Strength of Handi Rifle

[olafhardt]

I have a Handi I bought in 500 S&W magnum to play with some years ago. That cartridge was pressure rated at 65k psi and a larger diameter than the 458 belted magnums. This requires a lot of strength from these actions. I occasionally read about the "twelve gauge from hell" which seems to take advantage of this quality. Also if one is using rimmed brass there seems to be limitted if any chance of brass failure. Therefore, the RIFLE Handi actions have been used and tested in applications requiring very high strength. I am looking for commentary on this.

[Paul5388]

I have a .25-06 Handi and the SAAMI pressure spec for it is 63,000 psi. My .243 is rated for 60,000 psi. I think they are plenty strong.

[NoAngel]

Only the SB-2 frame has any strength to it.
It is quite strong but the barrel lug is a weak link. They are notorious for peening the lug with heavy loads because of the poor quality steel used in the barrel lug.

I have a 358 Win on an SB2 frame. It's about the most accurate rifle I've ever loaded for. Sadly I can't (I refuse) get a 358's full potential from this rifle. The action has
already loosened significantly. A 230g at 1825fps is about as hard as I dare.

The shotgun/muzzle loader/pistol caliber frames are SB1's & they are cast and far too weak for high pressure loads.

[GhostHawk]

From what I have seen the shotgun receivers aka SB1's can be brittle. A load that a SB2 or rifle receiver will spring and snap back can shatter the SB1.

Ok for low pressure, pistol calibers but not much more.

You can't go by anything except taking the stock bolt out and looking.

If it is a one piece solid cast with a threaded hole for the stock bolt it is a SB1.

SB2's are investment cast of better material and have a couple of "windows" in the back. You would think they would be weaker but they are not.

Don't believe me go read the FAQ's at http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/108-h-r...re-rifles.html in the Handi Centerfire section. Those guys know all there is to know.

[NoAngel]

Ghosthawk is right. Graybeard has the best collection of Handi info on the web.

[Texas by God]

Only the SB-2 frame has any strength to it.
It is quite strong but the barrel lug is a weak link. They are notorious for peening the lug with heavy loads because of the poor quality steel used in the barrel lug.

I have a 358 Win on an SB2 frame. It's about the most accurate rifle I've ever loaded for. Sadly I can't (I refuse) get a 358's full potential from this rifle. The action has
already loosened significantly. A 230g at 1825fps is about as hard as I dare.

The shotgun/muzzle loader/pistol caliber frames are SB1's & they are cast and far too weak for high pressure loads.

Is your .358 a JES rebore? Best, Thomas.

[NoAngel]

No
It was a 357 magnum that was sucking in the accuracy department. Didn't want to go to 357 maximum so I ordered a reamer from Manson.
Pretty easy to do.

[Paul5388]

I was banned from Greybeard's years ago for stating a shotgun action is sufficient for .357 mag, like the old Topper. I recently saw where the .357 and .44 mag are both built on sb1 actions.

[EDG]

There are several different actions with different characteristics.
The large firing pin low pressure SB 1 actions can blow the firing pins out with a high pressure rifle barrel and the escaping parts and gas will be very near your face and eyes.

All of the Handis have a long load path. That is the material under load is long. The action body from the barrel pivot pin to the rear locking link pin takes the load. This long section of the receiver behaves just like a spring. In addition the barrel shank from the pivot pin to the breech face is under compression. Together the two lengths under load are nearly 6 inches long.
If you want less spring you make the loaded length shorter. You can see the load path has been shortened, at considerable expense, on the Remington 3200 over and under shotgun. Take a look at the locking lugs on the side of the monoblock that lock into the side walls of the receiver. Put those on a Handi and it would be much stronger and more expensive.


The various front locking Mauser bolt rifles for example have a very short loaded section. The Lee-Enfield and the early Swiss Schmidt Rubin rear locking designs have very long load paths and a lot of action elasticity.
Some of the strongest, shortest load paths are the #1 Ruger and the 1885 Winchester. Both have short (from barrel thread to back of the breech block) and heavy receiver side walls taking the load.

At the lower out side rear of the Rem 3200 monoblock you can see a large unblued lug immediately below the extractor. There is a lug on both sides of the monoblock and locking shoulders inside both sides of the receiver. When you close the gun the locking lugs and shoulders take up all the fore and aft firing forces. The hinge pin does nothing but allow the barrels to pivot when the sliding top cover is opened.
The load path on this shotgun is very short and is very heavy. Consequently these guns last for hundreds of thousands of rounds in competition.

[Paul5388]

My .357 mag is built on an old cast H&R shotgun receiver and it functions just fine. The larger unsupported firing pin does create some problems with rifle calibers and wasn't too desirable in .22 Hornet.

[flint45]

I have never heard of one in .500 s&w failing, I mostly would shoot less then max loads any way and save the max loads for serious business anyway.

[Jedman]

I have owned more than 25 of them, and have built / converted many more to wildcat calibers.
I am of the same opinion as NoAngle as the weak link is the barrel lug. Really there design in my opinion is not good for hi pressure bottle necked cartridges as they all seem to loosen quickly and after you start shimming them it is a never ending necessity.
They are good for what they are and can be quite accurate as well. Easy to understand and work on, sad they were discontinued.

Jedman

[leftiye]

Maybe a barrel stub with integral underlug.

[GhostHawk]

Well my 2 cents is that I prefer them in straight walled rimmed cases. Yep, .357, .444 Marlin. I do not have a .45-70 yet, but I am not in the grave yet either.

In bottle neck cartridges I prefer moderate loads.

I have a stubb job in 9mm that does fine work once I figured out what size boolit it wanted.

Personally I tend to shy away from the fast burners, .243, .270. I do have one in .223 but I think I have only fired half a dozen factory loads in it. Mostly I shoot a somewhat reduced bater 55 gr with gas check over 7 grains of Red Dot. And an unchecked bater over 4.6 grains of Red Dot.

The later makes a great .22lr replacement. And the single shot just helps you to slow down, be patient, pick your shot and make it count the first time.
But that is me, your mileage may vary.