loading PC boolits data?

[georgerc]

I should probably ask this question here, how do you treat PC boolits? as cast, jacketed or somewhere in between?

I loaded jacketed and plated, never cast, read about flaring the case mouth a bit more to avoid shaving, size them .002 over the barrel etc.

How about powdercoated, the .002 oversize still applies? coating included? do you use cast powder charges, jacketed or somewhere in between like plated? size B4 coating? after? both?

any input much appreciated, haven't come across those details in other posts

[OptimusPanda]

I have found the velocity variance between powder coat and lubrisized cast bullets to almost totally overlap. I treat them as cast bullets (as far as load data and sizing). If anything in my testing the PC is just a hair faster than the normal boolits for the same load.

[Bzcraig]

I always use cast data

[georgerc]

how much does the PC add to the diameter? the .002 oversize still applies, does not shave the PC?

[OS OK]

I use 'cast data' and 'same or next heavier weight' and 'as close' to the profile as I can find (looking at the contact area of the drive bands) for load data.

I size then PC and size again hoping to end up with a uniform thickness of 'PC Jacket'.

In the 'autos' I size to bore and use softer than usual Pb. Revolvers are unique unto themselves.

[jcren]

Yes, .002 over is about right. Most size after pc, as the pc is so slick it makes sizing easier. As long as you don't have a sharp edge of burr on the did, it shouldn't shave pc.

[hometownhero]

I have just used regular jacketed data for mine. I am just starting to coat my own cast bullets now. I had previously bought cast powder coated and just used normal jacketed bullet data.

[Bama]

Best to start at cast bullet charges and work your way up. You will find that the alloy is normally your limit on velocity. There are some good threads on adding copper to make the bullet hold together at the higher velocities. In the upper end of velocities the powder will be the final variable. How the pressure ramps up upon ignition will have a major effect on accuracy. You will be looking for a powder that continues to more gently build pressure as bullet goes down barrel. Velocities may equal a hotter powder but it will be significantly more accurate. Keep good notes.

[georgerc]

I use 'cast data' and 'same or next heavier weight' and 'as close' to the profile as I can find (looking at the contact area of the drive bands) for load data.

I size then PC and size again hoping to end up with a uniform thickness of 'PC Jacket'.

In the 'autos' I size to bore and use softer than usual Pb. Revolvers are unique unto themselves.

can you elaborate a bit on this, for example one of my projects is loading for a 357 revolver, I slugged it right at 357, I have previously loaded plated bullets for it using cast data, for the most part it worked out good, light shooting 125 gr, accurate at 7-10 yards, however today I got a squib, good thing I knew about that and recognized it right away.

they were loaded with titegroup, which for a light 3.4-3.6 gr if memory serves, its hardly any powder at all in that case, likely what happened the powder was too far from the primer, I am not doing that again, with such a heavy low volume powder I would not load any below max cast charge.

now I do have win 231, 800x, and trailboss on hand, I bought the 800x because I noticed for some calibers it called for most powder in my data, trailboss I am told its popular in revolvers, not aware why exactly maybe you guys can elaborate, 231 I believe is on par with titegroup, I picked that one up just because, I think I have some other powder I have to look

[Bama]

You may want to look at 2400. I use it with Lyman 358156 gas checked and PC. It is more accurate than I can shoot. 1260 fps from a 2" Ruger. It speaks with authority.

[OS OK]

I don't have anything for you in those powders, haven't been able to get those in years except for the Trail Boss and it's OK. I'm not a TB fan, don't shoot cowboy style meets. I load my handguns to hit hard as designed and don't make plinking rounds of light charges.

I use a lot of TiteGroup and don't have any problems with the small weights...I make dang sure that my throw is throwing accurately then keep checking every 15 rounds or so until I develop some trust in throwing the charge as weighed.

In pistols and revolvers everything I do these days is PC'd...in pistols I size for bore size, in revolvers I size under the cylinder diameter by .0005 - .001".

[HeavyHev]

I personally load to cast specifications as they generally require less powder. I try to load on the lighter side for competitions so that is advantageous for my application. If all you have is jacket data, you can just take 10% off and you will be in the ballpark.

[248dm]

After Sandyhook, and the subsequent gun ownership scare, in desperation for some kind of powder I bought a big jug of Trailboss at scalper prices at a gun show.

It is a fluffy, doughnut shaped powder. It needs to settle in the powder hopper to dispense accurately. I'll load the hopper, tap the sides, come back the next day to load in my Dillon 550B. I'm using TB for .45 acp, 38 and 9mm. I load to max book value. a little bit of compression results. This is where ES and SD are best.

[OS OK]

After Sandyhook, and the subsequent gun ownership scare, in desperation for some kind of powder I bought a big jug of Trailboss at scalper prices at a gun show.

It is a fluffy, doughnut shaped powder. It needs to settle in the powder hopper to dispense accurately. I'll load the hopper, tap the sides, come back the next day to load in my Dillon 550B. I'm using TB for .45 acp, 38 and 9mm. I load to max book value. a little bit of compression results. This is where ES and SD are best.

If you wipe the hopper well with the anti-static dryer sheets you will draw off most of the static electricity that makes TB so fluffy and sticking all up and down in the hopper. It'll sorta relax down into the body of the fill.

It prolly depends on your plastic as the mfgrs. might use different standards but the plastic in my LnL is so staticky that the little donuts will fluff up and almost float like they were in space...when filling I've actually had them jumping completely out of the hopper...strange huh?

[waksupi]

I load them as cast, and generally have had to drop the charge weight slightly to achieve the same accuracy.

[georgerc]

for whatever reason I can't post a picture, may be something wrong on my end, anyways, I got my 358 sizing die, pushed some through and they came out to about 357-357.5, then I powdercoated them HF red, pretty straight forward, nothing fancy there, some imperfections but shootable, thing is the powdercoat added quite a bit the OD, after the coat they were consistently measuring .360-.361, I pounded one through my revolvers muzzle and not only it shaved the PC but chipped off a piece of the bottom driving band, it may have also gotten wider from the initial pounding, I than sized one and pounded it, better but the pc still shaved off, granted this was from the muzzle, backwards, I confirmed with these slugs and others the bore diameter on this gun is .357, not sure about that .002 over with these boolits, I am thinking for this gun I should run them through the sizer after the PC as well, that may explain the earlier post about sizing under the cylinder bore, maybe you can elaborate on that.

I'm thinking for the revolver I am set with this sizing die, .357 after the PC, any thoughts?

not sure how to go about the 9mm, the one barrel I slugged came out at .355, I am thinking I need another .356 die for it, seems to me that the PC boolits need to be about the size of the bore, but what do I know? hence I am out here looking for guidance.

[georgerc]

I don't have anything for you in those powders, haven't been able to get those in years except for the Trail Boss and it's OK. I'm not a TB fan, don't shoot cowboy style meets. I load my handguns to hit hard as designed and don't make plinking rounds of light charges.

I use a lot of TiteGroup and don't have any problems with the small weights...I make dang sure that my throw is throwing accurately then keep checking every 15 rounds or so until I develop some trust in throwing the charge as weighed.

In pistols and revolvers everything I do these days is PC'd...in pistols I size for bore size, in revolvers I size under the cylinder diameter by .0005 - .001".

I have lots of titegroup on hand, matter of fact it is all I used so far, I weigh all of my charges and make sure they are consistent to a tenth of a grain,I previously loaded some berrys plated 125 gr at 3.4gr and 3.6gr, middle of the road cast data, with this powder there was hardly any in that huge case, they worked fine for the most part but really light loads I noticed, so the next batch I loaded same plated bullets at middle of the road jacketed, about 4.4-4.5 gr, liked those better and they shot fine also,

the other day I had a chance to go out and I was going through some leftover 3.4 gr titegroup loaded and got a squib, my guess is that tiny bit of powder was too far from the primer, part of the reason I got some other powders was for those large cases, Acurate #2 I believe is the other powder I have on hand, don't know much about it, picked it up to try it at some point along with the trail boss, the 800x I picked up for the 25 acp, in my data it showed this powder as the largest charge by weight, for that little cartridge I loaded some before with titegroup a mere 1.2 gr

[sparky45]

You won't get any shaving of the PC if you properly expand the case neck, which you should already be doing with plain cast.

how much does the PC add to the diameter? the .002 oversize still applies, does not shave the PC?

[OS OK]

I have lots of titegroup on hand, matter of fact it is all I used so far, I weigh all of my charges and make sure they are consistent to a tenth of a grain,I previously loaded some berrys plated 125 gr at 3.4gr and 3.6gr, middle of the road cast data, with this powder there was hardly any in that huge case, they worked fine for the most part but really light loads I noticed, so the next batch I loaded same plated bullets at middle of the road jacketed, about 4.4-4.5 gr, liked those better and they shot fine also,

the other day I had a chance to go out and I was going through some leftover 3.4 gr titegroup loaded and got a squib, my guess is that tiny bit of powder was too far from the primer, part of the reason I got some other powders was for those large cases, Acurate #2 I believe is the other powder I have on hand, don't know much about it, picked it up to try it at some point along with the trail boss, the 800x I picked up for the 25 acp, in my data it showed this powder as the largest charge by weight, for that little cartridge I loaded some before with titegroup a mere 1.2 gr

3.4 grains of TiteGroup is not that small of a charge, I mean...if you look at it in a scale pan. When you drop that in a .357 case I know it kinda disappears in the bottom but that charge should ignite without any problems no matter where it is in the case. There is prolly a 45 FPS variation if you intentionally set it off at the extreme front or to the rear of the case but pistol shooting at a horizontally placed target that powder oughta be spread from front to rear. I can't offer an explanation for your squib other than you just somehow neglected to charge that particular case.
Are you having trust problems with the powder throw doing it's job?
I don't remember whether you described your press or throw so I'm just going to spitwad here but...I think I'd try to mount a press light where you can see into each case as you place the projectile and go to seat it. That won't confirm the exact weight of the charge but it will tell you if the charge is even there. Depending on the press you might have to get creative in lighting it. Need some pictures of your work space and press to come up with any useful suggestions...

[georgerc]

I use a single stage with a lee auto drum, I weigh the case first, zero it out and charge than weigh again using a cheap Hornady digital scale, if I am off by a tenth of a grain I dump it and throw another charge, I doubt it but I guess there is the possibility of having messed up my routine, I do visually check each case as I go, I set a projectile in and seat them a batch at a time.

as for the comment about shaving the PC, I experienced it while slugging my barrel using one of the PC boolits, the unsized one didn't look too pretty, granted I pounded the boolit backwards from the muzzle just wanted to try it see what happens, the question that rose is weather I should size them again after the PC as they turned out rather large. I went ahead and resized that batch. the second batch I checked a few and it would appear the PC may not be quite as thick, still I get a .3595 sometimes as a minimum, .360-.361 generally

so with this particular die lee 358 it sizes about .357-.3575 my revolver slugs at 357, Im thinking resized after the PC would be best, if I only size b4 the pc they turn out a tad too big, as for my 9mm not sure yet it slugs at 355, I know you guys suggest .002 over but with my slugging experiments, that did not look too good, granted I was more like .004 over, just working with what I got, I may need another 356 die for the 9mm

so what is different about seating cast boolits? I read about it a while back you have to flare the mouth a bit more than jacketed? these are lee 358-125, they do have a crimp groove so I guess that would determine the seating depth.