257 bob or 257 roberts ai?

[Texas by God]

The only reason I haven't built a .257 Ned Roberts is the fact that I have a .250 Savage and a 25-06. It would serve my needs perfectly otherwise. One reason to use the Mauser action is the perfect fit of the 57mm case in the Mauser magazine.

[Estacado]

I think you have a great idea here. I have always wanted a .257 Roberts. Please keep us informed as you go along.

[tdoyka]

I think you have a great idea here. I have always wanted a .257 Roberts. Please keep us informed as you go along.

sure will

[Houndog]

I have a 257AI built on a FN supreme commercial Mauser action. I used a 22 inch Douglas 1/10 lightweight barrel, a fiberglass stock and a Canjar trigger. this thing shoots 1/2 groups at 100 yards with boring regularity at speeds only 100-150 fs slower than a 25/06 How could I ask for more?

[TNsailorman]

I don't know where some of this info came from, but not from Mr. Ackley. The .257 is a great little cartridge itself but it becomes a real long range dialer when opened up to a .257 Roberts AI. As Hounddog said, it is then nipping at the heals of the .25-06. And no, you don't have to reform cases. Just load and fire your regular .257 Roberts cases or fire regular factory ammo. You will loose a little velocity but it fire forms into the .257 Roberts AI. I had several conversations with Parker back in the 60's and early 70's and he told me in one of them that the .257 Roberts AI was one of the most efficient cartridges of all his designs. One of the real advantages of the .257 Roberts AI is that you can get the benefits of the .25-06 in a medium length action or as several have suggested, the Mauser 24/47 action. The AI does change loading powders as it seems to like slower burning powder over the quicker stuff. A gunsmith I knew years ago had a .257 Roberts AI he built on a Remington 700 ADL action and it was a tack driver and he used IMR 4831 for most of his heavy bullet loads and IMR 4350 for the lighter bullets. He and his wife killed groundhogs at 400 plus yards on a regular basis with his rifle. He later went to the 6mm-06 but that is another story. my experience anyway, james

[LAGS]

I built one of my Yugo 24/47's in 25-06 to replace the 257 AI that I sold.
It worked great, but was not a Big step Up from the .257 AI except for with the Heaviest Bullets.
Now I am considering taking the .25-06 out to an Improved Version to boost its performance a little.
But with the Heavier Boolits its the maximum seating length is close to the max length on the Yugo Mid length action Magazine box.

[Harter66]

How about Mr Ackley's own words and data ?

Attachment 199377

Here we have his data for and thoughts on Neds work .
Attachment 199378
Attachment 199379

[tdoyka]

i've been thinking about the 257 bob and i think i have it. i shot a 25-06 and got a couple of deer with it. but i sold it so i could buy a MGM barrel. (tc venture) it was ok but it wasn't for me. i don't think that i'll like a 257 bob ai either. i won't need the extra 100 or so fps from an ai, the max distance will be 300-325 yards using a 115-120gr bullets.

but first i have to get m98 or some variant m98. i'm trying surplus military rifles and just 98 actions. but i have time, its not like i'll HAVE a m98 custom before this year's deer season. i am going to try (bolt actions) from kimber, cz 550, rem m700, savage, browning, tc...too.

[LAGS]

You dont need to go to the AI, but it does give you the flexabilty to shoot standard .257 Roberts and then if the hunt Justifies the extra power you can shoot an AI formed and loaded round.

[JSH]

Do as you wish.
Your on a tight budget?
A milsurp may need a lot of work just on the action to get it cleaned up = time = $$$
Then you have a stock, fitting, finishing, bedding more money.
Then your barrel blank and chambering cost then blueing.

Oh I admire a true custom as much as anyone.

Your in the ball park at $100-150 a month for three years.

That kind of money I would look at a Cooper or a Kimber. Kind of a mass produced semi custom.

A real budget job could be done with the Savage. And then you could build three fairly easy for $3-4K glass included.

As to the AI's. I have worked with a few. They have no less or no more quirks than any other cartridge. Because it says AI or magnum does not mean one has to load clear up against the wall.
I have and like the 300WM. I have loads that go down to a HV32-20 and everything in between the full tilt magnum.

Resale. A true custom will hardly ever return the initial investment, even more so with a wildcat. Folks today want to go down to the local box store, buy a box of ammo and shoot.
Very very few can back up the statements that are made across the net by them.

Jeff

[LAGS]

But some of us have more money then sence
But it keeps us from spending our spare time at the local tavern or glued to the TV.
But others are eventually the ones who benifit in the long run.
They pick up good rifles for a song when we get tired of what we built , and then start a new project.
But paying someone to build me the same rifle makes no economic sence to me.
It is not the possession that gives us the satisfaction.
It is our ability to make something with our own hands that gives us the pleasure.

[tdoyka]

Sad to say, but any 25 caliber is obsolete because good long range bullets are not made. The 6.5 Creedmore is so far superior to the Bob or Bob AI there is no debate. Nice nostalgia cartridges but that's the only reason to build one. Kinda like building a 300 Savage bolt gun rather than a 308.

As for messing with a mil-surp action, again a labor of love that makes no economic sense with the 100s of excellent modern commercial actions out there.

But there are folks who like 44-40s and 44 specials, so ........

i own a tc encore in 6.5cm(MGM barrel) and its the 2nd most accurate rifle that i have(tc encore in 20 vartarg MGM barrel is 1st). i should've built a 257 bob, but it like everything else, should've, would've and could've.

i've been looking a cz 550 action(30-06) but a 98 mauser(or variant) is good too. i guess that it would be considered a semi custom rifle, i did much the same thing for my(well its my son's now) 7x57(98 mauser from fn, drill and tapped for scope mount, timney trigger, douglas premium barrel and a fajen synthetic wood-like stock). 25+/-years ago, i spent $800(i believe, it was quite a while ago) when i could have bought a 7-08 in rem 7 for $400+/-.

now i know that my 257 bob will never beat a price that comes commercially. heck, some complete rifles will beat(price-wise) an action any day of the week and twice on sunday. for all of that, the 257 will be mine to hold and luv till our dying day.

[tdoyka]

But some of us have more money then sence
But it keeps us from spending our spare time at the local tavern or glued to the TV.
But others are eventually the ones who benifit in the long run.
They pick up good rifles for a song when we get tired of what we built , and then start a new project.
But paying someone to build me the same rifle makes no economic sence to me.
It is not the possession that gives us the satisfaction.
It is our ability to make something with our own hands that gives us the pleasure.

if i had two hands, i would luv to build it. but being one handed(had a stroke, the right side of my body is basically ka-poot) and the tools i needed have been long gone, to me it does make sense to let it go to my gunsmith. it will be my last(ahem) rifle i will buy. come to think of it, i should've quit buying guns when i got my '06, that has to be 30 years or so. think of all that money i have wasted.

[LAGS]

And yes , not all can build their own rifle .
Either because of lack of knowledge , tools , or like in your case , a disability.
But if you find the right gunsmith and he understands and builds the rifle per your direction , the love and satisfaction will still be built in.

[tdoyka]

That kind of money I would look at a Cooper or a Kimber. Kind of a mass produced semi custom.

Jeff

i have been looking at complete rifles and i have to say i like the kimber m48( http://www.kimberamerica.com/classic-select-grade ). the only thing i don't like about it, is the weight. i like rifles that go between 7.5 to 9lbs. i had a rem mountian rifle(30-06) that would weigh 7lb and some ounces(with scope and loaded) and i couldn't find the handload that went under 3" at 100 yards(3 shots). 150-180gr hornady, sierra, speer... imr 4320, imr4350... you name it, i have shot it. since then(25 or so years ago) i never had nothing to do with sporter weights.

cooper i would luv to have, but they cost too much fer me.

i'm still looking at the 98 mauser(or variants) but the kimber is starting too warm up to me.

[LAGS]

If the weight is what you like , then a good Gunsmith can Add weight to a stock if you desire.
Or is it the weight provided by the Barrel that works for you.

[tdoyka]

A 98 Mauser mil-spec action converted to modern sporter specs (bolt, safe, trigger, polish & blue) will cost more and weigh more than any number of complete rifles. If you are starting with a pre 1941 98, IMO it's criminal to modify such a fine collectors' military action/rifle. If you have all the skills, then a South American "98" action makes a nice sporter. If the labor is "free" you can build a nice rifle for less than a Kimber/Cooper etc. but will never recover what you have in it.

i don't care how much money it can get. it will be mine till i God calls me home.

criminal, not hardly. i would like to have a complete 98 mauser rifle, but as far as i am concerned a 98 mauser action is fair game.

[tdoyka]

there is another one...montana's asr.
http://montanarifleco.com/?page_id=149

[Harter66]

I believe that Happy's remarks about the pre 41' were directed at Mauser built commercials and as GI rifles with mostly matching numbers . I have a GEW 98 DWM 1916 that has had at least 4 sight sets drilled and tapped but kept the OM safety it's last over haul was likely in the mid to late 60s with the installation of the Jeager trigger and Buheler mounts were added with the heavy 7mm long necked .08 short to the shoulder more or less 280 AI wildcat bbl that is awaiting me getting my act together for a 280 Rem and 257 bbls to be finished and indexed so it can be bedded in the NOS 70s semi inlet stock . Lots of labor intensive work to do particular to the stock . But via some once in a lifetime breaks this rifle and a Santa Barbara 98 in 358 will come in around $350 each plus glass of course .

[Red Elk]

FWIW...
I would not build a rifle on a 93, if it is to be your "last custom rifle". Use a great 98 action. Don't settle for less.
I have both.
I do like the .257 AI, but it is not necessary in most shooting situations.
The AI does give you some added umph. But the .257 Roberts is plenty.
If you are shooting longer distances, or wanting more of an elk rifle, then I would definitely do it. If you are mostly shooting deer and black bear, I would just leave it a .257 Roberts.
.257 Roberts is a fantastic cartridge just as is. It will do most anything that needs doing on this continent, although I would personally hesitate with Grizzly or Brown bear. I know it will do it, but I am a cautious man, and I would probably try to not put myself in that situation. Anything else, yeah, it will do it.
Keep in mind your distance and use excellent shot placement and .257 Roberts is plenty.
The .257 AI is a great cartridge, for all the reasons you indicate. But not worth the trouble usually. If you really feel the need for the extra speed, get a .257 Weatherby Magnum, or even a .25-06. While I have or have had both of those, I would still choose the .257 Roberts for most shooting.
It is the only cartridge where I have shot three bullets in a series in the exact same hole, at 100yards, with witnesses. They can be extremely accurate when you do your part.
Best wishes on a great new rifle.
re