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Thread: Cutting a Patch at Muzzle's End

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    Cutting a Patch at Muzzle's End

    Been using Oxyoke .010 pre-lubed pre-cut patchs for many years with .445 ball pressed into a small bread board I carry in my Day bag.

    Recently I acquired a rather large piece of new non-dyed tightly woven cotton cloth that mic's to what the store bought Ox-Yoke patch measures. i.e.(.010 thick)_ My intention is to tear this 3 yard piece of cotton cloth into strips so to cut my patches at muzzle end in hopes to achieve a little better accuracy and cure that misaligned patch to ball disappointment I sometimes see after the short starters nub use.

    My question?

    1._Does anyone know of a {unscented B/P lube} that could be used as a pre-soak for cloth strips?

    My thinking is to eliminate that typical patch lube smearing in the open air practice.
    As we all know most B/P lubes wreak of wintergreen which assuredly permeates the air and alerts everything wild to my or anyone's presents for at least a 40 acre distance.________________ (1/4 mile for u's city raised fellers)

    Anywho. Thanks for stopping in to read my Thread and too {if wanting} leaving a comment.
    "JUST A OLD DEPLORABLE THAT'S IRREDEEMABLE."

  2. #2
    Boolit Master

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    I would suggest cutting the cloth rather than tearing it. you will get straighter cuts and nicer edges. As to lube One of the homemade versions allows you to add what you want and adjust for the thickness viscosity you want. Emmerts lube or the improved version might do what you want but would have to be worked into the strips while hot and liquid. Its a good BP lube and does well in the BP cartridge guns.
    The recipe for emmerts is 50% beeswax, 40 unsalted Crisco, 10% olive or canola oil The improved version cuts the oil to 5% and adds 5% anhydrous lanolin. For patches you might go 40%beeswax 50% Crisco and 10 olive or canola oil or the 5% oil and 5% lanolin for a softer lube. Melt ingrediants together in a double boiler and mix well. add strips into it and let "cook for 10-15 minutes, this gets the strips hot helping the lube penetrate thru and also helps allow the excess to run off better.
    If you cut your strips wide enough to leave an small piece all around the strip when seated with short starter then it stay in the strip with one side unused the other with the holes . This saves having to pick up what normally drops off.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master swamp's Avatar
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    I use tallow/beeswax or olive oil/beeswax. I get it liquid and soak the patch strip. squeegee off excess and hang to dry.
    swamp
    There is no problem so great, that it cannot be solved by the proper application of high explosives.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    whne i was cutting at the muzzle i was spit patching. now that i went back to precutting my patches i still spit patch. just have plenty of water to drink at the bench. in the field a cap tin with patches in and a dab of crisco.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master pietro's Avatar
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    .

    I don't cut my patches @ the muzzle - which was a necessity for frontiersmen, who wanted to K.I.S.S. and just grab a ball from a belt pouch.

    Since I'm a far cry (too fat & lazy) from being a solitary frontiersman, I carry/use a loading block.

    I pre-lube my patches with ordinary Crisco cooking lard (available at any good grocery store), then pre-load the PRB's in a loading block after first squeezing out any excess, as posted above.

    I found that it's OK to use a patch large enough to gather a bit around the frontal area of the ball, to avoid mis-aligned patches.





    The face of the loading block that lies on the muzzle is recessed for the muzzle - to get the ball alignment as straight as possible w/o a straight-line starter.






    .
    Last edited by pietro; 07-09-2017 at 05:40 PM.
    Experience is a wonderful thing - It lets you recognize a mistake, when you make it again.

  6. #6
    Moderator Emeritus / Trusted loob groove dealer


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    Even if the patch isn't perfectly centered, as long as the patch is between the ball and the bore, they all work the same.
    The solid soft lead bullet is undoubtably the best and most satisfactory expanding bullet that has ever been designed. It invariably mushrooms perfectly, and never breaks up. With the metal base that is essential for velocities of 2000 f.s. and upwards to protect the naked base, these metal-based soft lead bullets are splendid.
    John Taylor - "African Rifles and Cartridges"

    Forget everything you know about loading jacketed bullets. This is a whole new ball game!


  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by waksupi View Post
    Even if the patch isn't perfectly centered, as long as the patch is between the ball and the bore, they all work the same.
    That is defiantly NOT the experience I had with switching from pre cut to bulk patch. That, or the old timers were just lying and I believed them!! Loading "any old way" with a bp rifle doesn't give the same results no matter what . . . unless the shooter (or rifle) is bad enough that no amount of consistency will help lol!!!

    Just my experience . . .

    Mike
    www.goonsgunworks.com
    Follow me on Instagram @ goonsgunworks

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    pietro
    My loading board does not have those nicely {centered} mortised recessed guides. Going to look unto drilling mine if there's room? if not___I'll make myself a new loading board similar to the one pictured.

    Appreciate the up-loading of your pix/s.


    As far as patch lube recipes I have to be carefull in its making as I hunt in extrem cold weather temperatures. Not all B/P patching lubes remain pliable in the cold and some downright turn as hard as rock .
    "JUST A OLD DEPLORABLE THAT'S IRREDEEMABLE."

  9. #9
    Moderator Emeritus / Trusted loob groove dealer


    waksupi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 45 Dragoon View Post
    That is defiantly NOT the experience I had with switching from pre cut to bulk patch. That, or the old timers were just lying and I believed them!! Loading "any old way" with a bp rifle doesn't give the same results no matter what . . . unless the shooter (or rifle) is bad enough that no amount of consistency will help lol!!!

    Just my experience . . .

    Mike
    www.goonsgunworks.com
    Follow me on Instagram @ goonsgunworks
    Since I've won three world championships, I'll stick with what I do.
    The solid soft lead bullet is undoubtably the best and most satisfactory expanding bullet that has ever been designed. It invariably mushrooms perfectly, and never breaks up. With the metal base that is essential for velocities of 2000 f.s. and upwards to protect the naked base, these metal-based soft lead bullets are splendid.
    John Taylor - "African Rifles and Cartridges"

    Forget everything you know about loading jacketed bullets. This is a whole new ball game!


  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    It is hard, very hard to argue with a shooter who has won championships! I figure a lot of that is in the shooter's skill AND finding what works well and then being comfortable with it. I talked with local shooters in the San Diego area who have won many matches, national medals and so on and most all use pillow ticking and SPIT on the patch for a lube. They put it on their tongue when loading powder and when ready to put in the ball, the patch is ready. Granted, two of these are musket shooters and their rifles are original ones pre civil war. Two others wipe between shots when shooting from a bench and when on a "woods walk" have a rifle with a barrel that does not need wiping. In all cases they still use spit. I have switched to that and I found it also keeps me drinking plenty of water which actually has made me feel better. We do have two shooters in our monthly matches that use the loading blocks and they also pre load powder into small vials but so far their results are not spectacular but they are happy and that is what counts!

    One additional thing to mention, when I bought a rifle made by Roger Johnson who is on here, he included a large piece of linen and also a very old straight razor to trim the material. I have not done it as I am afraid I'll cut myself badly!!!

  11. #11
    Boolit Master Sasquatch-1's Avatar
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    I too have used plain Crisco. I find it a bit messy, especially in the summer, so I have started adding a little wax just to stiffen it up a bit.

    On the other side of the fence, I have shot with a guy who spit lubes and can hit a golf ball almost every shot at 50 yds. with a rock lock free hand.

    Experiment and see what suits you best. Also you DON'T have to cut your cloth in strips, it just makes things a tad bit easier and maybe a little less wasteful.
    A vote for anyone other then the conservative candidates is a vote for the liberal candidates.

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
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    oldracer -- ya should do it once (watch yer fingers!) -- probably be real surprised at the size of that muzzle cut patch compared to commercial ! ---- I use a wad punch and cut my own but the punches got a lot bigger after I cut samples on the muzzle - loading got much easier too (Waksupi tells us this "Even if the patch isn't perfectly centered, as long as the patch is between the ball and the bore, they all work the same." ... also tells us he won three world championships )...so ?..lets concentrate on the first part which is good solid, logical, commonsense, if the patch aint between the ball n the bore all the way round and everyplace then Houston we have a problem - a problem that is way easy to come upon with smallish cut commercial patches and larger calibre ball - I use a 1&3/4inch patch on my .54, its easy to load but its still under the size of a muzzle cut patch. Have not had the need to use linen of late but with heavy loads you might ($$$$$$$)

  13. #13
    Boolit Master Toymaker's Avatar
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    Find yourself a little NAPA oil, also known as machinists oil. It's brown, NOT blue. Looks like oil; smells like oil; feels like oil; tastes like oil. But it mixes with water. Machinists use it to cool and lubricate metal when milling or lathe work.
    Mix 7 parts water with 1 part oil and soak your patch strip in the solution. Run the patch strip between your thumb and pointer finger to remove the excess. Lay the strip on a non-porous surface and let the water evaporate. I roll the DRY patch strip and store them in 35mm film containers. Rolling and storing in ziplock bags works too. You can test accuracy by increasing or decreasing the water by 1 part.
    I use pillow ticking for my 40 and tear my strips. For my 54 caliber I use duck canvas, and tear those strips too. The Heavy Bench uses Teflon patching, and I tear the strips. Whatever works for you. My desk drawer is full of metals too, which means (ROFLMAO) I carry more weight.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master



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    I have used Dutch's Ballistol/water lube on my pillow-ticking patch strips for many years. No smell, dry, and great accuracy. 7 to 1 ratio seems to give best accuracy for me. Soak, dry laying flat, roll up for storage.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    I always cut my strips and soaked the in a water soluble oil - can't remember the name but I got it from the local NAPA store and it was what Dutch Schultz recommended in his information that he used to sell/distribute. At the time, I would soak it and lay it out in the sun on a cookie sheet to dry - then roll it and put a roll in an old camera film can. I kept a strip tied to my hunting pouch and would cut at the muzzle - worked great in both rifle and smoothbore.

    I don't know what material you picked up but just remember that it needs to be a natural fiber and material that is sold usually has "sizing" in it that needs to be washed out of it. Wash it and then dry it - then cut your strips.

    I used the same strip patching when I set up my loading blocksand my block thicknesses were determined by the bore of the rifle or smoothbore - thickness was that I could seat the patched ball in the block and it protruded from the bottom enough so that it was easy positioned over the muzzle - self centered and a quick push on my short starter introduced it in to the bore.

    I started shooting BP over 50 years ago and while I have used patches, I never liked 'em. I always preferred to cut at the muzzle but I know a lot of fellows who much prefer patches - boils down to what works best for you.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    54 cal and larger ball are a piece of cake to load.
    From my experience. "As a balls diameter lessens so goes the ease to load em."

    I suspect thats the reason why the nub starter on a short starter was thought of i.e. So to cut each and every patch the same across muzzles end. Leaving no chance of a short sided patch being accidentally rod'ed.

    So here's a new question. Does a pre cut pre lubed patch speed up a rifles loading verses a pre lubed cloth strip cut at muzzle?
    "JUST A OLD DEPLORABLE THAT'S IRREDEEMABLE."

  17. #17
    Boolit Master

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    I hate to say it but Waksupi is right. Shape of the patch makes no difference in accuracy if the fit is right. We tested round square muzzle cut and even star shaped with no difference. I don't muzzle cut as it does put some wear on the muzzle over time and my guns tend to last a long time between barrels. Patch shape would be the last place I would look if accuracy was not up to par.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master

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    Waksupi is right we tested this years ago. Patch shape makes NO difference.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    I use a loading block at times also but use the same strip of patch material I push the patched ball into the block and cut on the top of the block with a sharp knife. My blocks are similar to the ones shown above with the counterbore and relief for the sight. They are a little thicker to allow for the patch to be cut nicely.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master

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    beeswax and unsalted shortening is a great patch lube.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check