California Lead Free bullets

[Leadmelter]

The state is $30 Billion dollars in debt and is worried about 2 lrs. Jerry try fixing your dam and water issues.
We have lots of water in MI and the legislator know not to mess with sportsmen.
Good Luck
Leadmelter
MI

[Plate plinker]

There is a big difference between passing stupid laws, enforcing stupid laws, and complying with stupid laws.

From what I've seen, the vast majority of hunters will comply with the laws in CA because they are...for the most part...legitimate law abiding people.

When push comes to shove, the big city politicians will be surprised one day when they discover that the majority of the state does not agree with the left's extreme policies regarding gun ownership, 2nd amendment rights and hunter's rights. The day will come, mark my word.

Surfdog

Good attitude get after it.

[dbosman]

I've only done a quick search, but can't find this information. Can you help please?

I am using Hornady unleaded. I was using Barnes until I found out that the fellow behind Barnes is the fellow that gave Sen McCarthy her justification for this asinine law.

[Bigslug]

Pop ordered up some of the Rotometals bismuth-based stuff for testing. Got it to where it's workable, but, at least as far as water jugs as a test medium go, you need to up the tin content to keep it from shattering. How it does in meat, I've got no idea.

We've pretty much decided that if it's a standard bore, shoot Barnes. They work great, and for hunting with the annual zero check, the cost is absorbable. Use cast to practice with. If you're wanting to plug a California critter with great granddad's .478 Odd Bore Express, figure on sucking it up and spending cash to contribute to the knowledge base - cuz I don't know of anyone yet who's dove headfirst into the non-lead hunting mosh pit.

[JBinMN]

I've only done a quick search, but can't find this information. Can you help please?

I actually went looking a bit also & could not find it in that short search. I did find this article though from a few years ago & it is a complete reversal from thinking Barnes folks are for this lead ban. At least from what the article says.

Here is a snip from the article:

“When my father (Randy Brooks) went to all-copper, it had nothing to do with the environment,” Jessica Brooks-Stevens, daughter of X Bullet inventor Randy Brooks, said Monday at the 36th Annual SHOT Show in Las Vegas. “His reasons were so far from that it’s not even funny. It was more about performance. It only happened to work for the condor issue in California.“We don’t support the legislation. We think this type of legislation is bad for hunting, bad for the base. People shoot lead-core ammunition because it’s cheaper to shoot. I know some hunters in California who have put their guns up over this. That’s not good for our sport. Bans like this hurt the future of the sport for everyone.”

Brooks-Stevens said Barnes copper bullets will cost hunters 50 to 75 percent more to purchase.
“Pure copper is expensive,” she said.

Production of the non-lead bullet is at a high level, Brooks-Stevens said, to keep up with the huge demand for ammunition that is happening right now thanks to a huge increase in recreational shooters and an uptick in hunting numbers in some areas. More women than ever are taking up recreational shooting and hunting, recent surveys show.

“We’re increasing our production as quickly as we can to meet demand,” Brooks-Stevens said. “And we want to make sure California hunters are taken care of, too.”

Source: http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/...n14-story.html

There is a previous article about this ban to look at also if one has the inclintaion:
http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/...g30-story.html

The search terms I used were: >>> Sen McCarthy california hunting Barnes bullets lead <<<<

So, unless the one who posted up about this comes through on a link or something. The statement appears to be 180 deg. from what is being published. Maybe it is a case of the "telephone game", & things got mixed up? That has happened before to a lot of folks. Particularly on "hot" topics like this one...

Anyway, IMO, it is a screwed up law & those folks in Cal. have a lot of issues to deal with, & this one is not helping anyone that I can figure out...

[Chev. William]

Please consider: I live in the San Fernando Valley area of the City of Los Angeles; within Los Angeles County of California. I am a Registered Republican Voter who is in a Voting Precinct that is a plurality Democratic Party registered Voters.
I am a Retired And disabled Veteran Who grew up in the same general Area I live in now.
In my youth, we neighborhood kids did go "hunting" with .22 RF rifles in the Hills surrounding us by Walking from home to the hills carrying our rifles and ammo. Never had ANY problems doing that.
But that was then and this is now.
the State bans Concealed Carry; the State Bans Open Carry; the State mandates Trigger Locks on Firearms being transported: The State Mandates firearms be in a Locked container in a Locked place OUTSIDE the Passenger Area of Vehicles transporting Them: the state mandates Ammo be in a separate place from the Firearm(s) both in transport and in storage; My local Commercial Outdoor Shooting Range bans use of any "Magnetic Ammunition" to boot.

There are now Laws, Rules, Regulations, and Ordinances enacted by all three Levels of government Banning Youth access, possession and use of Firearms so we are NOT allowed to teach Firearms Safety and Safe Handling nor Safe Hunting to the 'next generation in the Best Learning period of their Lives.

This is the "One Size Fits All" decision of Entrenched Political Powers here. The Existing Voting and Election Laws preserve their Power now so it is nearly Impossible to either propose changes or Elect an Opposition Candidate to the Entrenched Power Elite.

I Still Continue to Fight by my Votes, but sadly my vote is in the Minority side of the Ledger.
I hope others will come to their senses and also Vote to replace or Reverse this State's Sad conditions.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[Josh Smith]

I've been thinking about buying a lathe to turn monolithic copper bullets.

I live in a free state, but I expect these types of laws to spread throughout the nation, either faster or slower depending on who's elected, but I believe they will spread.

In fact, I expect to see a non-lead section on Cast Boolits one day.

I'm actually surprised to see that nobody is making mild steel bullets, copper-washed like the old Russian stuff.

Regards,

Josh

[Chev. William]

Check the FEDERAL rules on Bullet Materials Allowed and Not allowed.

Chev. William

[DanishM1Garand]

Check the FEDERAL rules on Bullet Materials Allowed and Not allowed.

Chev. William

these no lead laws run right into the federal armor piercing bans.

Sigh.

[TexasGrunt]

these no lead laws run right into the federal armor piercing bans.

Sigh.

Don't think that's not a coincidence either.

[cwheel]

I notice that Midway does stock some Hornady non lead. Not cheap, but they are available.
Chris

[BAGTIC]

I wonder if the leadless 22 RF is frangible? It seems similar to the old 22 Short 'Spatterless' gallery loads which used iron powder and a plastic binder.

It seems that if one used the shortened case used in Aquila's 60 grain subsonic load and replaced the lead 60 grain with iron it should weigh about 40 grains

[Fishman]

You know, when liberals don't agree with a law they march, throw rocks at police, burn cars, and loot. When conservatives don't agree, they complain a bit then see what they have to do to comply.

If a a couple thousand California gun owners went to their local hunting spot with some leaded ammo and "hunted" I wonder what would happen? I'm pretty sure no looting would occur. Logic would indicate that there wouldn't be enough game wardens to deal with it.

Conservatives need to be better at joining hands rather than beating their chest and saying "I alone will not comply!" I know this because I are one.

Just some one idle thoughts while perusing this thread.

[flint45]

You know, when liberals don't agree with a law they march, throw rocks at police, burn cars, and loot. When conservatives don't agree, they complain a bit then see what they have to do to comply.

If a a couple thousand California gun owners went to their local hunting spot with some leaded ammo and "hunted" I wonder what would happen? I'm pretty sure no looting would occur. Logic would indicate that there wouldn't be enough game wardens to deal with it.

Conservatives need to be better at joining hands rather than beating their chest and saying "I alone will not comply!" I know this because I are one.

Just some one idle thoughts while perusing this thread.

I agree completely you are right I think it is because we are so busy trying to just earn a living and taking care of our family we don't have time to organize but we would never act like the liberals do destroy someone else property or lay in the streets.

[flint45]

I deleted my original reply as it was pretty political.

Here is my non political reply:


I would not pay the price of $14.99 + shipping to cast bullets due to what I consider a "knee jerk" law.

I dealt with this **** back in the late 70's in MInnesota about lead & waterfowl.

I would be happy to cast alternatives to lead if there is an economically feasible source of materials that hold the properties of lead. ( If bismuth was a buck a pound, then there would not be an issue , right?). Until then. NO way.

I think someone is out to make more than just a change to ecology here.... I think there is a $$ motivation to change things so folks can make a buck.

Too bad the Californians who this affects did not see it coming & put some opposition into the defense of their standards & way of life.

We did see it coming and we did all we could California is run by extreme left wing democrats and that got rammed through like you know what through a goose not enough of us to stop everything and no help from ammo companies its not a up hill battle its more like up the side of a cliff on a rope with one arm!

[mold maker]

Just another liberal step toward what they think will be a utopia. Since Hillery didn't win they are having to take small steps to a total gun free society.
Don't look at it as a single step to a landing, it's just a single step in a long series of stairs taken one at a time.
They know that if they can make it expensive enough we will just give up.
Current technology hasn't spent the time and money to come up with the answer because they know that whatever they come up with, is only a pen stroke away from the next ban. This is in no way a new problem but is only the latest effort. There will always be a condor or a snail darter to hold up as the champion's cause.

[Echo]

How about depleted uranium? Heavier than Pb - don't know about what temp it melts at - don't know about residual radiation - don't know a lot - but it WOULDN'T BE LEAD!

[Harter66]

DU machines like mild steel and is as formable . The radiation is only a problem if you eat it , ingestion and injection will lead to all of the radiation issues . Breathing the dust is a problem also .
It weighs nearly twice what lead does so you could cut out a bullet shaped like a 260-120 at 258-100 and paper patched for your 264 WM and it would tip in about 190gr .....
Oh yeah it's pyrophoric too.

[TexasGrunt]

We did see it coming and we did all we could California is run by extreme left wing democrats and that got rammed through like you know what through a goose not enough of us to stop everything and no help from ammo companies its not a up hill battle its more like up the side of a cliff on a rope with one arm!

Every ammo company and the NRA could have spent themselves into bankruptcy and it would not have made a difference. The Progressive Left is in control and NOTHING but the Supreme Court, or rebellion is going to stop them.

[OuchHot!]

CA has a super majority in both house and senate of ultra-left. Voting makes no difference if you disagree with the extreme left. They can pass every law they desire with no impact from dissenting votes. The next governor will make gov. moonbeam look like Regan. Soros puts tens of millions into the elections here and the media has long been bought and paid for. Ranges are being closed throughout the state due to supposed lead pollution in spite of intensive mining of berms (lead is worth $$) and nonexistent proof of Pb in runoff.. What kills me is I do know gun owners that vote left wing. They are also on the dole. They want that "free stuff". The initial announcement of the Barnes connection to the white paper promoting lead free bullets was written up in the CRPA newsletter back when the few of us were fighting the inevitable. Hey, we had a fish and wildlife (not "fish and game" anymore) commissioner that wasn't totally left wing (the only one). The idiot had killed (LEGALLY) a mtn. lion in Colo. and had the image on facebook. That was the end of him! Imagine, a Fish and "wildlife" commissioner hunting legally. What an outrage! This is a large state with enormous ag and range revenue totally run by the city ghettos.