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Thread: Do you fully agree with your church's doctrine?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

    Ickisrulz's Avatar
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    Do you fully agree with your church's doctrine?

    Do you fully agree with your church's doctrine? Do you feel it is wrong to question what you have been taught? If so why? If not, what do you disagree with and why? I am just curious.

    I was raised in a United Methodist church but eventually gravitated to Assemblies of God. I have a couple areas of disagreement when it comes to A/G doctrine. I have arrived at these disagreements through personal study. I believe doctrine is a starting point, but that every believer should investigate to see if they come to the same conclusions.

    1. I am not thoroughly convinced that the coming of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost was separate from being "Born Again" (this idea is unique to Pentecostals). But I am not convinced that it was not (most other denominations teach this). I remain neutral on the issue and don't get worked up about it.

    2. I lean toward annihilation of the wicked rather than an eternal conscious punishment. This is a very big issue with lots of ramifications.

    3. I don't believe a divorced person is ineligible for a church leadership role. The Assemblies will not, in most cases, ordain a divorced person. Of course a former drug dealer, etc. is eligible. This just doesn't pass the common sense test, nor does this idea stand up to proper biblical interpretation.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    I was brought up Catholic and by time I was old enough to think for myself I gravitated to Baptist. I can't see the priest telling me to pray to Joseph, and if I got no results to pray to Mary to get her son in line to answer my prayers. Plus some of the other beliefs I just can't swallow.

    That's not to say that I believe everything the Baptists believe. I actually went to Independent Baptist. I have had issues with their strict dress code, such as a female must wear an ankle length dress. Never pants. HOWEVER, they can wear coulottes, which are billowing pants that look like a dress. I'm one of those people who think it is one way or the other, if that is your doctrine. Little things, I know, but please don't tell me one thing and you do another and look down on me. It also has the theory that a divorced person cannot hold any office in the church, nor will the pastor marry a couple who was previously divorced, but will happily marry a couple who had a child out of wedlock. And former drunks and drug addicts, and people of dubious character can easily become a pastor.

    The church Lori and I go to now is a pretty huge church, Cascade Hills in Columbus, Georgia. The pastor's son has been taking over since his father's health is not what it was, but the messages are great. They even broadcast on the web. I really don't like the modern music, having been a choir director and song leader in another church, and liking the old hymns. But no, I don't believe we are all going to die and go to hell because Tom doesn't like that style music.

    I really don't think that anyone likes everything about their Church, unless they have drunk the koolaid......

    Ok flame on, but be polite and respectful.
    Tom
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  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Do you fully agree with your church's doctrine?
    I do indeed, I will offer my opinions on your questions, you can accept them, or reject them as you chose, without discussion.

    1. The Holy Spirit manifestation of Pentecost was indeed a different matter, The confusion, if there is any comes from the mistaken notion of being born again, as opposed to being born from above. A short summation, when our fathers sperm enters our mothers egg and a new creature is formed, our spirit is sent by God from heaven to reside in that creature, hence, we are born from above. All, must be born from above to be born of the flesh to die once. The exceptions would be the angels of Jude 1:6 who decided to thumb their noses at God and earned a death sentence for refusing to stay in their first estate.

    Jud 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

    2.The final end of those who refuse to believe, is indeed complete annihilation, the punishment being eternal, the punishing being swift and final. Rev. 20 will cover it pretty well, and one must understand "Blotted out" and what it means, totally erased from time, for and aft, as though it never existed. So when one is blotted out from the book of life, they cease to be, they cease to have been, there is no memory of them to cause pain and suffering to those who remain. Rev 21:4

    3.In short, If God forgives our trespasses, and makes us new again, and remembers the sin no more, why do people think they are somehow better than God and refuse to forgive the divorcee and let them move on with their lives. Perhaps hypocrisy, perhaps ignorance, perhaps the inability to throw out the old leaven and move into the light.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    No sir I don't not somuch as to make any diferance.
    when the dust settles and the smoke clears all that matters is I hear the words " well done my good and faithfully servant "

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  5. #5
    Boolit Master

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    I go to a nondenominational church that doesn't lord over the parishioners with an iron fist.
    Our pastor teaches Bible doctrine and has said that if you are truly saved and follow Jesus and seek to please Him there is no need to be held captive by church doctrine, which has little or no real value as to your salvation.
    Political correctness is a national suicide pact.

    I am a sovereign individual, accountable
    only to God and my own conscience.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    I do agree with your assessment!
    Tom
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  7. #7
    No...Here's why....I refuse to sit through a sermon and I am told what bad person I am.....then the plate comes around. Also I refuse to buy into an organization that almost all of the worlds wars have been fought over. In other words...if religion was so darn peaceful then why are wars fought over them? In a room full men declaring righteousness by any name who is right? It's the guy that could careless and yes that is an empty church as my avatar.
    They call it "common sense". Why is it so uncommon?

  8. #8
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by TES View Post
    No...Here's why....I refuse to sit through a sermon and I am told what bad person I am.....then the plate comes around. Also I refuse to buy into an organization that almost all of the worlds wars have been fought over. In other words...if religion was so darn peaceful then why are wars fought over them? In a room full men declaring righteousness by any name who is right? It's the guy that could careless and yes that is an empty church as my avatar.
    So the doctrine of your church is?:

    1. All members are bad people
    2. All members must give an offering
    3. Members must advocate for war

    Sounds like some very weird doctrine.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Oh, I disagree in part or in whole with my church and every other Christian denomination known to man. I look to a local congregation for compatible people and a valid worship experience. I expect to find people in said congregation with whom I disagree, plus I don't give a hoot what the pastor/priest thinks on any subject under the sun. I don't not need one of those people to tell me what the truth is or to "minister" to me in any way.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master




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    No, I have never attended a church whose doctrine I completely agree with.

    1. I agree with your thoughts and conclusion - not an issue that will make any difference in eternity.

    2. You may or may not remember but I came to the same conclusion after a brief exchange with you and some searching of Scriptures.

    3. I do think that divorce of a Christian (except for abandonment) can preclude SOME leadership roles but certainly not all and certainly should be determined on a case by case basis. A very rare example from a church we attended; senior pastor married with children and pregnant wife of 7 months. He is arrested for soliciting a male prostitute and subsequently is divorced. In my mind he is no longer eligible to serve in any leadership role. We attended a very large AG church (though they advertised as a non-denominational, which bothered me but not enough to keep us from attending) who asked me to consider being on the counsel. I had previously served as a bi-vocational associate pastor of a very small church. Once I told them I had been married and divorced as a non believer 30 years or so prior, the offer was rescinded. In my case, no harm, no foul but they had a pastor on staff who had been married and divorced as a believer and pastor. And as your example points out common sense is not always applied either.

    Knowing I will never attend a church I fully agree with, it is up to me to find a church that I mostly agree with and who in my studied opinion does not cross the line biblically on those topics I disagree with.
    Last edited by Bzcraig; 08-15-2017 at 12:05 AM.
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  11. #11
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    Southern Baptist
    Pretty much OK with it
    Have been in many different churches
    From Roman Catholic to Dutch Reform to Pentecostal to non-denominational
    I like the fact that the Southern Baptists make every church body independent
    They make recommendations
    We do as we will
    Wife and I became members a few weeks ago

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    So the doctrine of your church is?:

    1. All members are bad people...(your a sinner)
    2. All members must give an offering....(yea they do pass a plate)
    3. Members must advocate for war.....(History proves that most wars were fought over religion.)

    Sounds like some very weird doctrine.
    I agree.
    They call it "common sense". Why is it so uncommon?

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    I have found NO assembly that has a doctrine I completely agree with. I believe every assembly should be autonomous from another, and the assemblies that bear the name of where I attend does.
    One of the things that has always baffled me about our sins is this, either there forgiven and remembered no more, or there not! Yet ALL assemblys use past sins to determine ones worthiness to serve?

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    Each one of us has the free will to associate with any church of our choosing. And that church is the bride of Christ. It is not ours to reconcile the church to which we commit ourselves but to be reconciled to His bride. Choose as lead by the Spirit. Defend His bride, honor and support her, pray for her, love her, use the gifts God has given you to sustain her and be blessed in the doing. Grieve not the Spirit in condemning her. Please take this post as a confession for the stinking thinking that sometimes ensnares me. Forgive me Lord. Create in me a clean heart this morning, and renew in me a steadfast spirit.
    "My main ambition in life is to be on the devil's most wanted list."
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  15. #15
    Boolit Man
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    A most interesting thread for this here atheist/agnostic. I am probably not in a position to comment on the religious aspects, although I could, but there is one statement I have to object to. Most wars were not fought over religion, even if the participants said so. Religion, when used as a reason is in fact an excuse. War is about power and control every time. A war with an outside enemy unites the home front, allows a leader's power to grow for the necessity of the war, and to exercise power over both his own subjects and those he conquers. The appeal to religion, when it is used, merely serves to encourage the sheep to follow.

    By way of example, the British experience with Romans -v- Protestants. Initiated by Henry VIII who wanted a divorce that the Pope wouldn't grant, but also the money that the monasteries would provide when he took over. Most of the fighting over the reigns of monarchs that followed and the many atrocities were done in the name of God, but it was power that was the cause.

    In both world wars, churches everywhere in the allied side had their congregations praying for victory. On the belt buckle of every German soldier there was framed "Gott Mit Uns." Go figure. There is much evil in this world to be blamed on religion in general, but wars are not a major part of it.
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    The left, communists, socialists, fascists killed far more than any religion.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKShootist View Post
    A most interesting thread for this here atheist/agnostic. I am probably not in a position to comment on the religious aspects, although I could, but there is one statement I have to object to. Most wars were not fought over religion, even if the participants said so. Religion, when used as a reason is in fact an excuse. War is about power and control every time. A war with an outside enemy unites the home front, allows a leader's power to grow for the necessity of the war, and to exercise power over both his own subjects and those he conquers. The appeal to religion, when it is used, merely serves to encourage the sheep to follow.

    By way of example, the British experience with Romans -v- Protestants. Initiated by Henry VIII who wanted a divorce that the Pope wouldn't grant, but also the money that the monasteries would provide when he took over. Most of the fighting over the reigns of monarchs that followed and the many atrocities were done in the name of God, but it was power that was the cause.

    In both world wars, churches everywhere in the allied side had their congregations praying for victory. On the belt buckle of every German soldier there was framed "Gott Mit Uns." Go figure. There is much evil in this world to be blamed on religion in general, but wars are not a major part of it.
    All evil in this world can be laid at the feet of sinful human nature. Every human institution and ideology has been shot through with this since the beginning of the human race. Atheists and every other "ist" and "ism" like to point to their least favorite human endeavor as being "evil". In part their are correct but in the main they are wrong and miss the big point.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master pmer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ickisrulz View Post
    Do you fully agree with your church's doctrine? Do you feel it is wrong to question what you have been taught? If so why? If not, what do you disagree with and why? I am just curious.

    I was raised in a United Methodist church but eventually gravitated to Assemblies of God. I have a couple areas of disagreement when it comes to A/G doctrine. I have arrived at these disagreements through personal study. I believe doctrine is a starting point, but that every believer should investigate to see if they come to the same conclusions.

    1. I am not thoroughly convinced that the coming of the Holy Spirit on Pentecost was separate from being "Born Again" (this idea is unique to Pentecostals). But I am not convinced that it was not (most other denominations teach this). I remain neutral on the issue and don't get worked up about it.

    2. I lean toward annihilation of the wicked rather than an eternal conscious punishment. This is a very big issue with lots of ramifications.

    3. I don't believe a divorced person is ineligible for a church leadership role. The Assemblies will not, in most cases, ordain a divorced person. Of course a former drug dealer, etc. is eligible. This just doesn't pass the common sense test, nor does this idea stand up to proper biblical interpretation.
    I think it's good to aware of church doctrine. Questioning doctrine was what really got me started in reading the bible. My thought was; "I think something isn't right but how can I be sure if don't get my nose in a bible to prove it". Many of Paul's letters are on building a healthy church and using correct doctrine. In Timothy, Paul, laid out characteristics of good leadership and how to handle the everyday squabbles of human interaction.
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  19. #19
    Boolit Man Markopolo's Avatar
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    I personally disagree with some or lots of somethings said in every church I have ever attended. I especially disagree with lots of the teachings in my tiny church where I live. I test everything by the word of Christ, through my personal relationship and the spirit. Because it is the only church within several hours journey, I attend, and do not cause strife. I believe in unity. I believe that we should not forsake the gathering of the body of Christ. Even though I don't agree with everything, I still am able to gleen spiritual food. It might be a diet of milk, but I get the meat I need through my study of the word, and personal relationship with Him. If anything, the disagreements fuel my own study of the truth. It is not my place to demand we all think alike, but my place to love !!!

    Blessings..

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  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    Nicely put Marko.
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