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Thread: Resizing the 9mm??

  1. #41
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    DerekP Houston's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitespider View Post
    Thanks guys.
    Yeah, I'm thinking a die problem also. The brass I was running through it was mixed head stamps, some fired in the boy's gun, some range pick ups. None resized easily, but some required considerable force on the handle. I do have the die adjusted to make contact with the shell holder, I could try backing that out just a little... but really, to me, the force required feels like too much as soon as the case mouth starts into the die.

    Well, there ain't any more cases to play with at this time, they've all been resized.
    Maybe next time I'll try my .38 ACP carbide resizer.
    *
    For what its worth, my 9mm set from lee came with the wrong sizing die and was sent back and exchanged. 2nd set works fine for me, I haven't noticed any additional pressure needed for reloading 9mm. I lube my cases in a gallon size bag with a couple shots of Hornady One Shot.
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  2. #42
    Boolit Master 308Jeff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragon813gt View Post
    This is one of those rumors that persist for some reason. All factory ammo is tumbled before it's boxed up. There was either an article or thread about this. They tumbled ammo for hundreds of hours and had high magnification, microscope, pictures of the kernels. Nothing changed after hundreds of hours of tumbling. I believe they were shot across a chrono as well. Tumbling for an hour to remove lube isn't going to change anything.
    I posted the link in the post above yours.

    Amazes me that people think that ammo can be transported all over the globe, but can't handle a little time in a tumbler.

  3. #43
    Boolit Master Whitespider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DerekP Houston View Post
    For what its worth, my 9mm set from lee came with the wrong sizing die and was sent back and exchanged.
    Was it marked/labeled wrong?? Or was it marked/labeled correctly, but the wrong die for the set??
    *

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitespider View Post
    I've done some more investigating, examining, measuring, and whatnot.
    I believe 95% of the problem was... ummm... well... operator error

    I was resizing mixed headstamps, several different headstamps. Some were range pick-ups, some were fired in my son's two pistols, some fired in his buddy's pistol, and some fired in a gun belonging to a visiting family member a couple years back. The cases with "F-C" headstamp resized noticeably easier than most others, those with "WCC" and "WIN" headstamps required more effort. The "R-P" headstamps required an effort somewhere between those, and the smattering of other headstamps varied with some requiring even more effort.

    ...SNIP
    My last batch of 9mm range brass that I bought, then processed, then sorted, I found about 100 (out of a box of 3000), that looked like they were reloaded HOT, and probably more than once. I use a Lee 9mm carbide size die, The few of those HOT ones that I sized, sized quite difficult, enough so, that I culled them all out....or most of them, then I ran across some more, but didn't show the extreme signs of HOT relaoding, these were a off brand headstamp that I never heard of "AMMOLOAD", but those were doing what you mention in the OP, "On a handful of them I actually displaced brass and created a sharp ridge where the case stopped entering the die". I sized a couple of them, then took the time to cull the rest before they got to being sized.
    Last edited by JonB_in_Glencoe; 04-27-2017 at 12:53 PM.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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  5. #45
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    ive done it myself without incidence but it still makes me nervous.

  6. #46
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    So it looks like you have just as many replys as me on this so why are you so concerned what others are doing? Why are you pushing your point?? Common sense would dictate that if a guy was paying extra for carbide dies he was using them like they were intended. Just like 99 percent of the people buying them do. Would you buy a 650 Dillon and load one round at a time on it?? Not a nonsense point, a "common sense point" If your dies and press aren't up to sizing tiny little 9mm brass without over stressing it your using some kind of junk press because I have no problem doing it even with a lee hand press. Try your personal attacks next time I post as usual. Its always entertaining.
    Quote Originally Posted by jmort View Post
    "If you are having problems sizing pistol brass with a carbide die theres (sic) something wrong that needs to be fixed or replaced."

    No one mentioned having problems sizing pistol brass except the OP.
    Those are some, myself included, who mentioned that they put case lube on all brass when sizing, carbide or not. That is a choice. That you will not accept that others do it differently than you do seems to be your
    modus operandi. Why do you care what other people do??? That you can size unlubed brass with carbide dies dose not mean that you have to do it that way. Common sense would tell anyone that there will be less stress placed on the brass, dies, and press with lube. Some people choose to get postsecondary education and some do not. That is a choice. You keep making the same nonsense point. You do it your way and others will do as they see fit.

  7. #47
    Boolit Master 308Jeff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lloyd Smale View Post
    ive done it myself without incidence but it still makes me nervous.
    Absolutely nothing wrong with being nervous or cautious when it comes to reloading.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitespider View Post
    Was it marked/labeled wrong?? Or was it marked/labeled correctly, but the wrong die for the set??
    *
    IIRC it was marked/labeled correctly just had a 380 sizing die instead of 9mm. It's been awhile though my memory may be off. My guess was someone had opened them up to look at the dies and mixed them up putting em back. Amazon swapped it no problem.
    My feedback page if you feel inclined to add:
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  9. #49
    Boolit Master Whitespider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DerekP Houston View Post
    IIRC it was marked/labeled correctly just had a 380 sizing die instead of 9mm.
    LOL - That's funny - I need a .380 resizing die because my boy wants to reload that also.
    However, given the dimensions of his 9mm resizing die I'm bettin' it will work just fine for that (or I can use the .38 auto resizer)... and I can use my .38 S&W expander and seater to complete the job.
    *

  10. #50
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    "... tumbling live rounds can break down powder cornels and powder coatings and change the burning rate of you powder and if your using conventionaly lubed bullets your impregnating dirt and dust into your lead bullets..."

    Wrong
    Wrong
    Wrong
    So much fail

  11. #51
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    I have had that issue only on sub-gun fired 9mm. They were easy to spot, the case mouth was wider than the base. They almost looked like a .380ACP fired in a 9mm chamber does.

  12. #52
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    I do remember something about powder and deterrent coatings--I think it was from the first Lee reloading manual.

    A shooter was loading at the bench, getting high pressure on all freshly loaded rounds that were the same load as the ones loaded at home that showed no high pressure. They contacted the powder company--that powder was designed so that it was expected that transport/tumbling would alter the deterrent coatings in the loaded round and prevent the situation that the shooter was experiencing at the range bench.

  13. #53
    Boolit Master Whitespider's Avatar
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    I don't believe anyone can say with absolute certainty that all availible smokeless propellants are unaltered by tumbling/vibrating. How many are there?? 200?? 250?? 300?? More?? I would think that most can handle a short session in a tumbler without an appreciable alteration... vibration could possibly be more effective at altering certain(?) smokeless propellants. Then you figure in things like load density, temperature, the shape of the case, how many rounds in in the machine... heck, even the age of the propellant.

    I would never say never... ever.
    Don't get me wrong, I've done it for expedience on occasion, but only for a few minutes. My preference is to not do it for several reasons, not just the possibility of propellant alteration. I really don't want boolit or case lube mixed into my vibrator media... especially if it contains any petroleum products. And I don't like the idea of bare lead alloys being "polished" in my vibrator media either... that would have to introduce more lead dust into it than is necessary... right??

    Just my 2˘... if it's even worth that.
    *

  14. #54
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    So what scientific test are you basing your opinion on? I said its more of a mental thing to me. Not something wrote in stone. so are you saying too that its ok to tumble lead bullets in your dusty dirty media???? Remind me not to buy a gun from you.
    Quote Originally Posted by jmort View Post
    "... tumbling live rounds can break down powder cornels and powder coatings and change the burning rate of you powder and if your using conventionaly lubed bullets your impregnating dirt and dust into your lead bullets..."

    Wrong
    Wrong
    Wrong
    So much fail

  15. #55
    Boolit Master Whitespider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lloyd Smale View Post
    So what scientific test are you basing your opinion on? I said its more of a mental thing to me. Not something wrote in stone. so are you saying too that its ok to tumble lead bullets in your dusty dirty media???? Remind me not to buy a gun from you.
    There is no "real science" (that I'm aware of) to support any opinion about tumbling/vibrating loaded rounds with every smokeless propellant, under every conceivable variable. Informal tests, using specific and narrow conditions/propellants is not "science"... however, it does give a person a reason to believe (or justify) what they want (or choose) to believe.

    I'm in your camp Lloyd... my personal preference is to avoid putting loaded rounds (especially with bare lead exposed) in my vibrator. Not that I've never done it... I would never say never... but I'm uncomfortable with doing it for several reasons.
    *

  16. #56
    Boolit Master Whitespider's Avatar
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    Look at it this way...
    So some guy tests a half-dozen powders in his vibrator and found no change in appearance or at the chronograph... what does that mean?? Well, it means those half-dozen powders were apparently unaffected by his vibrator and his conditions... and it means no more than that.

    Vibration can be measured in frequency... like a radio wave... in hertz.
    So if his vibrator runs at, say, 30 Hz per second... how does that apply to my to my vibrator running at 40 Hz per second?? Or your vibrator running at 20 Hz per second??

    See what I mean?? Informal testing is not "science"... and it proves very little beyond the specifics of the informal test itself.
    *

  17. #57
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    I don't tumble/vibrate loaded ammunition. Lloyd, you made a backhanded statement with zero evidence to back it up. Others posted information that contridicated your unfounded opinions. Why not just say something like I have no idea what I am talking about, but my opinion is that ...., but you stated it catagorically, as fact, even though it was an opinion based on nothing.
    It is common knowledge that:

    "Many manufacturers of ammunition do a final cleaning of their product either by tumbling or a vibratory process before boxing it for shipment. In no case is this allowed to exceed more than just a couple of minutes. The intent is not so much to “polish” but to remove any traces of contaminants which might in time leave marks on the finished product. There seems to be a consensus among the ammunition manufacturing engineers that a minute or two of vibratory cleaning has no discernable effect on burning rates, especially for loads that are compressed, or nearly so. However, all have emphasized the need for EXTREME CAUTION not to overdo the process"

    There is a lot of information, aka , facts available if you wish to wash away your ignorance of the issue.
    Last edited by jmort; 04-28-2017 at 09:10 AM.

  18. #58
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    point is jmort that if your using a lanolin based lube a couple minutes in a tumbler will get you dirty lanolin on your cases. It takes a fair amount of time in a tumbler to get lanolin off a case. IF your were more conserned with helping the original poster and less in trying to prove me wrong in about every post your opinions would count a lot more here. bottom line is I never said it was anything but my opinion but it looks like its an opinion others share. Ammo manufactures might very well tumble for a couple minutes to put a shine on there ammo but they don't have the concern of tumbling off case lube. If I get under your skin so much you might want to consider the ignore function. Bottom line is nobody here has a ballistic lab so we are all either stating opinion or passing on someone elses opinion. Id have to say ive been around here long enough that my opinion is respected AT LEAST AS MUCH AS YOURS!

  19. #59
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    Fair enough
    I respect your long time membership
    I will steer clear of commenting on your posts
    Your knowledge of the big bore handguns is impressive

  20. #60
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    I respect your opinions too. You contribute a lot of good info here as well. This whole thing has gotten silly and I apologize for my part in it.
    Quote Originally Posted by jmort View Post
    Fair enough
    I respect your long time membership
    I will steer clear of commenting on your posts
    Your knowledge of the big bore handguns is impressive

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check