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Thread: 9mm leading at muzzle Hi-Tek coated.

  1. #1
    Boolit Master




    TexasGrunt's Avatar
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    9mm leading at muzzle Hi-Tek coated.

    Ok, here's what's happened.

    A buddy picked up some Hi-Tek coated 9mm bullets that were sized to .358. Loaded them to a middle of the road load and shot them through a Springfield XD. The last inch or so of the barrel leaded really bad. Rest of the bore was clean.

    Coating passed all the tests.

    Where did we go wrong with this?

    I've shot the same alloy, 50/50 pure/COWW, through my 10mm pistols hat higher velocities, with the same batch of Hi-Tek and had no leading.

    It seems from what I've read here that the 9mm seems to be the problem child when it comes to leading.

    He picked up some more of the same bullets yesterday, he's going to load them in .357 and see if they lead there. The bullet is the Lee 358-125 RF.

    Another strange data point, those bullets where shooting high and to the right for him. He's a great shooter and at 15 yards these loads were shooting 3-4" to the right and 4-5" high. He bought the target to the house to show me.
    Semper Fi!


    Currently casting for .223, .308, .30-06, .30-40 Krag, 9mm, .38/.357, 10mm, 44 Mag and 45 ACP.

    I like strange looking boolits!

    NRA Patriot Life Endowment member.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master



    jmort's Avatar
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    There have been similar posts/threads on this issue. Use PC and problem will go away it seems.
    "Had his shooting been as good as his running, he might have given a better account of himself."
    James. C. Henderson

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
    Ausglock's Avatar
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    That bullet has never worked for me. Very small bearing surface.
    I tried it in 9mm, 38Super, 357Sig, 38Spl... none worked. leading and poor accuracy.
    It is a dog of a bullet.
    Hooroo.
    Regards, Trevor.
    Australia

  4. #4
    Boolit Master Grmps's Avatar
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    Try drilling out the lube and crimp groove and see if it behaves better

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    This goes to my initial impression that Hi-Tek bullets would be better served if they were No Lube Groove bullets. As my favorite mold maker, Magma, is now offering almost all their bullets in NLG I feel like I have great chance of success using Hi-Tek.
    The good thing about science is that it's true no matter if you believe it or not. (Neil DeGrasse Tyson)

    I was scolding my 5-year old for her and her friends making a giant mess in her room. She said they all did it. So I asked her: If all her friends jumped off a cliff, would she do it too? She said, "Oh no daddy! I would go to the bottom and try to catch them! They're my friends." Man, either I have a great kid or she has a stupid father.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master HI-TEK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmort View Post
    There have been similar posts/threads on this issue. Use PC and problem will go away it seems.
    jmort,
    Interesting comment.
    I find it difficult to accept that by coating that bullet with Powder coating will eliminate the Leading.
    I have to presume that the powder coating can't correct the very small bearing area of that specific projectile, unless the powder coating is so thick that it fills in the lube grooves..
    It is difficult to accept that any lube/coating can correct poor engineering or design.
    Sorry, but I remain a sceptic at this stage.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

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    I use the Lee 358-125-RF sized .357 for my 9's and .359 for my 38/357's. I PC some and Hi-Tek (original swamp green, and some red copper) others. Both shoot great, and no leading in any of my guns. I am using Herco powder for most of my loads.
    There is no difference between communism and socialism, except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism proposes to enslave men by force, socialismóby vote. It is merely the difference between murder and suicide. Ayn Rand

  8. #8
    Boolit Master



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    Quote Originally Posted by HI-TEK View Post
    jmort,
    Interesting comment.
    I find it difficult to accept that by coating that bullet with Powder coating will eliminate the Leading.
    I have to presume that the powder coating can't correct the very small bearing area of that specific projectile, unless the powder coating is so thick that it fills in the lube grooves..
    It is difficult to accept that any lube/coating can correct poor engineering or design.
    Sorry, but I remain a sceptic at this stage.
    If you follow the posts and threads you will see over and over where PC= no lead in exact situation where Hi Tek failed. You don't have to get you panties twisted, just what I am reading. Comp guns are a great example, Hi Tek = failure where no problem with PC. You have many adherents so be greatful. Why not support this site rather than taking a free ride ?
    "Had his shooting been as good as his running, he might have given a better account of himself."
    James. C. Henderson

  9. #9
    I'm A Honcho!

    Rattlesnake Charlie's Avatar
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    I use that bullet in both 9mm and .38 spl sized to .358 and lubed with Lo-Tack. No leading, even out of my rifle. I've not tried Hi Tek or PC.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master



    WebMonkey's Avatar
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    I PC that bullet in a glock 26 and a 1911.
    No leading.
    WebMonkey
    Retired 19D
    Psalm 91:9
    Honda 919

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
    DerekP Houston's Avatar
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    I had similar issues with hi-tek and my 9mm, works great for everything else. My solution was to take the hi-tek 9mm rounds and coat them again with a layer of BLL. Was able to use them up with no further issues.

    I thought Hitek was a VS here....
    My feedback page if you feel inclined to add:
    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...raight-Shooter

    Thanks Yall!

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
    Ausglock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmort View Post
    Comp guns are a great example, Hi Tek = failure where no problem with PC.
    Do you mean Compensated guns?

    Almost all Open division IPSC guns here in OZ run HITEK coated bullets at Major power factor with very little leading in the comp.
    I have STI Trubor, SJC comped Glock17 and zero leading in them after many rounds. I run the Magma 125gn Conical bullet that has a lube groove.
    Hooroo.
    Regards, Trevor.
    Australia

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    So what are we saying about that bullet? What exactly is the reason it sux using Hi-Tek? Is it the small bearing surface?
    The good thing about science is that it's true no matter if you believe it or not. (Neil DeGrasse Tyson)

    I was scolding my 5-year old for her and her friends making a giant mess in her room. She said they all did it. So I asked her: If all her friends jumped off a cliff, would she do it too? She said, "Oh no daddy! I would go to the bottom and try to catch them! They're my friends." Man, either I have a great kid or she has a stupid father.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master popper's Avatar
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    Texas - normal 9mm loading problems, expander, FCD, alloy, etc. I use HiTek for my XDs 9, no problem but I use a hard alloy & not a hot load. My mould is a 35-135C from accurate, very similar shape but no crimp and very shallow LG,BB works fine. Your buddies supplier may also be the problem. I was gifted some 'Blue' coated bullets a while back and all they did was lead my XD40. Yes, POI changes with bad coating and leading.
    Whatever!

  15. #15
    Boolit Master




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    They are boolits I cast and coated.

    Went to the range with him today to just get out of the house. Didn't do any shooting. I just sat there and loaded mags for him.

    The 9mm is leading like crazy. The 10mm stuff that's being driven harder is clean as can be. Same alloy, same coating.

    When I start feeling human again I'll try and figure out why this is happening. I'll try some different 9mm boolits and see if that makes a difference.
    Semper Fi!


    Currently casting for .223, .308, .30-06, .30-40 Krag, 9mm, .38/.357, 10mm, 44 Mag and 45 ACP.

    I like strange looking boolits!

    NRA Patriot Life Endowment member.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master rsrocket1's Avatar
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    I just got an XD9 4" service this past month. First few trips I shot 200 rounds each time with the Lee 356-120-TC powder coated with HF red and sized to 0.356" seated to 1.05" COL. No Lee FCD, just a Lee taper crimp die in the last station to close the flare. 5.0g BE-86, ave 1200 fps. My bullets are made with reclaimed lead shot from a shotgun range. Sometimes I throw in a few feet of surplus electrical rosin core solder, sometimes not.

    No leading, just soot that cleaned out with a wadded up paper towel.

    At 10 yards I have to line up the dots with the center dot covering the bullseye, otherwise it shoots low.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    I am also fighting to get cast to work in a 9mm (Glock 17).

    The 125 Lee RNFP is one of my "problem" boolits. I was able to fix the leading with a combination of an after market barrel and PC. However, these boolits are leaving lead shavings at the front of the chamber (unacceptable).

    I am also having problems with my lee PC coated 110 RNs sized at 0.3563". They do not shave, but are still leading. I have some ready to try with bigger sizes and I have a batch with BLL on top of PC. I included more details at:

    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...18-9mm-leading

  18. #18
    Boolit Bub
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    I got 9mm to work with titegroup & Smoke 4320's PC. I used the #5 tub shake method. The same bullet was leading & tumbling with Hitek.

  19. #19
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    I have never pc'd one but the Lee 125 runs great at 1900 fps in my Rossi 92 with conventional lube [mml+soap]. It has plenty of bearing surface with a standard lube.
    [The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    Have you tried making up a handful of dummy rounds, then pulling the bullet and measuring the diameter of the base? The 9mm brass may well be swaging the bullet diameter down to below the bore diameter.

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