Respect the diversity in our hobby

[54bore]

This is geared toward respecting each individual in our sport of Muzzleloading, be it man, woman, or youth. Traditional, non Trad, etc. Every one of us are entitled to our opinions, whether you shoot Patched Round Ball, Lubed bullets, Paper Patched bullets, on shore, off shore guns, etc. It is a fun hobby GO OUT AND ENJOY IT!! It's very obvious that not all of us are gonna agree on certain things, methods, etc. That doesn't mean my way is superior to yours, or yours to mine, etc. each of us are entitled to our opinions! It would be a pretty darn boring world if we all thought alike! I respect you guys that choose Patched Round Ball, dressing up like the olden days (Rendezvous's) etc. As most of you know it's not my thing, and that doesn't matter! I try and share my opinion, and help others in the area of the hobby i have chosen (Paper Patched and sized bullets, Peep sights, and how to make it all come together and work the way i have chosen from my success to my non success, etc.) Guys like rfd, and Waksupi just to name a few are Authorities on Trad stuff, if i were to go that route it's guys like that i would seek for help, and there knowledge in the sport, as i know very little to nothing in the areas they excell in. Again its all about having fun, and enjoying this great hobby of Muzzleloading whichever route you choose.

[fivegunner]

Yep, that`s the way I think.

[dbarry1]

Yeah, but that percussion thing is just a fad, it will never catch on... :O)

[54bore]

When i first started dabbling with this Muzzleloader stuff i found Idahoron on YouTube and i was Fascinated that he could hit a kill size target at 300 Yards with an old TC Hawken sidelock and Peep sights, That fascinated me and set a fire in me to do the same thing! From his Paper Patching bullets, to his cleaning Regimen, Swabbing between shots, over powder wads, etc. i started following everything he done (i figured he put it out there to share and i took full advantage of it!) There are a few things i have changed to suit me, but i really owe what I've learned in this to Ron, he gave me the knowledge i needed to get started. Johnson1942 has shared a bunch of knowledge with me as well, i am currently having a custom Paper Patch bullet mold made from Roger's advise on bullet length per twist ratio, Thank you Roger! I look forward to getting the mold and playing with it!
I also enjoy watching videos of rfd and Waksupi with their Flintlocks and Patched Round Balls, those men know their business! While its not my particular thing i respect those guys and their knowledge!! I can't leave bubba.50 out with his advise on a possibles bag (Ammo Can! LOL) that is an upgrade from my doubled up plastic grocery bags!
When i state an Opinion i might seem a bit harsh in my wording but i truly don't mean it that way, i am not trying to push anything down anyones throat, you are free to take what i say or leave it! I am not intentionally trying to belittle or degrade anyone in their chosen methods of our sport, We can all learn something here if we care to, there are some very knowledgeable guys here! But again its all about having fun and enjoying this sport, whichever route you choose.

[dverna]

Oh my!!!! It is just so icky!

Really though you are correct. And more so it needs to apply to those who do not shoot black powder---like me.
Whatever turns your crank is good for you.

I know I could not accomplish what you guys do.

Don Verna

[RU shooter]

Yeah, but that percussion thing is just a fad, it will never catch on... :O)

match lock crowd said the same about the flint guys ! Lol why would anyone use a rock !!!!

[rodwha]

I've been meaning to take the advice of several and buy the book by Ned Roberts as I want a field hunting rifle topped with a Malcolm scope that I can have a point blank range with about 4" +/- out to 200 yds.

I don't know that I could shoot like Ron, but he amazes me doing what he does!

[54bore]

I've been meaning to take the advice of several and buy the book by Ned Roberts as I want a field hunting rifle topped with a Malcolm scope that I can have a point blank range with about 4" +/- out to 200 yds.

I don't know that I could shoot like Ron, but he amazes me doing what he does!

Ron definately has a system DOWN and is DARN good at it!! My eyesight is my downside, i cut my right eyeball with a jagged stick logging years ago, my eyesight has never been the same, i was prescribed glasses after i healed and had my sight checked, that was probably 20 years ago and i never wore them a day, dont even know where they are anymore? Plus my eyes have aged 20 years since the accident so its doubtful they would work anyway, i need to break down, go get my eyes checked and get current glasses or contacts. If i close/squint my left eye just like i was going to shoot the 10" clock on my wall at 20 feet i can't read the numbers, they are blurry/hazy to me. These peep sights actually help my eye, by narrowing down to a fine hole my vision seems to get better, hence why i have Peep sights on 5 of the 6 Muzzleloaders i own (that was a bit spendy but a necessity to me) The only rifle i have that does not have a Peep sight yet is my TC Seneca, i have been searching for the correct TC Tang Peep designed for the Seneca/Cherokee, The Seneca tang is quite a bit narrower than a Hawken/Renegade, i hate to botch this little rifle up with something that is not designed for it.

[koger]

Well said .54 Bore. I am a total ML geek. I shoot everything from Flintlocks, percussion, modern inlines with scopes, a copy of a Whitmore fast twist Ml from 1860s to my neighbors cannon! I shoot on the line at Friendship, shoot the woods walk where you have to dress at local matches, and just go shoot at the range. I have always had a love affair with southern longrifles, from my childhood. I ran a gunsmithing/gunshop for years, built a lot of super accurate hunting/varmint/F class bolt actions and accurized hundreds of factory bolt actions, have did this for close to 30 years. I still enjoy shooting ML's and .22's more than anything else. For me super accurate varmint rifles, get boring pretty quick, as shooting 100-500yds from a decent rest, with good glass and hand loaded ammo is not much of challenge. Keep 5 shots in the 10 ring at 25 and 50 offhand with open sighted ML is always a challenge! Shooting a woods walk, from 15-`150yds on various targets, off hand is a challenge. ML is just plain fun. A old timer back in the 1980's told me, once you get that black powder smoke in your veins, you is ruint! I think he was right. I used to think I would one day like to compete, and maybe just place on a state or national level. My black powder journey has had me win 2 State championship's, and one 2nd place. I have also medaled 31 times in NMLRA events, and did very well at the Alvin York Shoot, 1995, I shot the best X with 42" .45 Squirrel rifle I built, shooting over the log, against 229 shooters shooting big chunk guns with long, bull barrels, some as much as 4" in diameter. I had the Best X out of 2300, targets, and did very well the next few years in that match. This was stuff I used to daydream of as a kid, and after 55 years have been blessed to accomplish much more than I should have. This has been due to the GENEROUS MUZZLELOADING FRATERNITY I have encountered everywhere I have been, who were willing to show me what it took, to be comptetive. Idaho Ron an Johnson 1942 are two prime examples of what I am talking about, always willing to help folks, and often get unneeded replies to their advice, from folks not interested, or unable to duplicate their results. Everything they have told me has been spot on. Roger has even invited me out, opened up his home, and put me on mule deer more than once, helping me to fill a spot on my bucket list. I don't know if I can ever make it back out again, but we will be lifelong friends, and talk regularly. To me this great sport, is about having fun, and making memories afield, often with our closest hunting buddies. Folks we as hunters are a shrinking fraternity, lets do our best to pull everyone in that we can, help them as much as we can, and if you cant be helpful, don't say anything! My 2 cents and you are welcome to it!

[54bore]

Excellent post Koger! Enjoyed the read!

[fiberoptik]

Excellent post Koger! Enjoyed the read!

+1!


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[sharps4590]

koger,and worth every cent I paid for it.....lol!!! Just joshin'. Seriously, very well said sir.

[rfd]

amen to all that, guys.

it truly is all good as long as we're havin' fun, and doin' it safely and responsibly.

[ShooterAZ]

So...Does this mean we can finally all agree that Blackhorn 209 is superior to Holy Black after all?

[Hanshi]

Yeah, but that percussion thing is just a fad, it will never catch on... :O)

I agree. It's just not a reliable system like a good lock carrying a sharp English flint.

[waksupi]

I agree. It's just not a reliable system like a good lock carrying a sharp English flint.

Ah! My evil twin brother!

[triggerhappy243]

So...Does this mean we can finally all agree that Blackhorn 209 is superior to Holy Black after all?

NOPE.

[triggerhappy243]

I will say, several of you guys here have spurred my interest in picking up my muzzle loaders again. You know who I am talking about. That 3 shots touching group I did a few weeks back now has me thinking of 200 yards............. just to show up the nay sayers at my gun club. Too bad there are very few B.P. shooters at our club any more.

[Good Cheer]

The different ignition systems used with caseless rounds offer much to keep the experimenter happily occupied.
About a decade ago I read an alternative history novel which had flintlock sniper rifles shooting heavy fifty caliber bullets. And after shooting 45-70 molds in a .458 bore, well, I have to try it in flinters too.
So when having a GM percussion barrel rebored to .52 bore to use off the shelf fifty molds paper patched, I had a flinter Renegade barrel that was laying around rebored also.
Come spring time I will start finding out how accurate I can make a long range flinter.