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Thread: The Truth about Glocks and Cast

  1. #1
    Cast Boolits Founder/B.O.B.

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    The Truth about Glocks and Cast

    So we can actually settle this debate and I can sticky a thread can someone[s] chime in with facts from personal experience[s] with their Glocks and cast.

    Notice I asked for facts, not hearsay, not factory advisements, etc.
    For the record, I do not own a Glock and have no dog in this fight.
    No digging in other's experiences for sake of an argument are needed, please keep it civil.
    Boolits= as God laid it into the soil,,grand old Galena,the Silver Stream graciously hand poured into molds for our consumption.

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  2. #2
    Boolit Mold
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    My Glock 22 has 18k rounds and counting in the factory barrel. For the record, shooting minor power factor. 175g TC with Rooster Red over 3.0g WST at about 715 fps 1.135 OAL.
    Last edited by GlockJockey; 07-27-2008 at 08:28 PM.

  3. #3
    Cast Boolits Founder/B.O.B.

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    The Metford is very similar to Gastons Poly rifling, and I never heard of Martini's blowing up because of cast. Would the Martini owners agree?
    Boolits= as God laid it into the soil,,grand old Galena,the Silver Stream graciously hand poured into molds for our consumption.

    Bullets= Machine made utilizing Full Length Gas Checks as to provide projectiles for the masses.

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  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    This is a good one (Not that the others aren't). I have put hundreds of rounds through a model 22 (not thousands) with no ill efect that I can see. I can't understand what all the fuss is about with shooting cast boolits in those barrels? I have found no lead build up but clean often as I do with all my firearms. No signs of excess pressure either. So why do they say not to shoot lead? I'll be watching...BTW my load is 5grs. of win 231 under a 180grn. TC. Shoots great.
    Experience is the source of all knowledge.

  5. #5
    Boolit Man
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    I have had good luck with cast in a .40 model 23 and a 22 with factory barrel as long as I keep the loads light. If I try to push them at all I get some leading. I use a Lone Wolf barrel for my hotter loads now. Its easier on the brass too.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

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    I have shot about 400 rnds through my Glock 22 with no ill effects. No bad leading, maybe a little. It didn't shoot great, not bad but I was hoping for better. I believe the poly rifling makes for bigger bore needing a slightly bigger bullet to keep the leading down. I shoot mine as cast straight WW's some water dropped LLA for lube, mid range loads. I have also shot some heavier loads with a wolf barrel.
    Aim small, miss small!

  7. #7
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    In the mid-'90's, I owned a Glock 19 that I put hundreds of low- to medium- pressure cast loads through. The gun shot as good when I traded it as it did when I first got it. I'm not making any claims or endorsements, just relating my personal experience.
    lathesmith

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Zero issues with several cast boolit designs in my Model 21 x 45 ACP. I've run #452460 past 1000 FPS without a trace of leading, sized both .454" and .452"--accuracy and performance was unaffected. Alloys were both WW and Taracorp, lube was Javelina.

    If a bullet fits, it won't normally deposit lead.
    I don't paint bullets. I like Black Rifle Coffee. Sacred cows are always fair game. California is to the United States what Syria is to Russia and North Korea is to China/South Korea/Japan--a Hermit Kingdom detached from the real world and led by delusional maniacs, an economic and social basket case sustained by "foreign" aid so as to not lose military bases.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

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    ok you guys that have them what kind of groups do you get at 25yds AND try to be honest. I have shot 4 different guns and none will shoot with a colt or kimber and even a 220 sig will out shoot them rick

  10. #10
    Boolit Master



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    Poor fitting Boolits... How many loaders purchase brand X ...and load it without ever wondering about bore size ? Hey it´s cheap ... shoot it . I have DE-LEADED many old rifle barrels... then shot hundreds of PROPER FITTING BOOLITS (as most of you) and just needed to clean out powder residue. I have a Glock .40 and shot 2000+ of my home cast before I ever heard of this... I could not see or get any lead out of the barrel ?? So on I will go happily in my ignorance enjoying a fine tool with a GREAT home brewed product.

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    I've posted before about my Glock 30 45 ACP and years of success using cast boolits. It may have fired some jacketed factory ammo when it was new, but has seen cast only for at least the last seven years. The RCBS 45-230 CM and six grains of Unique will do just about everything I need a handgun to do. Tony

  12. #12
    Boolit Master Ron's Avatar
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    My GLOCK 34 has had a couple of thou of my cast through it and never a sign of leading. I didn't like the possible case expansion problem so bought a Storm Lake bbl to give more case support. If you don't use hot loads you shouldn't have problems with a GLOCK 9mm., can't talk about other calibres. I find no difference in accurancy between the two bbls.
    Ron.



    FESTINA LENTE

  13. #13
    Boolit Master yondering's Avatar
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    I had terrible leading with two different Glock 23's. One was pretty much new, the other gun was older with a lot of jacketed rounds through it. This was with commercial cast stuff though.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master

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    My groups weren't that great, not bad but not as good as I hoped for. Probubly about 8" at 25y. That is offhand thought and I don't like to brag but I am a well above average shot with a pistol. That's with a compensated Glock 22 with 175g Lee TC and SWC bullets.
    Aim small, miss small!

  15. #15
    Boolit Man
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    LEAD BULLETS IN THE GLOCK.

    I spoke to the factory rep, he said in no way should you shoot lead bullets in the glock pistol !
    He told me that lead slowly builds up in the barrel, and eventually you build pressures to the point where the barrel explodes.




    My gunsmith buddy had a glock in his shop, bbl had burst, the guy was shooting lead bullets.


    I was in a local sport store, there was a guy in there talking about a burst bbl in his glock,, how the pressures of the load kept building, and building, and how he thought a lot of bad powder was to blame. I asked him were you shooting lead bullets,,, he said yes. Lead bullets were all he shot.

    If you shoot lead bullets in the Glock buy a replacement bbl with traditional rifling. That is what the factory rep told me.

  16. #16
    I'm A Honcho! Cayoot's Avatar
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    I have a glock 34 and was wanting to try shooting lead in it. More specifically, I would like to try SWCs. However, the only moulds I have for SWCs are .358s (for my .38/.357s). Do you guys think it would be too dangerous to shoot .358s in a 9 mm tube? Maybe I should just see about getting a .356 sizer?

    About building pressures due to accumulation of lead...what about just running a Lewis Lead Remover through it now and then?

    What do you guys think?
    “For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life” – John 3:16

    That still amazes me…I don’t care who you are or how much I care about you, I would never let you kill my son. I can’t even begin to understand how much He loves us.

  17. #17
    I'm A Honcho!


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    Wow, Ken, you know how to stir up a hornet's nest.

    First off, I'll say that I agree with you in principle, because I've read about the Metford rifling. Also, I recall that back in the really old days, there were square-bore guns (don't know if I'd call them rifles, since I don't think there was a twist, but still...). To cause even more trust in lead and Glocks, I can add my own experience with my first Glock. It was a 9mm G-17, and I purposely meant to test it's reliability and durability. I shot between 5000 and 6000 rounds of cast lead reloads (122gr LRN & 4.5-4.7grs of W231 in military cases, so it was pretty hot) without ANY cleaning over a period of about 8 months. There was never a pressure excursion or other problem with any of these loads.

    On the other hand, I've been a member (and moderator) over at GlockTalk for about 10 years. There is a fellow member/moderator over there whom I respect greatly. He is a failure analysis engineer for a large firm and has examined ~35 blown-up Glocks under contract to determine the truth (whether that helped or hurt the clients). He also used his personal Glock 45 set up in a test with pressure-measuring equipment mounted to the factory barrel. He fired a fairly light lead-bullet load and was able to measure pressure increasing with EVERY round fired after a two to three dozen rounds were fired. He stopped the test before he intended to, because the pressure readings got dangerously high and he didn't want to blow up his personal pistol...

    Then, you have the problem of Glock's TOP-SECRET-LEVEL silence on problems with ka-BOOMing Glocks. (I'm no Glock-hater, either. I'm a certified Glock Armorer; I've met, talked with, and supported the VP of Glock in charge of the US operation and several other Glock employees and functions; and I have an extensive collection of Glocks - over 25 at last count.) Nevertheless, Glock's abject silence is not helping this issue. They'd be so much better off to just come out with any analysis or information they have about this issue and put it to rest...



    All that said, I believe the following:

    Polygonal rifling is different than conventional and MAY cause a problem with leading FOR DIFFERENT REASONS THAN WHAT WE TRADITIONAL BULLET CASTERS ARE USED TO LOOKING AT/THINKING ABOUT. (Therefore, the things we usually work on to avoid leading may be counter-productive in poly-rifling.) This can then be compounded by the fact that polygonal rifling seals better than conventional, and therefore, when the leading DOES occur, it gets worse faster. Also, as opposed to the Metford system, powders have vastly changed since the 1800s, not to mention the composition of the lead bullets, style of priming, metallurgy of the cases and barrels, etc... So, I'm not convinced it is a terrific comparison.

  18. #18
    Cast Boolits Founder/B.O.B.

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    To mention the hammer forged barrels and notoriously short or non existent throats of the Gaston wonder vs the nice long throats of the Martini rifles with Metford rifling and no lead issues would invite more debate right Mic?

    Not that I am poking the swarm with a stick. lol
    Boolits= as God laid it into the soil,,grand old Galena,the Silver Stream graciously hand poured into molds for our consumption.

    Bullets= Machine made utilizing Full Length Gas Checks as to provide projectiles for the masses.

    http://www.cafepress.com/castboolits

    castboolits@gmail.com

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    I shot a few hundred commercially cast bullets through a G21 before I got the word that it was a bad idea. Nothing bad happened, but I don't recall them producing better groups than jacketed bullets. Given that the cost of aftermarket barrels isn't all that great, the smart play is probably to use such a barrel for use with CBs.

    Glock KBs, as well as NYPD and LAPD issues, are to my knowledge unrelated to bullets.
    Most people would sooner die than think, in fact, they do so. -B. Russell

  20. #20
    Boolit Man
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    Glocks and lead

    A friend of mine has shot thousands of rounds of cast bullets through his 40 caliber Glock that he originally purchased back when we were in college (around 1998 I think). Although I tried and tried to get him to purchase a replacement barrel with standard rifling he insisted the factory barrel is just fine. It still shoots as good as when he bought it, but I still would not recomend shooting cast in a factory Glock barrel.
    As far as accuracy, his Glock shot just as well with cast as it did with jacketed bullets: Around 2" to 3" groups at 25 yards. I've shot many Glocks and they were all very accurate. The Glock 20 I owned was probably the most accurate handgun I ever shot at 50 yards. That is as long as I shot it off a rest. Off-hand I can not shoot Glocks well because they tend to rise in my hand and shift all over the place as I shoot. They are great guns, they just don't fit my hands well.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check