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Thread: lead and copper prices slowly coming down

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy catboat's Avatar
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    lead and copper prices slowly coming down

    See chart on link for lead and copper prices. Lead is coming down, now at ~ 1.28 $/lb, and copper is coming down, now at $2.92.

    http://www.infomine.com/Investment/H...rts.asp?c=Lead

    Still not as low as it was 2 years ago, but I like the trend. Hope it is still the trend in the months ahead.

  2. #2
    Boolit Bub
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    Magic "8" ball says "not likely".

  3. #3
    Boolit Master


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    Small market adjustment, although the largest adjustment in a while. Could be from industry they may be letting their stock piles/warehouse inventories adjust down for year end inventory reporting, that intern would lower demand and price. For how long this will last-God knows only. Now that the price is going down they/industry have to weigh cheaper lead vs cost of inventory,along with an election year comming on,oil prices up and down, housing slumped,economy going good, lots of snow/cold this year already,drought in some parts.Well you got the idea...

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy 38 Super Auto's Avatar
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    One factor that is pressuring metal prices is hybrid / electric vehicles. The electric motors require copper and batteries are consuming nickel.

    I know a lot of folks like the hybrid concept for vehicles, so I expect there to be continuing pressure on copper prices. I don't understand all the factors driving lead prices up.

    Here's a snippet from a usgs report for 2006.
    http://minerals.usgs.gov/minerals/pu...lead_mcs07.pdf

    [The lead-acid battery industry continued to be the principal user of lead, accounting for 88% of the reported U.S. lead consumption for 2006. Lead acid batteries were primarily used as starting-lighting-ignition (SLI) batteries for automobiles and trucks. Lead-acid batteries were also used as industrial-type batteries for uninterruptible power-supply equipment for computer and telecommunications networks and hospitals; for load-leveling equipment for commercial electrical power system; and as traction batteries used in airline ground equipment, industrial forklifts, mining vehicles, golf carts, etc. About 9% of lead was used in ammunition; casting material; sheets (including radiation shielding), pipes, traps and extruded products; cable covering, caulking lead, and building construction; solder; and oxides for glass, ceramics, pigments, and chemicals. The balance was used in ballast and counter weights.

    About 1.15 million tons of secondary lead was produced, an amount equivalent to 74% of reported domestic lead consumption. Nearly all of it was recovered from old (post-consumer) scrap.]
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  5. #5
    Boolit Buddy catboat's Avatar
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    Lead down to $1.18 / lb 12-11-07

    Lead is down under $1.20 /lb. (~ $1.18 / lb)

    Was up to $1.80 / lb two months ago. I wonder if it will be under $1.00 /lb by Jan 1 2008?

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy
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    Maybe it's time to drain the old mine at Bonne Terre MO and start digging some fresh stuff out of the ground!
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  7. #7
    Boolit Mold
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    You are looking at the short term projections for 1 month and 3 month. This is merely a camera shot of what is currently happening in the lead markets. To obtain a realistic view of what is to come, look at the 6 month and greater graphs - the trend lines are progressing in the positive direction (increased prices). Lead will not be coming down in price for a very long time to come. Just call a heavy metals supplier and ask for a quote for bullet metal - then call in 1 month for the same quote - the price will either be the same or more.

    Quote Originally Posted by catboat View Post
    See chart on link for lead and copper prices. Lead is coming down, now at ~ 1.28 $/lb, and copper is coming down, now at $2.92.

    http://www.infomine.com/Investment/H...rts.asp?c=Lead

    Still not as low as it was 2 years ago, but I like the trend. Hope it is still the trend in the months ahead.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Hope you are right. Lead shot was $49 a bag this week at Sportsman's Warehouse. Glad I bought a bunch for $24 last year..thought that was too high, but the price was goin' up.

    Maybe this is wishful thinking, but my experience is that metal prices go up, mines go into business (copper mines here in AZ). the market gets saturated, the price drops and the mines close. We'll see.
    NRA Endowment Life Member

  9. #9
    Boolit Buddy hotwheelz's Avatar
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    Are the prices you guys posting on pure lead? I can get ww from the local scrap yard for .60 a lb.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    Even if it does go down to what it was before this all hit the fan, I doubt any of us will see it.
    I remember quite a few years back when the hog market went to crap and a lot of guys lost their A$$. You could buy a 240 pound hog at the sale barn for $20. You sure didn't see it at the grocery store.
    I still laugh at one of the guys that used to come through the COOP I worked at then. He had taken some old cows to the sale. He was always looking for a bargain. He stopped back by and asked me if I wanted a couple of pigs, $2 each as he had just bought 12 of them for $12. I laughed said nope, but I went and looked any way. There wasn't 12 in the trailer, more like 35 or so. Found out later that guys were just dropping them off at the sale barn to get rid of them. If you weren't watching, guys loading you would throw a few "bonus" hogs in with what ever else you were loading.
    Want another example? Remember the deal on antifreeze around that same time? Ever see the price come back down?
    I hate to be "chicken little" the sky is falling. But, remember a few years back when they were going to tax the crap out of our componenets, or some such threat?
    Why give the taxes back to the system, why not just raise the price of all this stuff across the board for a more "personal" gain?
    "what goes up, must come down" does not always apply.
    Jeff

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    I had not looked at lead prices for a few months. The prices are falling quite dramatically. Looking at this 5 year chart you can plainly see the bubble. You can also see that the 2 most recent of the series of 3 trendlines (in blue) have been broken which is great for us WW/scrap buyers (never mind you guys still getting them for free ). No, price may never make it back to the lowest line but I'm hopeful it breaks the psychological $1 mark and finds support at $0.80 or even $0.65 (approx black lines). When at these prices on the way up I was buying WWs for $0.15/lb and since I know of no free sources this was better for me than driving all around burning gas looking for free WWs/offering doughnuts, beer, etc.

    Last edited by Ed K; 12-19-2007 at 01:58 PM.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    I read an article yesterday where the prognosticators were saying that China has taken a temporary break from copper buying, and they are increasing their domestic lead production as well. They said the down trend for copper was probably temporary, but expect lead to stay well below its 2007 highs.
    lathesmith

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy
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    Hi

    When you consider what the US dollar has been doing in the last few months, the price drop is even more amazing.

    Bob

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    The crash of the dollar now having an adverse impact on nearly all import prices, and most noticably so on commodities. Oil is hovering around 93 dollars a barrel; but that same barrel is bought with around 63 euros. Considering the dollar was at parity or above with the euro around 2000, that is a huge drop in value by our greenback. I expect this to get no better; the fed is slashing interest rates just as inflation is really heating up, and this will send the dollar even lower. All the fed cares about is propping up short-term equity prices; people are going to be rudely surprised to discover the central bank couldn't care less about inflation. They've put on a good act, but I think the game is just about up.
    lathesmith

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    About 18 months back lead was 50-60 cents and I bought WWs at the local scrapyard $0.15/lb. Wondering if I may get another chance to do that?


  16. #16
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    I am thinking that if the anti crowd gets their way and they make lead illegal to use in anything including bullets. The price of lead will fall, but we won't be able to use it. I hope that does not happen. Ron

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    Ron, we will just have to find places to shoot were no one will check us. Sure hope this doesn't happen.

  18. #18
    Boolit Buddy
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    Here's whats happening in my neck of the woods.
    Interstate Battery Company is dropping off these cute little buckets at all the tire dealerships and garages. They leave 4 to six at each stop. They are labled "Wheel Weights Only". They give the dealership a $20 credit for each full one they pick up on their route ( the Interstate Battery Salesman). Takes about 6 to seven of these buckets to fill up a regular 5 gallon bucket. Do the math. That puts a 5 gal bucket of WW at $120 to $140. Sucks.
    Ask an American Indian what uncontrolled immigration did for his lands and his way of life. Then, think about your children's and grandchildren's future.

  19. #19
    Boolit Buddy
    andremajic's Avatar
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    I'm still getting mine for free. I don't know for how long, but I'm stocking up while I can.

    Currently have about 300 lbs of ingots in the garage.

    Andy.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by idahoron View Post
    I am thinking that if the anti crowd gets their way and they make lead illegal to use in anything including bullets. The price of lead will fall, but we won't be able to use it. I hope that does not happen. Ron
    I don't think bullets count for very much in the worldwide picture of lead consumption but I don't have any facts on that. There are a lot of industrial applications for lead. Restrictions on use in Europe and to a lesser degree here in the US sure haven't put a damper in the prices.

    Recycling WWs seems to be catching on in a big way here in the US (now that lead is worth more than a few pennies/lb). From what I've gathered from this forum getting free WWs seems to be a regional thing. I have had very little luck doing that - mostly just burn time and gas trying. I'm fairly new to casting but at least had the foresight to by a bunch of WWs from my scrap dealer almost 2 years ago for $0.15/lb. At that price a bullet is still pretty cheap and the price of gas to hop from tire shop to tire shop sure isn't getting any cheaper. If I have the opportunity to buy more at anything near that price I will likely buy more. Kudos to you guys still getting them for free.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check