New Casting Woes (picture laden)

[adam_mac84]

Hopefully the pic worked.

Casted 211 (after throw aways) bullets today from my 235/125/2R mold I received yesterday in the mail. I did do a few yesterday after doing some heat cycles. Set up the mold per Lee instructions. I think I got 2 bullets in teh 0.356 range. Nearly too large to chamber (certainly not with PC). I had hoped to coat and shoot as cast, (i know, a pipe dream), but this is starting to concern me... quite a large range of sizes (and shapes were produced). In the next post I will include some pics of the bullets and mold (need to post from my phone). I am fine with the 130grain weights (over the 125), just means I need to find more wheel weights.

Cast from Lee Bottom pour. ~700 deg accd to Lyman Thermometer. Was getting decent bullets at around 650/670, but the spout would freeze between casts and I would have to free up with a lighter (was ~35* in garage). I did smoke the molds, and they were dropping fairly easily. Occasionally a shake or tap (on the handle hinge) with a dowel.

Any other information that may help yield insights I will try to provide.

[adam_mac84]

That is daylight with mold squeezed shut.



Bases were really messy. With overhang on them. Measured this way to give better chance of clean measurement.



This scoring concerns me




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[adam_mac84]

Plated and FMJ pills were used to validate my measurements/weights to eliminate error

Rounds were a random sample from the pile. I did take measurements at 650, 700, 750 and 800* on Lyman Thermometer... did not see a huge change in bullet diameter, cooler temps yielded cleaner bullet bases. The one shown above was one of the better ones... the others were a bit more 'pitted'.

[adam_mac84]

Plated and FMJ pills were used to validate my measurements/weights to eliminate error

Rounds were a random sample from the pile. I did take measurements at 650, 700, 750 and 800* on Lyman Thermometer... did not see a huge change in bullet diameter, cooler temps yielded cleaner bullet bases. The one shown above was one of the better ones... the others were a bit more 'pitted'.

Example of base. Lower temp improved this






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[scb]

option #1 search this forum for "lee-menting" and follow advice given.
option #2 throw in garbage AND BUY A GOOD MOULD instead of junk.
let the flaming begin.

[adam_mac84]

option #1 search this forum for "lee-menting" and follow advice given.
option #2 throw in garbage AND BUY A GOOD MOULD instead of junk.
let the flaming begin.

. Thank you for your help. I have researched "lee-menting", and do not find that my sprue pin has stripped, nor my handles fallen out. I guess the bullet molds may need lapping, but I do not see how that would help grossly oversized bullets in this case. I will continue to read on the subject to see if there is additional information that I am missing

[TexasGrunt]

There's two reasons you can see daylight though the mold.

1. There's particles of lead on the face of the mold. This will also affect the diameter. Clean the face of the mold.

2. The mold is warped. It's a Lee, not worth saving.

Lee molds are designed to cast with Lyman #2 as I recall.

I have a Lee 124 gr TC mold and it too is all over the place as far as diameter goes. I have a RCBS 124 gr TC mold and it's spot on. Sometimes you get lucky with a Lee mold and other times you don't.

[Larry Gibson]

adam

Are you an experienced castor or is this your first attempt?

How are you fluxing?

Take the handles off the mould blocks. Clean the mould blocks including cleaning all the "smoke" out of the cavities. Check the face of the blocks for any burrs or alloy deposits. Remove the sprue plate (the sprue plate screw may have reverse threads). Put the blocks together and see if that daylight is still there. If it is you have to figure out why (or return the mould to Lee). If there is a burr you must find and remove it. look for the base of the pins, male and female, to be flush with or slightly below the face of the blocks. If they protrude at all tap them in with a plastic or brass mallet until the base is flush with the face of the mould blocks. If the blocks fit together without that gap then something else other than a problem with the mould blocks is holding them apart.

With a medium to fine stone deburr the edges of the sprue plate. Small strips of medium to fine sand paper may be used also. Put the sprue plate back on and with the blocks together holding only the blocks look through the holes to see fi the gap is there. If not put the blocks on the handles and lube the pins and holes with Bullplate or a similar lube.


I also lube the top of the blocks and the face of the sprue plate being careful not to get lube in the cavities. A Q-tip works well for this.

Put the blocks on the mould handles and just lightly hold the blocks together. Look again for the gap, there should be none. If there is reverse the mould handles in the blocks and make sure the handles are closing the blocks via riding on the pins and not pressing against the mould blocks. A little filing on the inside of the handle jaws may be needed.

What the above is the QC work you didn't pay for with the Lee moulds.

If you are using COWWs for an alloy flux very well, a couple times at least, then add 2% tin and flux again. Make up additional alloy to add as you cast. Adjust the temp of the alloy to 715 - 725 degrees and maintain that temp by adding the sprues and additional alloy to the pot to keep the temp as consistent as you can.

You will not need to "element" or enlarge the cavities. Do not smoke the cavities. That will get you inconsistent sizes, with many undersize, of bullets. Bring the mould blocks to casting temp with a hot plate or by dipping the corner of the blocks into the molten alloy (at casting temp) just long enough until the alloy doesn't stick to the blocks. I am a "dipper" and have cast thousands of bullets with numerous Lee 6 cavity moulds. Now cast bullets.

Holt the mould handles only, do not hold the sprue cut off handle at all. Doing so can easily pivot the mould blocks slightly apart. Disregard the first two casting worth and add the bullets and sprue back to the pot. Fill each cavity completely one at a time allowing a good sprue to build up. I set the mould down on and asbestos glove for the sprue to harden and use that time to add the sprue back to the pot. adjust the tempo so you get good bullets that are not frosting.

Be glad to assist further if necessary. Good luck and good casting.

Larry Gibson

[gwpercle]

Listen to Larry Gibson. Casting has a steep learning curve. You can cast decent boolits with a Lee mould. Buying a $100.00 mould will not magically turn you into a Master Caster.
I bought an EXPENSIVE Fender Stratocaster guitar and guess what....I still couldn't play the darn thing.
Keep working at it , follow Larry's advice...it's dead on, keep posting and asking questions, you will get there. I can tell you that if you learn to cast with Lee moulds, you will be able to cast with any mould. I started with 1 and 2 cavity steel Lyman moulds , then went to Lee's when they came out.
Being a new caster , that 6 cavity Lee is no easy mould to learn with ...but you can do it.
Good luck,
Gary

[armoredman]

A Stratocaster won't instantly make me Eddie Van Halen? I want my money back.....

[GhostHawk]

A Larry is right. Larry has forgotten more about casting, shooting, reloading than most of us will ever learn. Believe Larry. Listen to him.

B Lee molds are like the CVA Muzzleloader kits of the 70's. Some user assembly work and knowledge required. They are a KIT, if you know what your doing, know how to tune it, know how to run it you can get it in most cases to produce what you want. Shootable boolits.

If your going to be fussy about size, weight, etc, spend 5 times as much for one of those good molds.

That being said I find the Lee 6 cavity a world of quality better than the 2 cavitys.

I also take a file, then a stone to the edge of the sprue plate, rounding it slightly so it won't gall, scrape and scar the top of the mold blocks. Some are much better than others. But some are stamped out and leave a sharp slight raised edge.

Temp is vital, learning to recognise the signs as to what is warm but not warm enough, what is just right, and what is too hot tends to be the hard part. But once learned becomes second nature.

Last, every Lee mold is an individual with its own quirks. I wish someone had told me to start a notebook and keep notes on what I learned about each. So I am telling you. Do it.

After you have 15 molds and have worn out and replaced a few they get hard to remember which was which and which one wanted what. Pencil and paper are your friend. And I hate to write.

Trust Larry.

[adam_mac84]

Thank you all.

Larry. I flux when melting the WW with wooden stir stick. Scraping sides etc. in the pot after melting ingots I was using paraffin wax as flux.

I have cleaned the sprue plate. And checked some of the items you mentioned Larry. Thank you

I am just looking for steel plate and action shooting bullets here. Minute of bad guy type stuff. I will also contact Lee in the AM to see what they know about things.


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[DSRichert]

Load them and shoot em

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[Shiloh]

option #1 search this forum for "lee-menting" and follow advice given.
option #2 throw in garbage AND BUY A GOOD MOULD instead of junk.
let the flaming begin.

I have quality boolits from LEE molds. Some more take more work than others. I also have Lyman molds, an old Ideal, and will have a NOE.

Shiloh

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

The most common cause of varied boolit diameters from a Lee 6 cavity mold, as you charted (.357 to .367 ...WOW), is what Larry mentioned, "Hold the mould handles only, do not hold the sprue cut off handle at all. Doing so can easily pivot the mould blocks slightly apart."
I'll also add, when casting with any boolit mold, a firm and consistent grip on the mold handles during the pour and as they solidify, will give the best consistent results...lubing the alignment pins helps a lot as well.

[runfiverun]

check your alignment pins.
I'd say your front one needs to be tapped in a tick.

[mozeppa]

i own a 79 stratocaster....and i am eddie van halen.

















okay...i'm not.

[psweigle]

I'm thinking you have a bad lee mold. It happens. Sent your pictures to lee and see what they have to say. I had one that was warped and they sent me a new one in 3 days.

[Walter Laich]

I had a Lee mold that let in light like yous. Would wack (scientific mold term) it closed each time before pouring lead in; used a piece of wood so I wouldn't the denting the aluminum mold blocks. After a half-dozen or so wacks the mold would close nice and tight. Figured I was 'seating' the mold halves and wore away the high points.

Also the heat seemed to help the fit of the two halves.

It's one of my 'enjoyable' molds now.

[hutch18414]

After you get that Lee mold kit sorted out I would recomend searching for a thread by Goodsteel called "consistency in casting". It gives some really good advice on getting the most consistent bullets out of your casting sessions. Instead of having my bullet weight vary by 3-4 grains my average is + or - .7 grs. using his methods and tips. Casting is a lot like that Stratocaster, you get out of it what you put into it. If you are willing to put a little time and effort in the results can be fantastic. Although I prefer my Les Paul Custom to a Strat at times, I still own a vintage 71 Strat. And regardless of the mold snobs with plenty of money, Lee molds can produce fine bullets. That 7/10 grain variation is with a Lee mold.And the last time I weight sorted 180 gr SMK bullets, I had more variation than that.