The Truth about Glocks and Cast

[Love Life]

Whenever I hear or read about Glock KB, I usually disregard the dribble that follows and put all the issues on the guy who loaded the ammo.

[FergusonTO35]

So many Glocks are out there that, even if the failure rate is the exact same as that of competitors, there are going to be more Glock failures because they outnumber the others by such a substantial margin. Many of them are going fall into the hands of folks whose gun safety and/or reloading habits are a danger to themselves and others, a number which unfortunately includes alot of LE, security, and dealers.

[Love Life]

Everybody is wrong. Glocks just spontaneously explode sometimes. The always blow up when you shoot lead though.

[garym1a2]

Only case seperation in my glocks I every had was with my Glock 22 and and the factory barrel. The storm lake for my 22 and they KKM for my 35 have much tighter chambers and are quite a bit easier on brass.

I don't load glocks to kaboom velocities, only 4.2gr BE with a 175gr cast TC. Over 10K in the G22 and 5K in the G35 with aftermarket barrels and not problems. I gave up on the glock barrels as they are too much hassle, except for the G21SF which is great on cast.

[TXGunNut]

Everybody is wrong. Glocks just spontaneously explode sometimes. The always blow up when you shoot lead though.

That's as good an explanation as any, better than most, LL. Sometimes there just isn't a good explanation.
First Glock KB I heard of happened soon after they began importing them. I'm sure there have been many thousands of them since. The few that I've handled were not firing lead boolits at the time, at least one was firing factory ammo. I've always felt there was another cause or a combination of events but in most cases the gun goes back to Glock before a careful analysis can be done. Glock keeps fixing them and they keep preaching to their armorers that the Glock will not fire out of battery. Durned if I know.

[Love Life]

How many Glock Kabooms have you seen happen...in person...and could verify without a shadow of a doubt that it was factory ammo that caused it? If it was a reload, can you verify without a shadow of a doubt that the load was within specs and the KB as entirely on the Glock? How many have you seen, in person, fire out of battery?

[TXGunNut]

I couldn't make the G27 I had (or any others I've handled) fire out of battery but the KB cases I've examined failed because they weren't supported by the chamber. One KB that sticks out in my mind is a fairly new .40 (23?) that was firing factory loads. I wasn't present during the events leading up to or during the KB and the owner wanted to ship it to Glock without disassembling it. I was able to rule out a bore obstruction, tho. If I had a Glock I'd shoot my lead reloads in it, I've seen enough factory loads fail that I know they're not infallible. I think most KB's happen involving reloads because most are fired with reloads.

[Love Life]

There have been several (no idea how many there really have been as I'm sure much has been repeated in the years of the interweb) reports of Kabooms. However it is usually posted by a 3rd party.

Now, having said that. Bear bullets in Minden, NV has a blown out Glock 20 on the wall with the case still in the chamber. The bottom is blown out at the unsupported portion of the chamber. It is quite interesting.

[TXGunNut]

The question is did it fire out of battery or unlock prematurely? I haven't seen a KB where the case was fully seated in the chamber but knowing exactly how it happened is something I can't lay claim to. Any pet theories? I have little doubt that the folks @ Glock could shed a little light on the subject but I'm not holding my breath.

[Love Life]

The rd looks fully seated to me. I may need to head in this weekend to buy some 38 S&W ammo, powder, and I'll take a much better look at the gun.

Story goes that the gun went KB, Glock said it was your fault without ever looking at it, so the owner stuck it up on his wall for public display.

[TXGunNut]

I can see both sides of that situation but we both know Glock made the wrong call there. Last I heard they would repair it for a fair price but the two I know the most (which isn't much) about were both LE duty guns. Had a Glock armorer tell me that was generally the case. I also had some carry ammo that would get a bit shorter after being chambered several times. I know understand that would cause pressures to go way up, some folks cite that as a possible KB cause.

[Love Life]

That could (deep seating) very much be an issue. I would attribute that to poor crimp though.

[TXGunNut]

It was factory ammo and yes, poor crimp and/or neck tension was certainly a factor. It helped me remember to cycle my carry ammo, at least the first two, lol. Pretty sure I fired them anyway, probably wouldn't do that today even though I was aware of the high operating pressures of the 40 S&W.

[Catshooter]

I have personally seen two Glock Kabooms.

The first one was a 2nd Gen 21. I loaded a 1/2 grain under max load for my first outing with Universal Clays. Load was from their book. Unfortunately I grabbed the Clays keg, not the Universal during my loading. The two powders are like Universal/Unique, Clays/Bullseye for those who don't know. So the using UC data with Clays powder was well over max.

The very first round punched a pretty half moon out of the case right in the feed ramp and disassembled the mag. No damage, no injury.

The second was with a 2nd Gen 23. My buddy's gun & handloads. Second or third round the base of the brass punched out. You could still read the headstamp. It was like nothing I've ever seen before or since. Just a nice round hole in the base, primer pocket completely gone but the rim/headstamp all intact.

He figured it was his mistake. So when we went out again with his loads we felt pretty confident of no issues forthcoming. He was super careful (as you can imagine) in making up those loads.

First round! Same thing. He had bought a case of S&B and fired it and this was the brass he was using. I reviewed his data, procedures and we pulled the other rounds. All quite safe. Well below max.

He tried the same exact load but used Winchester brass and had no troubles at all. In fact the load was a bit weak, wouldn't always fully cycle so he upped it.

It had to be the brass. He never had a failure with the S&B in it's first firing, but it couldn't be reloaded. Scrapped it all.

Kabooms can be caused by quite a few different things.


Cat

[Mik]

How many Glock Kabooms have you seen happen...in person...and could verify without a shadow of a doubt that it was factory ammo that caused it? If it was a reload, can you verify without a shadow of a doubt that the load was within specs and the KB as entirely on the Glock? How many have you seen, in person, fire out of battery?

I've never seen a glock fire out of battery. I've seen multiple glocks fail to fire when out of battery slightly. It results in a light, off-center, primer strike. I suppose given a different type of ammo, the rounds might have fired.

[Love Life]

You've never seen a Glock fire out of battery, but you have seen multiple Glocks fail to fire when out of battery slightly? I am confused.

[garym1a2]

i have that happen loading 40 with the round too long. The slide is a small bit from lockup, the firing pin still drops. just no bang.

You've never seen a Glock fire out of battery, but you have seen multiple Glocks fail to fire when out of battery slightly? I am confused.

[garym1a2]

Here is a picture of a Glock barrel G22 with the case head seperating, only 4.2gr BE, 175gr TC.

Attachment 110136

[yondering]

Your picture attachment doesn't work.

[yondering]

Since we're talking about KB's, here's a page I stumbled across with some interesting pictures of KB's in different guns:
http://tincanbandit.blogspot.com/2014/01/kabooms.html

It's funny how the topic of KB's always comes up when Glocks are mentioned though, like all the non-glock fanboys want to point out why their favorite is a better choice. This particular discussion isn't even relevant to this thread, since it happened with JHP's, not cast.