Rifles with a history

[ktw]

I took a day off work yesterday and went over to help an old friend shingle a house he was building. During one of our breaks he took me down to look at his modest gun collection. These were generally old guns that he had inherited from relatives and most of them were in relatively rough condition. Old, big woods, Upper Peninsula deer rifles that had seen a lot of deer seasons over multiple generations.

There were a couple of rifles he had no use for and just wanted to get rid of. I ended up taking two of them home. Both had been boogered for scope mounts at some point in time and both had some surface rust. One was a Marlin 1936 standard rifle in 32 Special ("32 HPS"). This was his grandfather's deer rifle for many years. Despite that fact, the rifle had a lot of bad memories for him as two of his relatives (grandfather and a younger brother) has used it to commit suicide over the decades.

The second rifle was a Remington Model 81 Woodsmaster (old Browning design, recoil operated semi-auto) that belonged to one of his long-departed uncles. I had little interest in this one at first but after taking it apart to clean it up and doing a little research its really starting to grow on me. Anyone out there ever played with one of these? This one is in 300 Savage and has a really nice bore. I love the take-down feature. I would like to find a peep site for it. I am on the hunt for 300 Savage brass and dies.

There was a 3rd rifle, an 1886 in 33 WCF, that I didn't take home. My friend considered this one to be a real family legacy item. It was his great-grandfathers farm gun. It appeared to be in great mechanical condition but fairly rough cosmetic shape, particularly the wood - someone had whacked off the butt at some point and there were a lot of successful deer season notches in the forearm. Couldn't tell the condition of the bore without cleaning it up. He would really like to get this one shooting again and I suspect that I will end up helping him make that happen at some point in the future.

I was never much of a firearms collector. I just bought the guns I wanted to shoot. I am starting to have second thoughts. Maybe a collection of "old deer rifles of the Upper Peninsula". I now have three good examples (Win 94, Marlin 1936, Rem 81), all older than I am. I am thinking that such a collection would also have to include a Savage 99 and I don't have one of those yet. I am sure all you good "enablers" here on Cast Boolits will help me come up with a longer list of important models.

-ktw

[dk17hmr]

Around our Deer Camp over in White Pine, we have a few Winchester 284's, one in the lever action 88 and one in the semi auto 100. The Winchester 88 is pretty common in our neck of the woods, just not in that caliber, one of those in 308 would be a good one to have, I have my grandpas 284.

Alot of guys are still hanging on to their 30-30's and 32's, because they work. A lever action 35 something would be good to have also.

[KCSO]

I had a modest collection of Remington M8 and 81's at one time and somewhere I have the book, Remington Model 8. There were never very many of these made as compared to the 94 Winchester or the Marlin's. I think less than 150,000 from 1906 to 1952. The 300 Savage was the last caliber offered and probably the best as it is basicly a 308 Winchester with a short neck. I have loaded cast in the 300 Savage but have never worked with a hunting load fo one of these.

[ktw]

Around our Deer Camp over in White Pine, we have a few Winchester 284's, one in the lever action 88 and one in the semi auto 100. The Winchester 88 is pretty common in our neck of the woods, just not in that caliber, one of those in 308 would be a good one to have, I have my grandpas 284.

Alot of guys are still hanging on to their 30-30's and 32's, because they work. A lever action 35 something would be good to have also.

My friend grew up in White Pine; a 4th or 5th generation Yooper. These rifles have been knocking around Ontonagon and Gogebic counties since the 30's and 40's.

The Remington 81 cleaned up nice. The Marlin 1936 is coming along - still need to do some more work on the bore and it needs a new ejector.

You have a good point in the 35 Remington lever action. I will keep my eyes open.

-ktw

[Wayne Smith]

ktw - The 33WCF is made from the 45-70. Donnley & Townsley reccomend "You will need a form die or an intermediate die such as the 40-65 Win. Anneal the case. Run into either the form die or the 40/65 F/L die. F/L size in 33 Win die. Trim to lenght and champfer."

Doesn't sound like too much of a problem if he has the dies.

[longhorn]

Tang sight for an 81? I'd try garyfellers.com--used to see his displays at Dallas area gunshows. I don't know the fellow, but he's evidently THE source for such things, metallic sights for all uses.

[KCSO]

They show up now and then, the last one I bought was about $125.00 I would try Gun Broker or E Bay as they have been on both recently.

[ktw]

I did find a peep sight for the Remington. Other than refinishing the stock, that one is good to go.

Now hunting for a tang peep and ejector for the Marlin. A 1936 isn't a common, or commonly cataloged, model for parts. Can I assume (within reason) same as 1893? Same as a 36? The tang mounting holes are 1.125" apart.


-ktw

[madcaster]

That is sad on the use of the Marlin,but a fella just needs to realize that it was the relatives' choices and the gun ws only a tool used.Could have been a piece of rope or a knife or a bottle of pills,anything.
Offer our condolences to the friend please.

[Buckshot]

...............One neat thing about that Remington semi-auto is that when you pull the trigger and she goes off, EVERYTHING starts moving in some direction or 'nuther .

...............Buckshot

[Bret4207]

Some of the 8's and 81's were good shooters, others indifferent. The 300's were great rifles. You've got a piece of history there. FYI- IIRC you can load from a stripper clip, an '03 stripper maybe? That's a dim memory, don't take it as gospel.

I wish I could run onto a 32 Marlin like that. Sweet. As far as the history...people make choices. Not the guns fault.

[square butte]

I caried my grandfather's Remington 81 in .300 sav. around in the woods at age 8. Boy was that ever some heavy packin for a little kid. It has a Weaver side mounted KV5 on it. Still shoots great. I was quite envious of my older brother who got to carry the Win 94 carbine. Still don't know how he rated the lighter gun. Seems like i'm still carrying the heavier load.

[ktw]

Tang sight for an 81? I'd try garyfellers.com

Forgot to say thanks for this link. I haven't called him yet, but that does appear to be a great source for tang and receiver peeps.

http://www.garyfellers.com/LinkClick...%3d&tabid=1937

-ktw

[scrapcan]

KTW,

How much 300 savage brass are you looking for and do you care if it is older brass? how about jacketed bullets of hornady round nose 150 flavor. I have been working on a deal of buying some old relading gear and there is a bunch of 300 sav items in the lot. Herters dies that go with an old herters press that were all bought around 1952-3 original rifle was a sav 99, the rifle was not for sale. but reloading items are.

send me a pm or email and I will see what I can do.

[longhorn]

Like I said, I don't know Fellers, just seen his displays and bought a few small sight parts from him..I've heard people complain that his prices were kind of high, but I figure that if you're looking for something no longer made and 60 or more years old, "high" is a purely relative term. I thought the Marlin model progression was "1893" "1936" "36" and "336." I'd expect the "36" ejector would work, not the "1893."

[andrew375]

Soldiers in Helmand unearth British rifles lost in 1880 massacre

Weapons taken after a Victorian defeat in Afghanistan have been recovered – and repatriated as antiques

By Keith Howitt
Sunday, 8 June 2008


British soldiers serving in Afghanistan have recovered weapons looted from the bodies of their Victorian forebears.

Rare Martini-Henry rifles lost in the bloody defeat at Maiwand in July 1880 have been retrieved 128 years later by troops fighting the Taliban and al-Qa'ida in Helmand province.

Two of the rifles, dated 1874 and 1878, are currently on sale in a Sussex antique shop for £1,100 apiece.

Mark Hawkins, co-owner of The Lanes Armoury, Brighton, said: "When we first fought the Afghans, we kept sending out armies who lost. The Afghans killed our chaps and took their weapons.

"Now British officers are finding these guns, recognise them for what they are, and are getting permission to bring them back. We've had a few through. I think a soldier might pick up a couple, keep one as a souvenir of his time in Afghanistan, and bring the other to us."

Peter Smithurst, senior curator of historic firearms at the Royal Armouries Museum, Leeds, said: "The Martini-Henry was the first purpose-made breech-loading rifle introduced into British service. It is an iconic rifle."

The Martini is particularly popular with collectors, he said, because of both its place in the development of firearms technology and for the role it played in the famous battles of Britain's colonial campaigns.

Mr Smithurst said Afghanistan was increasingly a source of antique firearms. "I have been getting quite a few email inquiries from British servicemen and the American forces as well."

Mr Hawkins said: "The Martini-Henry is a very, very collectable gun – almost entirely down to Michael Caine and the film Zulu. Everyone who has seen that film has seen the Martini-Henry and knows it is the rifle used by the British in that era."

Unlike the successful defence of Rorke's Drift in 1879, as featured in Zulu, the battle of Maiwand a year later was one of the worst British defeats of Queen Victoria's 63-year reign. A 2,500-strong Anglo/Indian force was routed by an Afghan army of about 12,000 men.

Among the 1,000 British and Indian dead were 286 men of the Martini-armed 66th (Berkshire) Regiment, who made a last stand in a walled garden in the village of Khig. When only two officers and nine men of the 66th remained alive, they charged the hordes of tribesmen surrounding them.

An Afghan witness described the end: "These men charged from the shelter of a garden and died with their faces to the enemy. So fierce was their charge, and so brave their actions, no Afghan dared approach to cut them down. Standing in the open, back to back, firing steadily, every shot counting, surrounded by thousands, these British soldiers died. It was not until the last man was shot down that the Afghans dared to advance. The behaviour of those last 11 was the wonder of all who saw it."

The weapons they wielded so gallantly could finally be returning home.

[ktw]

Found a tang sight for the Marlin 1936 at Garry Fellers.

Found an ejector (new manufacture replacement part) at Wisners. http://www.wisnersinc.com/rifles/mar...lin_start.html

Rifle has a .318 bore. I am going to hold off on buying a mold for the time being. I will simply patch up some .311's for the little bit of shooting I plan to do with it in the near term.

-ktw