How Do You Lube RB Loads in a .45-70

[Silver Jack Hammer]

I've loaded and shot about a dozen RB's in .45-70, how do you lube RB loads?

I've loaded .457" RB's by pouring 40 gr of FFg, wad, compress, corn meal, wad, slightly compressing and crimping the ball. It works great but I want to add lube to the load. Any ideas?

[country gent]

The easiest way would be powder and wad, conpress, corn meal. wad lube cookie wad and bullet. Another would be to melt lube into felt wads and use those also. Grease /lube cookies and be made by simply melting spg or lube of choice in a pan with a little water in it to desired thickness letting cool and lifting the sheet off the water with a spatuala. SIt this on a piece of wax paper and simply push the compressed powder charge with snug wads case mouth thru it.

[longbow]

Some tumble lube but that leaves a messy ball and also tumble lube isn't good with BP though you could hot tumble lube with BP lube. I'd go with country gent's solution of lube cookie. Not sure a felt wad soaked in lube would put enough onto the bore but that could work too.

I haven't done it with .45-70 but used to load 12 ga. with BP and round balls with a lube cookie. That worked pretty well at keeping fouling soft but no rifling to worry about either. I have used lube cookies under round balls in .44 mag. with smokeless but no fouling to worry about there.

Round balls and collar buttons are lots of fun to shoot in big bores.

[Lead pot]

Shooting in a cartridge rifle with a round ball is fun for the little kids that cant tolerate the recoil yet. Here is what I do. I use a light load of black powder and put a wad on the powder like I would with any cartridge. Then I use a lubed tic patch with a round ball and load the case like I would the front stuffer and seat the ball deep in the case on the powder and wad. Recoil is like a .22 in a heavy rifle on the bench. It makes smoke and puts a hole on the paper.

[Silver Jack Hammer]

Thanks for the info guys.

My loads with RB were accurate at 100 yards. It's nearly the winter solstice here at the 47th Lattitude and my home range has several layers of concrete baffles overhead. These 2 factors really restrict light on the sights and the targets thereby my ability to see and hit downrange. So I'm shooting more close range in poor lighting. I've got a supply of .457" RB's so I'm shooting my Sharps at close range. Why not? It's kind of unnecessary to shoot my long range boolits at 100 yards, the RB's have their place.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Thanks for the info guys.

My loads with RB were accurate at 100 yards. It's nearly the winter solstice here at the 47th Lattitude and my home range has several layers of concrete baffles overhead. These 2 factors really restrict light on the sights and the targets thereby my ability to see and hit downrange. So I'm shooting more close range in poor lighting. I've got a supply of .457" RB's so I'm shooting my Sharps at close range. Why not? It's kind of unnecessary to shoot my long range boolits at 100 yards, the RB's have their place.

Ah, so you're a grown-up, and can stand the recoil? I can well believe that, for besides your very sensible reasons to use round ball, there are quite a few others.

Your loads are very similar to what might be used in a Dragoon sized cap and ball revolver. So although the use of water-floated lube discs as described is excellent for flat-based bullets, I think I would seat the balls level with the case mouth or nearly, and rub a soft or softened lube into the space around it. The solid flat disc tends to be blown dish-shaped around the rear of the ball, and may let the gas bypass it without squashing it into the grooves.

You can get moulds of the right diameter for flat-based bullets no heavier than round balls, and that is probably the counsel of perfection, but perhaps unreasonably expensive for something you may only do occasionally.

As to lube, you are talking quite moderate loads, and probably not shooting until the bore is heavily fouled. You would probably get by with exactly the same lubing as you would with smokeless. But two things would be better. One is to use a softer lube, and the other is to have more of it. So the ideal flat-based bullet would be one with large lube grooves. With some, such as the NEI 458-15-PG Collar Button, they make a single very large groove to lengthen the bearing surface.

http://www.neihandtools.com/catalog.html

[Soundguy]

I have a box of mixed vintage 45-70 cartridges. I have pulled a few of them. So far all have been black powder and one was a ball. They are baloon primer cases, and have headstamps of late 1800's.

the ball was setting on a thin fiber wad 45 thous maybee. and that wa ssetting on a 2f column.

[skeettx]

Vaseline on top of the ball, saran wrap the top of the cartridge to keep dirt out, unwrap, insert and shoot
Easy Peasy
Mike

[Soundguy]

Seems a 'crown' of 50-50 beeswax/white wax would be way easier.

Won't be wet or sticky, won't attract dirt, is stiff but pliable, and once the ball accelerates, that crown, due to inertia, will be on a lube ring at the ball to barrell leading edge.

Would be like a lube cookie on top of the ball.

[craig61a]

Seems a 'crown' of 50-50 beeswax/white wax would be way easier.

Won't be wet or sticky, won't attract dirt, is stiff but pliable, and once the ball accelerates, that crown, due to inertia, will be on a lube ring at the ball to barrell leading edge.

Would be like a lube cookie on top of the ball.

I've done that with Cheddite hulls and .600 round ball for my Snider...

[Soundguy]

I've 'sealed' balls in spare Bp revolver cyls by pouring a wax/beeswax mix over the seated ball, stores well, don't migrate or foul powder, won't go rancid, or attract bugs... satisfactory lube as well.

[Lead pot]

Seems a 'crown' of 50-50 beeswax/white wax would be way easier.

Won't be wet or sticky, won't attract dirt, is stiff but pliable, and once the ball accelerates, that crown, due to inertia, will be on a lube ring at the ball to barrell leading edge.

Would be like a lube cookie on top of the ball.

No, the lube cookie would just get pushed out with the ball leaving very little lube behind. The Vaseline would act like goose or hog lard in front of the ball getting pushed to the side of the ball leaving lube behind in the barrel as it travels on it's way though the bore.
Vaseline has been used since it was born in the late 1800rds for lube. I use it for patch lube and when I had a cap & ball revolver as well with the BPCR lube.

[Soundguy]

I think your missing the fact that I'm not talking about a hard lube pill, but a rather soft one, though not sticky soft.

Iniertia wil make that crown of lube, ring of lube if you will, enlarge in diameter and try to set in place as the sphere ogive moves thru it.

It wont be pressure lubed, but will wipe lube. There will be an air column in front, and a domed piston behind, least resistance path will be to ring at the ball/bbl union. Add in the twist, and the soft lube will be wanting to move to an edge.

Composition of your lube will be important, your goal is a thixotrophic concoction. Softish solid state that almost good liquid with the addition of kinetic energy, of which there will be plenty.

[Lead pot]

Soundguy when you said wax and B-wax I took it for paraffin wax and B-wax both are pretty hard.

[skeettx]

Soundguy, might the all useful Vaseline fit the thixotrophic concoction definition in this application

OR maybe Crisco

or

Bore Butter
https://www.whiteknightsupply.com/pr...FYETgQodaSsAEQ

He he he

[Soundguy]

Stiffened Crisco, bore butter or vaso..

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I think your missing the fact that I'm not talking about a hard lube pill, but a rather soft one, though not sticky soft.

Iniertia wil make that crown of lube, ring of lube if you will, enlarge in diameter and try to set in place as the sphere ogive moves thru it.

It wont be pressure lubed, but will wipe lube. There will be an air column in front, and a domed piston behind, least resistance path will be to ring at the ball/bbl union. Add in the twist, and the soft lube will be wanting to move to an edge.

Composition of your lube will be important, your goal is a thixotrophic concoction. Softish solid state that almost good liquid with the addition of kinetic energy, of which there will be plenty.

The above is all true, plus if the lube in front of the ball is sticking to it, it will be subject to centrifugal force. If it isn't sticking, what's the problem?

[country gent]

A mixture similar to emmerts lube may be what your looking for here the original recipe is I have is 50% beeswax, 40% unsalted crisco, 10% canola oil. for softer lower beeswax and increase criso. Should be soft enough to just thumb into case mouth on top of the ball. The improved version of this drops canola oil to 5% and adds 5% lanolin. A small amount of murphys oil soap ( a few drops or so) helps to nlend ingrediants when mixing and seems to help fouling stay softer.

[country gent]

A mixture similar to emmerts lube may be what your looking for here the original recipe is I have is 50% beeswax, 40% unsalted crisco, 10% canola oil. for softer lower beeswax and increase criso. Should be soft enough to just thumb into case mouth on top of the ball. The improved version of this drops canola oil to 5% and adds 5% lanolin. A small amount of murphys oil soap ( a few drops or so) helps to blend ingrediants when mixing and seems to help fouling stay softer.

[rundownbear]

this is the easiest "Shooting in a cartridge rifle with a round ball is fun for the little kids that cant tolerate the recoil yet. Here is what I do. I use a light load of black powder and put a wad on the powder like I would with any cartridge. Then I use a lubed tic patch with a round ball and load the case like I would the front stuffer and seat the ball deep in the case on the powder and wad. Recoil is like a .22 in a heavy rifle on the bench. It makes smoke and puts a hole on the paper."

no need for any fillers and special processes