California Lead Free bullets

[cwheel]

Some exceptional collective minds here. In the year 2019 all hunting in California has to be with lead free bullets. Bad law, but for the people who live there and hunt there, are going to have to deal with this bad law somehow. I'm wondering if there is anything we could somehow cast something that would work with the existing equipment we have and comply with this new law that is fast approaching. Some jacketed bullets in common sizes are now available that comply with the less than 1% lead requirements, fairly expensive though. There are many less than common sizes that we routinely will just size to fit the bores, ( +.002 ) Many here doing it with excellent results, I do in 38-55 @ .381 for a older bore rifle with great results. I myself escaped from California many years ago, but still have a son and grandson there, I'm the reloader, this problem will come to my door quickly loading the ammo to hunt there. New problem all for hunters in CA, any ideas outside of moving to a free state ?? Thanks,
Chris

[CPL Lou]

Expensive, but doable:

https://rotometals.com/lead-free-bul...ismuth-12-tin/

CPL Lou

[ubetcha]

I wonder how this alloy will perform as far as expansion goes at different volicity and yardages

[buckshotshoey]

Expensive, but doable:

https://rotometals.com/lead-free-bul...ismuth-12-tin/

CPL Lou

Very! $15.00 per pound!

[JBinMN]

I deleted my original reply as it was pretty political.

Here is my non political reply:


I would not pay the price of $14.99 + shipping to cast bullets due to what I consider a "knee jerk" law.

I dealt with this **** back in the late 70's in MInnesota about lead & waterfowl.

I would be happy to cast alternatives to lead if there is an economically feasible source of materials that hold the properties of lead. ( If bismuth was a buck a pound, then there would not be an issue , right?). Until then. NO way.

I think someone is out to make more than just a change to ecology here.... I think there is a $$ motivation to change things so folks can make a buck.

Too bad the Californians who this affects did not see it coming & put some opposition into the defense of their standards & way of life.

[runfiverun]

I'd just work up a load for some 150gr barnes bullets for my 30-06 then buy 3 more boxes of them and be done with it.
if you shoot 150+ deer in California in your lifetime your probably going to jail for the rest of it anyway.

[Texas by God]

I'd just work up a load for some 150gr barnes bullets for my 30-06 then buy 3 more boxes of them and be done with it.
if you shoot 150+ deer in California in your lifetime your probably going to jail for the rest of it anyway.

Very well put. Play with cast; hunt with mono whatever. Or move to a non Socialist state.

[tazman]

Not certain what the laws are in California, but here, if you are outside of a shooting range or your house, you are considered to be hunting if you have a firearm in your possession and ammunition for it. Doesn't matter if on private or public land. Just practicing with cast or sighting in your gun with "illegal" ammunition would be actionable by law enforcement.
As always, a lot depends on the views of the individual officer who "apprehends" you.

[Tenbender]

Move to Virginia but leave any liberal BS behind .

[oldblinddog]

Those kind of laws are made just to aggravate sportsmen and women. No other reason than plain evil vindictiveness. R5R has the right answer.

[skeeter2]

You can melt pennies and cast zinc bullets. They look really nice but are light for their size. Not sure how they shoot.

[P Flados]

Deer hunting with cast boolits and without lead would:

A: Be a stupid "politically correct" thing to do with no real justification.

B: Be a challenge

C: Both

Correct answer is probably C whether we like it or not.

Think zinc. Zinc is very very cheap. Zinc would not be all that good for most existing guns, but might be Ok in some.

I can buy over the counter Zinc at a fraction of the cost of lead. The downside would be that casting temps would need to go up, upside is that Zinc probably can be used with no lube or coating. PC coating might improve the Zinc option, but I will not go into that at this point.

Just consider customizing a gun for "lead free" zinc based hunting, I am thinking of a very fast twist 44 or 45 gun (444 / 45-75 cartridges would seem obvious, but I actually like other choices) with a RNFN and a profile much longer than we are used to. "Effective" range would be less than lead, but would probably meet the needs of many.

If I were designing a gun/boolit for a RNFP in Zinc, the boolit would have a long bore riding nose, and the full diameter portion would be as short as possible. With a 45 Colt case and a very short full diameter portion I could push a very long OAL round to probably 1500 to 2000 fps or even more out of a carbine length single shot.

Provided that you just choose to go big bore and non-expanding, the only real questions would be working out the optimum twist and boolit profiles you need to be effective at your chosen distances.

[Kevins750]

I am pretty sure whatever lead free bullet you use must be on an "OK list" on the fish and game website. They ask us to carry the original box that the ammo or bullets came in. I only reload for one caliber in lead free, the rest of the caliber's I buy commercial ammo.

https://www.wildlife.ca.gov/Hunting/...tion/Certified

[Texas by God]

Not certain what the laws are in California, but here, if you are outside of a shooting range or your house, you are considered to be hunting if you have a firearm in your possession and ammunition for it. Doesn't matter if on private or public land. Just practicing with cast or sighting in your gun with "illegal" ammunition would be actionable by law enforcement.
As always, a lot depends on the views of the individual officer who "apprehends" you.

Albany, Springfield,&Sacremento. The liberal sandwich of lawmaking.

[jessdigs]

Elvis Ammo on YouTube has been experimenting with casting zinc and getting good results. They are a little light though

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

[finstr]

I'm with the Barnes bullet crowd. I've shot moose with them and they work really well out of the 338wm. I only shoot 5 or 6 rounds to check the zero and would be lucky to shoot one or two more at an animal per year. Not exactly expensive.

[snowtigger]

Here in Alaska, I've never thought about it, but how about tin? Or pewter, REAL English pewter.

[runfiverun]

I wouldn't use Tin.
I'd use zinc first.
Zinc boolits are nothing new they are lighter and a lot faster but lose energy [velocity] much quicker.
they used to be commercially available back in the late 50's early 60's and had some favorable reviews in a few gun magazines.
of course their caveat was keeping the shots within arrow range.
this was also back when a fancy bow was a recurve with a balance weight on it.

if I was pushed to use a cast projectile I'd be looking at hevi-shot real hard.

[P Flados]

Not only does the land of fruits and nuts want lead free, their web site adds more special requirements:

• While the Department has certified various nonlead alternative projectiles for hunting with firearms, big game may only be taken by rifles using centerfire cartridges with softnose or expanding projectiles. Projectiles designed as frangible (disintegrating) or fractional (separates into distinct parts) are not a legal method of take for big game species (as defined in Sections 350, 353 and 475(c), T14, CCR).

Sounds like they want lead free, centerfire rifles, softnose or expanding, but not frangible or fractional.

- What about shotguns or black powder
- What about traditional big bore non-expanding

From what I saw on the "lead free" vendor data sheets, many do not meet the other requirements for big game.

Expanding solid copper bullets are probably a reasonable technology but are expensive and have limitations. Given the limitations of solid copper, they really need to allow non-expanding big bore flat nosed.

[clum553946]

What really gets expensive out here is varmint hunting. We can't just grab the 22 & squirrel hunt anymore! Lead free bullets for small calibers for reloading are cost prohibitive!