considering what would happen if i improve this case?

[Oklahoma Rebel]

http://www.reloadersnest.com/article/images/9362_1.jpg the 9.3X62 has a base diameter of .476 and just before the neck it is .451, my question is what effects would there be if the case was blown out to say....466 just before the neck, it would leave little taper, but some. would that cause extraction problems. and does anyone have a computer program to see what kind of volume change it would make? I want to say its current case volume as llisted in lee 2nd ed. is 4.29cc's but I could be wrong. thanks-Travis

[Texas by God]

I may be wrong but I think .400 is the largest diameter you can get good headspace with on the 30-06 case.

[bcp]

You may find something useful for a comparison here:
http://kwk.us/cases.html

One comment on the page above:

"..a 4% change in case capacity gives about a 1% change in velocity..."

[Oklahoma Rebel]

texas, not sure I follow you, are you referring to changing the shoulder? I have no Idea what you mean

[Harter66]

I aquired a 98' chambered in a 7mm wildcat that had a .460+ Weatherby shoulder . It had been shot a lot the neck ID was .301 , you might say it was a bit shot out .

There is a 400 Whelen with a .5 " long neck and a shoulder of around .025 .475 if memory serves .
The 45 Raptor has no neck headspacing on the mouth like an ACP but 1.8" long . 473 rim .484 head .478 mouth on a .452 bullet basically a rimless 460 S&W . I haven't had any extraction issues .

Research the 400 Whelen I can't remember the details about the shoulder , trim length was vital for the fire form .

[tdoyka]

http://www.finegunmaking.com/page33/page51/page51.html

its about the 400 whelen

[Nobade]

Don't do it. It's a waste of time and money.

-Nobade

[Oklahoma Rebel]

I was talking about the body of the case, not caliber, and this is more of a what if kind of thing, I don't have the tools or technical knowledge to do it anyways. but I still would like to know how much of a difference it would make, it would at least make a bit more room for more powder

[BK7saum]

It would make almost no difference at all.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I agree with the people who say that as far as increased volume and performance are concerned, it would make no worthwhile difference - certainly nothing worth the reamer and dies. Improved cases are usually considered to extract more easily, and this is probably true in the smoothly cut, uncorroded and clean chambers experimenters and target shooters usually use. The opposite may be true if the chamber is rough or dirty.

Sometimes gun writers copy one another and repeat information which really has only one source. But I have heard from a few places that the narrow shoulder of the .400 Whelen gave trouble. There would be something to be said for a .400 to .450 case which headspaces on the mouth. You would have to trim cases fairly often in a rifle, but when the case leaves the loading bench u you would know how it is going to headspace.

[BK7saum]

Just to be clear, the case already has about the minimal taper of an improved case anyway. On an '06 length case, about 0.020" is the minimum. So your case is at 0.025" doesn't have much room at all to improve. Even shortening the neck and blowing out the shoulder only gives very, very slight improvement in case capacity. The shoulder already has a decent angle already.

[Harter66]

I was offering examples of minimal shoulders .
The 300 Gibbs is an example of 06' to maximum proportions .

[Geezer in NH]

I can see you spending lot's of money for little gain.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

like I said, this was a what if scenario, not planning on doing it. just wanted to learn something. I did, I always wondered about the 400 whelen, it just didn't seem right and I wasn't quite sure how it really stayed in place, I guess it all depends on having a perfect rim? no thanks, that would get old quick!

[Nobade]

The trick to the 400 Whelen is to use the Ackley body taper instead of the normal '06 taper. The case ends up .458" at the shoulder, and gives you plenty to headspace on. Kind of like a big 35 Remington or 300 blackout. Making cylindrical 30-06 cases is kind of a trick though, if you just neck them up they get lopsided so the best way is to fireform them in a jig that has a clip to engage the extractor cut and hold the headspace. I made one years ago, it has a top that screws on with a firing pin in it. You drop the case in, screw on the top, put it in a close fitting pipe, stick the end in a bucket of sand, and hit it with a hammer. Bang, fireformed case. Then just run it through your 400 whelen die and you're set.

-Nobade

[Texas by God]

I get it- you are thinking of a 9.3 Improved. I agree it wouldn't be worth it. There is a .370 Sako that will do what I think you want to do.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

tex, thanks for an answer that made sense according to my question, and no, the though will go no further, I would rather stay with the 9.3 though, as it will do all that needs doin' here and abroad. already have two accurate boolits picked out, a 250gr rnfp, and a 286gr rnfp. loaded to 2200 with the right alloy it will kill anything from hogs and deer to moose and Kodiak bears!-Travis

[oldblinddog]

The .400 Whelen was always an "improved" case with a .458" diameter at the shoulder. Later, the un-informed tried to make it by simply necking the .30-06 to .411". With the .30-06's .441" shoulder, this caused the infamous gunwriter "knowledge" about headspace and Whelen cartridges, even going so far as to applying it to the .35 Whelen. How the latter passed by an editor is beyond me.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

wow, didn't know any of that at all about the 400 whelen,thank you for all the info, oh and as far as the cases being lopsided, does that happen a lot with the 30-30-35? I have seen pictures of the cartridge and it just didn't look right! lol