the task at hand, and not on other stuff that happened that day. Letting one's mind drift is a good way to potentially blow up a gun or do something you won't like very much! Relax and enjoy, and the whole pursuit changes its whole nature for you.
    Very well stayed Blackwater. Reloading for me is very therapeutic indeed. Attention to details is critical and if ignored can have catastrophic consequences. I have been reloading for 30+ years and am really just starting see just how much I Still Have to learn. - CASTER
    In regards to shooting safety.Until you are ready to fire, keep your booger hook off the bang switch.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master oldhenry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Albany, GA
    Posts
    911
    The original question was to find out if anyone was having problems seating Winchester LP primers & I should have added: "lately". I started reloading in 1960 & I enjoy reloading. I also cast my 1st. bullet in '60. All of that initial loading was on a SS press until RCBS introduced the Green Machine & I gave up on making it work.......and a few others gave up also (including RCBS). The Dillon 450 was the 1st. progressive machine that I used that actually worked........a friend bought it & asked me to teach him how to operate it. I bought the 550 in the '80s & have had very few problems.

    On my SS (Redding Ultra mag) I've loaded tight neck 1000 yd. loads to pistol cartridges & have never had any problems with Winchester primers (or any other primers)........other than primer pockets getting loose (particularly on Winchester brass) on .223s when I was shooting XTC (no problem with LC). Recently I bought a sleeve of Winchester LP & SP primers & have no problems with the SPs. Recently I loaded about 500 .45ACPs & had a few issues seating primers, but the brass had many firings & I didn't blame the primers. I already told the background on the recent problems with the .45 Colt loading. The reason I posed the question is simply that I've never experienced the problem before especially with SL brass.

    Following my original posting I did a lube job on the 550 & cleaned the priming mechanism with a tooth brush lubing the priming assy. with graphite only. I also mounted my RCBS bench type priming tool alongside the 550. For the 1st 25 or so there were absolutely no primer seating problems & I thought the cleaning/lube job solved the problem. I then encountered 4 in the next 75 or so that the Dillon was unable to seat. Two of these I was able to remove from the 550 & seat on the RCBS: but........the RCBS required unusual pressure to seat. The other 2 were so high that I could not remove them from the 550 & were de-primed (not re-used). Of these 2, one was re-primed on the 550 with heavy pressure & the other was de-primed again & primed on the RCBS with normal pressure (a different primer).

    Then I had one (other than the 4 above) that the 550 could not seat, but I was able to remove the case from the 550 & the RCBS couldn't seat it either (important part).The case was de-primed on the 550 and the next primer out of the tube primed on the 550 with normal pressure & I could feel the primer seat perfectly. This tells my 78 yr. old brain that something was not right with that primer & the other few that even the RCBS tool required extra pressure to seat.

    Probably of no consequence, but offered as information: The spring on the SP priming mechanism is not nearly as strong as the LP & I plan to reduce that spring pressure to see if that change will give me a better feel for the seating.

    Respectfully submitted,
    Henry
    Last edited by oldhenry; 08-17-2017 at 08:14 PM.

  20. #20
    Boolit Grand Master

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    England,Ar
    Posts
    7,693
    I just seated over 2K worth, in various headstamp 44 mag cases. No real problems, just a few that were tighter or looser than what I call normal. I expect it was the mismatched cases. This 5K lot came up in my normal rotation, having bought them before the 2007-2008 shortages. I'm not a Winchester fan, preferring CCI but I have no complaints yet. Now, if they all fire?

Page 1 of 6 123456 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check