Does anyone have any suggestions for tang sights on a Hawken Thompson? I have been using Lyman 57's and I'm getting pretty disgusted with the quality of those sights. I shoot every other Sunday in a match and lately my sight has been losing the clip that holds the elevation screw. It happens at the worst time usually, during the match. Any one know of any other sights available?
Thanks
Williams FP Hawken. Mine is the TK version (Target Knobs) with Gib lock screw to lock the elevator
Here is mine
Attachment 195584 Attachment 195585 Attachment 195586
I also bought an Xtra large Aperture to try, I REALLY like it! I own 4 or 5 Lyman 57SMLs, they are good sights but in my opinion they take a backseat to the Williams FP Hawken. Here it is with the large aperture
Attachment 195587
The Williams does not have a quick adjust button like the Lyman 57s, and the hash marks are not adjustable like the Lyman 57 with the little aluminum plates you can adjust for elevation and windage. Those are the 2 main difference's, As far as build Quality in my opinion the Williams FP Hawken is far superior, they are ROCK SOILD! The Gib lock screw is important, without it you would need a little flat head screwdriver to make elevation adjustments (not very handy in the field!!) At a target bench only it wouldn't be a big deal. The Gib comes a bit to long, you have to trim about half the threads back to work with the FP Hawken, its an easy job trimming it back. In the last pic i posted you can clearly see the Gib lock screw on the left, it is knurled so you can easily loosen by thumb and index finger, make adjustments and re tighten.
Well I do like what I see but have a couple of questions about your sight. Do the target knobs on the first and second picture come with the sight or do they have to be purchased separately? Are the target knobs marked for the up/down and l/r adjustments? I'm getting old and confuse easily. Do you know what size the eyepiece threads are? I use a Merit adjustable eyepiece on my Lyman 57 and am hoping that it would fit the Williams. And what front sight are you using? I'm using the Lyman 20 MJT, and really don't want to go to the small 17 size.
Thanks
I've never had any problems with the Lyman sight but, I DO like the looks of those Williams sights you have there. 'specially like the TK's.
Originally Posted by kcajeel
the Lyman and the Williams sight both have the same thread size on the apertures.
They do, and they dont. I can use my Williams Apertures in my Lyman's but i can NOT use my lyman Apertures in my Williams? There is a slight thread difference
I bought mine directly from Williams, i had the option of the TK (Target knobs) or without, I have seen the Williams FP Hawken for 62.99 without the target knobs. I paid a little more by going through Williams themselves instead of a retailer, but i could not find the TK version at any retailer? And i really wanted the Target knobs. The Knobs themselves do NOT have any markings on them, would be easy enough to do yourself though. They are a click type adjustment, you can easily feel the increments, about like a scope with clicks.
No reason to change from your Lyman 20 MJT, if you like it, by all means stick with it. I use a Lyman 17AHB Front Globe with Lee Shaver Inserts. The AHB is the Lowest 17 Globe that Lyman Makes.
Here is another Williams with TK's that i put on one of my TC Scouts. Had i known anything about these Williams FP tang peep sights before i bought my Lyman 57SML's, i would NOT own a Lyman 57SML today, i would own 7 Williams FP's With TK's, That being said i have not had a failure of any kind with my Lyman 57s, I simply like the Williams FP with TK and Gib Lock WAAAAAY BETTER!
Attachment 195660
Actually I like the TC peeps for the Hawkens and the New Englanders.
Found some on a dusty rack in a little shop in Kansas.
Oh happy day!
I had a brand new TC Vernier style peep and TC Globe front sight, I couldn't get rid of it fast enough, definately wasn't for me. I haven't tried the other style, since they are TC they sell for a small fortune, i have looked at them but thats it, I personally feel the Lyman 57 and the Williams are a much better built tang peep, and cheaper than the TC
I wish i could find a dusty rack of them in some little sport shop for the Seneca to sell! They sell for about 250 bucks on Ebay, and you rarely see one
the small T/C peep sights have a lot of slop in them when loosened up for adjustment which makes them a slight pain-in-the-butt 'til ya get'er zeroed. pretty solid once ya do but not real handy if ya like settin' the gun up for different loads/yardages.
Thats my problem, I shoot different yardages and I change sight settings not powder settings. With the Lyman 57's and shooting at 25 and 50 yards I keep the same setting. When I move to the 100 yard range I have to go up 14 clicks and if you happen to move the sight in the wrong direction it will pop out that E Clip. Now I'm aware of it and try for all my might sometimes I move the wrong way. For as much as I like the Lyman and I can shoot it pretty well I gotta find something better. It appears the Williams is the one. I think when I post this message I'll go call Williams and see if they are still available.
I have used apertures from Williams, Lyman, and T/C interchangeably with nary a hiccup from any of them except in some cases the threaded shank wasn't long enough and the edge of the disk hit the base before it was tight.
I am pretty late to this party. I have four of the Lyman 57SML peeps. I installed the target elevation knob and didn't like it. I took it off the just use the push button to release the elevator and slide it to place. I use a pretty hillbilly method but I just painted hash marks on the plate and those are the marks I go to.
I looked back at the pictures of mine. I have never had the problem you are experiencing. I am thinking that the clip that is on yours is either not the OEM clip or it is sprung. If it were me I would get a new clip from Lyman and reinstall it. Like I said I have never had that happen and I have used them for over 12 years.
I also have the Williams peeps and I like them too. But there are pluses and minuses for each.
I like the push button and quick change for yardage settings on the 57.
I like the adjustable side plate, because I can have a second plate for a different load.
I like the ability to quickly take off and put the slider back on. I like to keep mine in my pocket.
I don't like how they don't fit on a Renegade without altering them.
They can be easily damaged that is why I keep mine in my pocket when times are tough.
For the Williams
I like how rugged they are.
The Gib lock is an awesome feature. A friend of mine showed me his couple years ago and I was hooked.
The elevation screw is small and easily used and repeatable.
The things I don't like are the same things I like about the 57.
The fact is they both are good quality sights that offer a higher degree of accuracy than oem sight.
The Push button is the one thing that stands out to me as the thing I like the best.
Going back to the original post and the problem with the 57. I would honestly get a new clip from Lyman and be careful to install it correctly. You should not be having that problem. The good thing is it is fixable and it is a good sight. The fix should be very inexpensive.
Excellent post Ron! They are both good high quality peep sights, if the Williams had the adjustable plate option, and push button ability like the Lyman to make large changes quickly it would be about as perfect as you could get, in my opinion that is. I personally prefer the Williams FP Hawken far and away over the Lyman 57, The Williams FP feels more rigid/durable, and i think they mount and look cleaner on the rifle. I find i can turn the Target knob easy enough to make large changes fairly quickly, obviously not as fast as the push button on the Lyman, but then again that also depends on how you push the button on the Lyman, until you showed me your leverage technique I absolutely HATED that button, it is definitely NOT an easy button to push.
Last edited by 54bore; 05-18-2017 at 05:30 AM.
I know they state that they are interchangeable, and like i said in my experience they are to some degree, but there is DEFINITELY a difference. Like i said i can easily thread a Williams aperture into a Lyman 57, BUT i can NOT thread a Lyman in one of my Williams, it wont even start? I did some digging and found this on another forum of some sort
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Re: peep thread size
Reply #1 - Mar 13th, 2006 at 4:07pm
I'm answering myself on this one. I guess thats what happens when you get old like me. I called Lyman today and they said that there apertures have .225 X 40 threads to the inch. Then I called Williams gun sight Co. and theirs is 7/32 x 40 which is .218" in The Midway Master Catalog under the Williams apertures it states that they will fit Lyman,Williams and Redfield. There is a greater selection of Williams apertures than Lyman.
enough said?IP Logged
Lots of really good information Ron. Good suggestion of buying a new clip from Lyman. Did that Last year when I first started having this problem. Was alerted to the situation by another shooter with a 57 SML doing the very same thing. I really think the thing we are doing is adjusting the bottoming out screw to stop the elevation screw at our 25 yard zero. Now in that configuration if you turn the elevation screw down more it will slip that clip. Hope you can understand what I'm saying, it's hard to describe. But sitting here and thinking about it I believe thats what is going on. Probably if I quit using that little stop my problem would go away. Oh and back to when I bought the clips from Lyman I bought three sets of clips and down to the last one.
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