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Thread: 45 acp parent case?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

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    45 acp parent case?

    What was the parent case of the 45 acp?
    Or was the 45 acp an original concept?
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  2. #2
    Boolit Buddy
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    30-06

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Original JM Browning design.

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    Boolit Master
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    .45 Schofield

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    Boolit Grand Master Outpost75's Avatar
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    .380 ACP was introduced in 1908.

    The .45 ACP is a direct up-scale of the .380 ACP to .45
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    Boolit Grand Master bedbugbilly's Avatar
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    Wikipedia is your best friend . . . .

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.45_ACP

  7. #7
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    The 9x19 was introduced in 1902, so it may have influenced the design of the .45 acp as much as any other cartridge.

    Hope this helps.

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  8. #8
    Boolit Master pmer's Avatar
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    A while ago I saw a '06 case that suffered case/head separation and it would've gotten lost in a bucket of 45 ACP brass. I joked that's how JMB got the idea.
    Last edited by pmer; 03-24-2017 at 11:46 AM.
    Oh great, another thread that makes me spend money.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    The 1911 ended up as a further development of the 38 Auto pistol JMB made for the initial trails.
    So the whole pistol was pretty much set for 1.275" cartridge length.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    the 45 ACP has no parent case. It was designed by JMB. That it may be similar to the .380 does not make the .380 the parent case

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy
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    There are so many stories and influences to the .45 ACP that we will never know the total and true story. The performance was clearly influenced by nearly 50 years of .44 and .45 bore pistol performance on man and beast in war, gunfights, Indian fights, etc. The Scholfield's 230 grain .45 bullet at 725 fps (nominal) was the most recent example and I think it clearly guided the thinking of the time. I wish we could time travel and see what really happened, especially to see JMB in action. I've always said that the aliens brought him here because his ability was beyond belief, given the times and technology available.
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  12. #12
    Boolit Master


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    30/03 to find a case to cut off early last century.

    Why would JMB make a special new case he was defiantly not stupid and using an existing case modified would be much easier.

    The 380 came from a cutoff 9mm IMHO being a blow back he cut the case back so no high pressure 9mm would be a worry.

  13. #13
    Boolit Grand Master In Remembrance
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    What was the parent case of the 45 acp?
    45 ACP - no other parent case
    Regards
    John

  14. #14
    Boolit Grand Master
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    The diameter of the case near the solid head is the same as the 30-06 but the extractor groove is much larger on the 45 ACP.

    FWIW.

  15. #15
    Boolit Bub
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    I read a very interesting post a couple years ago by a very knowledgeable former gunsmith and moderator on another forum who said JMB based the 45 a.c.p. case on a 30-40 Krag that was cut down, which he, along with Colt then modified. Also in that post he wrote that JMB approached the Hercules powder company and it was determined that a smokeless shotgun powder they had recently developed had the ideal burn rate for the new pistol cartridge. This powder later became available to the public, and because of it's "unique" double-base design, was called, yup you guessed it, Unique.

  16. #16
    Boolit Grand Master

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    The US Army wanted a 45 cal. bullet so just makes sense that JMB designed the case around the bullet, the velocity , the fact that it would be loaded with smokeless powder sort of all conspired together to have it work out to what it is. Interesting that shorter and longer cases have come and gone but the original 1911 design keeps winning out. And even more amazing is the fact that John Browning did it all without the use of a computer, just think what he could have invented if he had a computer and a Smart Phone...
    Last edited by gwpercle; 03-24-2017 at 07:47 PM.
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  17. #17
    Boolit Master

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    Always heard that the army spec'd a 45 with at least 80% of 45 colt power. While simular, the 06 has slightly different extractor groove dimensions, so not a direct parent.
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  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    Why would JMB make a special new case he was defiantly not stupid and using an existing case modified would be much easier.

    The 380 came from a cutoff 9mm IMHO being a blow back he cut the case back so no high pressure 9mm would be a worry.
    The .380 is most definitely not a cut down 9x19, the bullet diameter and primer size is about all they have in common. As far as I am aware, JMB derived the .380 from his earlier 9mm Browning Long, itself a variant of the previous .38 ACP.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, 6.5 Creedmoor, .30 WCF, .308 WCF, .45-70.

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master bedbugbilly's Avatar
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    And let's not forget that the Army went from 45 to 38 which was deemed insufficient against the natives during the Philippine Insurrection. Thus, back to the 45 again.

  20. #20
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    They don't kick as much when shot with 45 acp that the reason all your elite forces still use the 45 acp.
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