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Thread: plain base gas check, NOE 380-180 WFN PB

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    plain base gas check, NOE 380-180 WFN PB

    Hello guys,

    I have a great NOE mold for my lever gun, the NOE 360-180 WFN PB. I keep the velocities around 1300-1400 fps and I get great accuracy.

    I would like to up the velocity a little but I have never tried plain base gas checks. Have any of you guys tried a plain base check on this or any other NOE bullet?

    What were the results like?

    Thanks in advance for your time.


    Steve in N CA

  2. #2
    Boolit Man Randy Bohannon's Avatar
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    I am not aware of any bullet that takes a "PB gas check" can you post a picture of a PB bullet with a gas check ? I think you need the same mold cut for a gas check to get where you want to go.Am I ignorant of something that's been around and have never seen ?

  3. #3
    Boolit Master



    jmort's Avatar
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    ^^^
    Yes
    Pat Marlin makes PB check dies and
    Sage's Outdoors makes/sells the checks
    http://www.sagesoutdoors.com/gas-che...se-gas-checks/
    "Had his shooting been as good as his running, he might have given a better account of himself."
    James. C. Henderson

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
    Elkins45's Avatar
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    I have tried the plain base checks on a 40 cal bullet to use in max 10mm loads. I tried both the Lee push through and my Lyman lubrisizer to seat them, and both resulted in quite unattractive results. They rarely seated evenly and there were wrinkles and irregularities with both.

    Oddly, when I shot the ugly bullets they ended up being more accurate than the plain ones, so looks can be deceiving.

    These were the aluminum PB checks from Sages IIRC.
    NRA Endowment Member

    Just because a handful of people on the Internet share an opinion doesn't prove it is correct.

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Bohannon View Post
    I am not aware of any bullet that takes a "PB gas check" can you post a picture of a PB bullet with a gas check ? I think you need the same mold cut for a gas check to get where you want to go.Am I ignorant of something that's been around and have never seen ?

    Randy,

    Don't feel bad, I just recently learned about plain base gas checks myself.


    Steve in N CA

  6. #6
    Boolit Man Randy Bohannon's Avatar
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    Thank you all for not biting my head off with my uneducated Q. Cast boolit's are a lifelong endeavor of learning.I looked at them.suppose it is a viable alternative opposed to buying a new mold.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
    Elkins45's Avatar
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    They are certainly cheap enough that trying them won't break the bank.
    NRA Endowment Member

    Just because a handful of people on the Internet share an opinion doesn't prove it is correct.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master


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    You can buy a few cheap enough to give them a try and find out if they'll work.

    The only time I have used any was on bullets for the .351 WSL. The mold was a very old Ideal designed for the .35 WSL and was plain based. I wanted to push them to more or less full ballistics.

    The only plain based checks were designed for .38 revolver bullets and the .351 WSL uses and undersized bullet, so they never gripped as tightly as they should have and I got quite a few weird flyers in groups that I attribute to the checks coming off in flight (I actually found a couple short of the target. I think they would work fine of bullets sized to .358-.359.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    Will these checks work on bevel-based bullets? I am casting with the Lee 375-250 BB mold for my 375 Win. and would like to run faster than 13-1400 w/o purchasing a new mold, if possible.
    "Only two things are infinite; the universe and human stupidity.......and I'm not sure about the universe..........."

    Albert Einstein

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by centershot View Post
    Will these checks work on bevel-based bullets? I am casting with the Lee 375-250 BB mold for my 375 Win. and would like to run faster than 13-1400 w/o purchasing a new mold, if possible.
    My experience is yes. I use the Lee sizer, and run the bullet through backwards, gas check upward, and the results are beautiful. Running the bullet through the "normal" way can damage the gas checks.

    Caution -- I only use flat nose bullets with aluminum gas checks,

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    I'm using the NOE 180 RNFP in my Rossi carbine. My mold throws both PB and GC. Using data from RCBS Cast Bullet Manual (#1) for 357 Magnum (Rifle) for RCBS 180 -SIL bullet.

    Gas checks are not required but can't hurt, especially at higher end velocities. Using 2400, I found just a wee bit more accuracy with the GC bullet. That being said, I get no leading with PB bullets, even with the rifle load data.

    RCBS gives 11.5 grains of 2400 with their gas checked 180 SIL bullet as a starting load for 1352 fps. As measured by my Lab Radar unit. The NOE 180 (GC), under 11.5 grains, gives me 1511 fps in the Rossi. Their maximum load is 12.5 grains of 2400 for 1456 fps. I took the NOE to 12.0 grains but accuracy started to drop off, so never went up to 12.5 grains. Don't recall and didn't record the velocity.

    I did shoot an 11.0 grain, below minimum load, in the carbine with the PB bullet. Accuracy was good with zero leading. Again, didn't record the velocities but with only a half grain difference, I have no doubt it was in the 1400 fps range.

    Since my mold has the GC option, I reserve the PB bullets for my revolver loads.

    I wouldn't hesitate to try the PB bullets at higher velocities, especially if they fit your barrel. Shouldn't be a problem, since NOE's moulds tend to throw bullets at larger diameters then the OTC moulds. You may not actually need the GC.

    BTW, I also load H-110 (magnum primed) with the NOE 180 for even more power and slightly better accuracy but only with the GC version. RCBS's (Rifle) data ranges from 14.0 - 15.0 grains of H-110 (1518-1615 fps) My pet load is 14.5 grains.


    Winelover

  12. #12
    Boolit Man
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    I been casting and using gas checks for 30 years, yet the (plain base aluminum gas checks) are something new to me. I just never had interest in them before now. Let me get this straight.....these Sage aluminum gas checks are designed to fit the shank of a non gas check bullet. Right? /Chris

  13. #13
    Boolit Master claude's Avatar
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    these Sage aluminum gas checks are designed to fit the shank of a non gas check bullet. Right? /Chris
    Yes, they probably won't work on hard bullets, I'm guessing much above 12/14 BHN because the check displaces the lead a certain amount in order to size correctly. I use them with H&I (Lyman, RCBS) sizers and they work great.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    I used the 'pop can' checks over plain based 9bhn boolets for my 45 Colt topush a softer alloy a little faster. I ended up using a tiny bit of gel superglue under the check before running them thru the luber/sizer, really wasn't a problem for a hundred hunting bullets. Couldn't justify a gc mold just yet. hc18flyer

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    I use aluminum pb checks from Pat Marlins check maker on the base of a pb boolit. 357 rossi with 190 grain at maximum load potential, no problem. Softish boolit even, no problem. Same for the 35 remington class loaded with 230 grainer at 2000 fps. pb boolits and checks work wonderfully for me in those two applications.

  16. #16
    Boolit Man
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    I've seated quite a few lately. I've found that aged PC bullets from WW + 2.5% tin are tough to size the PBGC onto, but the final product looks perfect. I started using LEE dies and didn't get perfect results. I then remembered a Lyman GC seater in a box of my casting dies, I mounted it in the lubesizer press, and perfection. Does it add another series of steps, well yes it does, but the plain base molds I have cast very accurate bullets and the PBGC's only make them better.

    I haven't tried to see how fast I can push them, but the accuracy is there. I stayed with the same load in both 357 and 44 Magnum and the load was stout to begin with. I don't see a downside as I already have the molds and the time is mine.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check