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Thread: Who hunts with cast HP?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    Both h110 and w296 in the house along with hornady GCs. I PC but also made my own lube that posted a few months back. I plan on PCing with smokes power.

    Sorry but I don't PC so others will have to advise there. My Devastators cast of 16-1 weigh out at 275 fully dressed. In Winchester cases with WLP primers I use 24 gr H110 which pressure tests right at the SAAMI MAP. That's a measured psi btw in my Contender barrel using the Oehler M43 PBL. It runs 1200 fps out of my 4" Anaconda, 1450 fps out of my 6 1/2" Ruger BHFT and 1650 fps out of a 16" M94 carbine.

    What size handles do I need for the mold? Will my lee handles work? Dose it come with pins to form the HP cavity?

    It will be more convenient if you use Lyman handles, the smaller ones for single cavity moulds. The Lee's will work also but you may have to drill new holes for the pins. Yes it comes with a separate pin for the HP.

    I pour with a lee hand held dipper scooped from a 10lb pot.

    Try the Lee dipper but you might want to get a Lyman or RCBS dipper for better and less frustrating results. Using Lyman's dipper technique (not doable with the Lee dipper) will give the best results. You'll want to get the alloy into the mould quicker and more consistently than you'll probably be able to with the Lee dipper.

    I have a lee sizer. I run my bullets though it and and add a GC after PCing. What's the push pin used for and I would assume I need one and it doesn't come with? My lube I made is kinda like the old nra lube plus stp oil additive if I remember.

    You may have to change your procedure a bit. My Anaconda has untapered .429 throats and the barrel is a .429 groove diameter.....it is extremely accurate. With the Devastator crimped in the crimp groove rounds will not chamber unless the bullets are sized .429 as the bullet is full diameter out past the case to where the nose (ogive) begins. I seat the GCs 1st, then lube and size at .430 then size to .429 in a Lee push through sizer. If the GCs fits squarely on the bullet shank the flat push rod that comes with Lee sizers will crimp the GC on while sizing the bullet. I've done considerable testing and have found my other 3 .44 handguns shoot just as accurately w/o leading with the bullets sized .430. The Ruger BHFT has .432 throats (pinned) with a .429 groove barrel and shoots just as accurately for me with .429, .430 or .432 sized bullets. I get no leading to speak of with the lube I use (BAC) when I use a good alloy to begin with.

    I have 4, 44's. A new ruger 77/44 which will mainly be what ill use this for along with my colt andaconda. I also have a ruger 44 semi auto carbine and a s&w nite guard.

    I suggest working up the load staying within published handgun load data for the M77/44. The Anaconda will then, more than likely, shoot it just fine. The Ruger semi and S&W will probably shoot that load also. Remember to size the Devastators to fit (chamber) in the revolvers cylinders.


    I saw this pic of them next to the lee 310 that I make and the wide meplate on the devistator sold me....
    https://mobile.twitter.com/superelkh...58199825715202


    That is one of the benefits of that wide gaping HP on the Devastator.....if it doesn't expand it still has the same effect then as a WFN bullet.

    Larry Gibson

  2. #22
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    i use a ruger sbh(4 5/8" barrel) in a 44 sp case with a 250gr mihek hp(40:1) and 7.0gr of unique. i haven't shot a deer with it but i am confident that it would kill a deer.


  3. #23
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    someone asked me for the alloy and load I used on my 30 herrett contender
    Sorry I accidentally deleted your email
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  4. #24
    Boolit Master Grendel99's Avatar
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    I've only shot three deer with a cast hollow point but really like them. I shot mine with a .44 mag Super Blackhawk Hunter & the Lyman 429640 Devastator cast from WW's & tin. Here are my threads with pics including a recovered bullet. I want to try a Lyman 429244 I had HP'ed for the upcoming deer season.

    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...k-with-cast-HP

    http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-bullet-(pics)

  5. #25
    Boolit Master
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    I have taken only one deer with HP but it did fine just behind the left shoulder through the top of the left lung--tearing a great hole--- across the top of the body cavity and into the left hip and knocked the hair off bullet weighed 208 and recovered it weighed 138 gr
    coww plus soft wheel the flat ones and some lead from fired JHP ac'd with Carnuba Red soften'd lube
    my Hps come an NOE mold and a MIHEC mold

  6. #26
    Boolit Master Oklahoma Rebel's Avatar
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    OP, when you say fouling, do you mean powder fowling or leading?, I am surprised that you use an alloy that soft at 2000+fps, I would hhave thought you would need it just a bit harder, maybe 1-1.5% more antimony or something. thanks-Travis
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  7. #27
    Hi folks,
    First time poster here.
    I recently purchased the RD Tlc311-165 from noe in order to try as hollow points in my new Marlin Xlr 3030 on pigs and deer with Lyman no.2 and 35 gr of lvr powder. My new rifle has no throat and I have to seat the bullet well forward of the crimp groove so that approximately 0.15 inches is seated below the neck and exposed to the powder. Test shooting this load put the first 2 shots into 1 inch and the third shot 3 inches low and to the right at 90 yards. This pattern repeated for three groups. Bullets are cast with Lyman no.2 , sized at .311 lubed and gaschecked
    Do you think that having to seat this bullet deeply and exposing the back of it to powder could be causing this to occur?
    I have also ordered a new Lee 6 custom mold of the Lyman 311041 which I purchased hoping to be able to seat to the correct oal and avoid the above seating/clambering issue. Do you think I can achieve adequate expansion on deer without the hp when driven at 2000-2200 fps ?
    Thanks for your help,
    Regards,
    Simon.

  8. #28
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    I have quite a few loads where the base of the bullet protrudes into the powder area and accuracy is not affected .. Now these are powdercoated and NO gas check .. I would be a little leary of a greased bullet wearing a check being below the neck base myself but have no personal experience to base that judgement off of

    Now If you gas check first, size, powdercoat and then finish size the PC will act as a excellent adhesive and check would not come off and accuracy would not be affected
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  9. #29
    Boolit Master


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    Coachcusak

    Only testing with your load will tell you whether seating the GC below the case neck adversely affects accuracy. Can you seat so the case mouth is crimped just under the drive band in the first lube groove (will the aol allow feeding)? There is proof the bullet can be severely damaged. From the NRA cast bullet handbook;

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Two 311284s. One seated with GC inside neck and the right one seated below. The damage to the right bullet is self evident.

    Another thing that may be adversely affecting accuracy is the velocity is too fast for the 10" twist of your rifle. You will probably get better and more consistent accuracy with that load under 1940 fps. I have killed numerous deer with the 311041HP out of 10" twist rifles with a velocity of 1900 - 1940 fps. I set my own max range at 150 yards for that load.

    I also suggest a bit softer alloy than Lyman #2. While #2 alloy will certainly kill the deer the HP will probably not perform as desired. I suggest for your hunting bullets mixing your #2 alloy with 60 - 70% pure lead. Let the bullets AC for 10+ days before sizing, loading, etc. Clean the barrel every 8 rounds or so to maintain best accuracy. That alloy will expand very nicely in deer. That's only for the hunting bullets. For your practice bullets I would mix the #2 alloy 50/50% with pure lead and WQ to harden the bullets. I size, load, etc. those after 48 hours of age hardening.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
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  10. #30
    Thanks for your feedback fellas.
    Larry Gibson, my marlin xlr has a 24 inch stainless barrel with a 1 in 12 inch twist and Ballard rifling so am presuming that the bullets may be getting damaged by being seated too deep. Unfortunately if I seat any further out, I can't close the action. I may have done my cash on the 311-165 rancho dog mold for this particular short throated marlin. It's a shame because I really liked the design of that mold. Is it practical or expensive to have a gunsmith increase the throat length?

  11. #31
    Boolit Master
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    Have always used a boolit with a significant meplat in the past. This year, however, I'm going to be using the 330 Gould boolit for my deer. Why I'm trying to improve on what, so far, has been perfection, I don't know. It's just the fun of it, I guess.

  12. #32
    Boolit Master
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    The Gould is a certified killer. It also tears up a lot of meat and does not penetrate as well as a good flat nosed bullet. I got away from the Gould and went the larger meplat route years ago.

  13. #33
    Boolit Master


    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    Coachcusack

    The 12" twist is definitely a plus, my bad thinking it a 10" twist. Might give the Accurate 30 XCB bullet a look. Might also consider having it throated so the 311041, when seated out, will chamber.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
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  14. #34
    Thanks for your time Larry.
    Much appreciated.

  15. #35
    Boolit Master 35 Whelen's Avatar
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    I have, with a revolver, but I'm not crazy about HP's for revolver hunting. Those big, fat expanded HP's don't penetrate nearly as well as a plain ol' SWC. I shot a buck a couple of seasons ago with a 45-270 SWC HP from a Cimarron Bisley 45 Colt. MV was around 1025 fps and range was 48 yds. I hit him high in the shoulder and the bullet didn't exit, but it sure did look purty!





    Snuck up on a feral sow March of last year and put a 247 gr. Penta SWCHP low in her shoulder. MV was a little south of 1000 out of a .44 Special and range was 44 yds. The bullet broke her leg bone in two, but failed to penetrate past the spinal area. She would've died ASAP but I put a RCBS 44-25KT @ 255 grs. and 950 MV into her head.



    My oldest daughter and I have both killed a handful of deer with a 311291 HP (185 grs.) loaded to 1850 fps. They all died with no complaints.

    35W
    "Only accurate rifles are interesting." -Col. Townsend Whelen.
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  16. #36
    Boolit Master Tripplebeards's Avatar
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    Has anyone performed penatration tests with different alloys in the devistator? Courious between 16:1, 50/50 of COWW/pure + .2% tin, and COWW +2% tin. Sounds like 16:1 is the best for weight retention but I'm wondering how much penatration (if any) is sacrificed by the softer alloy.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master
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    I have shot a few large Sask. deer with the Gould 330 HP and a case full of BP in a 45/70 and a 45/100, and if the hit is not right you can waste a lot of venison, but deer drop instantly.

  18. #38
    Boolit Master
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    I may change my intentions if I can't get an accurate load developed. Shooting a Buff Classic and just have not been satisfied. The quest continues.

  19. #39
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    I have collected several deer with that bullet. Most from a 45 colt low wall on 296 powder. It is devastating above 1600, actually overexpands when cast very soft. One of a very few non passthru shots led to a lost animal. The deer went less than 100 yards but in terrible brush and no blood trail.
    That bullet was designed for 1350 to 1400 fps range and performs well as designed. If I wanted to push it faster I would reduce the depth of HP pinto moderate the expansion and maintain penetration. It has been accurate for me in a Ruger #1 and the low wall , haven't tried it in my hand I 4570, oversight that needs addressing!
    “You don’t practice until you get it right. You practice until you can’t get it wrong.” Jason Elam, All-Pro kicker, Denver Broncos

  20. #40
    Boolit Master

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    35 Whelen, I just have to ask, what was your alloy for the .45 Colt boolit?

    Beautiful expansion!
    Maker of Silver Boolits for Werewolf hunting.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check