Fawn saved

[44man]

Carol seen a fawn stuck in the fence. She got cutters but could not find the fence tool. She got the wire cut by twisting it. Deer was OK and left in good shape.

[fingers284]

I saved three deer this AM...damn I'm getting soft in my crochety old age...had two fawns and their mother about 30 yrds off my back deck and let them walk. The mother appeared to be a first year mom, not a big mature animal so she got a reprieve to finish raising the young-uns.

[Brad Cayton]

Good deal. We had a doe here on our place hung her back leg between the top 2 strands of barbed wire jumping the fence this summer. I didn't see it until the buzzards let me know. I hate the deer tearing down my fence but being hung in a fence till starvation or a coyote gets me would be a hard way to go.

[dverna]

It ticks me off when people shoot fawns or does with fawns. I have two neighbors that do it.

I do not need the meat that badly.

Don Verna

[Omega]

It ticks me off when people shoot fawns or does with fawns. I have two neighbors that do it.

I do not need the meat that badly.

Don Verna

I've done it, twice, when I first started hunting whitetail. First one was behind a bush when I first seen it. I tried to pull up when I seen the spots but too late. The second one was walking in a rut, when I got to it I noticed the fading spots. Though done by mistake, I tagged them, and I must say they were the best tasting venison. Now, many moons later I can tell the difference pretty easy and will not take any with spots, young yes, spots no.

[shoot-n-lead]

I saved three deer this AM...damn I'm getting soft in my crochety old age...had two fawns and their mother about 30 yrds off my back deck and let them walk. The mother appeared to be a first year mom, not a big mature animal so she got a reprieve to finish raising the young-uns.

I am the same...just won't shoot those young does with young one's or little deer of any stripe.

[762sultan]

You taught her right 44 man. Tell her she done good. And give her a big hug from me.

[dtknowles]

I believe that hunters and outdoors people love and care for wildlife way more than any greenie city slickers.

Tim

[tdoyka]

good for her, 44man.

for archery, i don't shoot at a doe. i prefer a wide rack buck. for rifle season i'll take whatever buck comes in. i'll shoot a doe only if its an older one without fawns. i must feel old or something.

[Fishman]

Being a biologist and all, I usually let my pragmatism get the better of me. I have been known to shoot a doe and her young not once but many different times. They taste good and the doe permits are there for a reason. Where I live it just might be impossible to shoot enough deer to negatively impact the population.

Those tall fences with two strands of barbed wire at the top sure are deer killing machines. I have rescued a small doe trapped in one and found dozens of dead ones. I don't know why anyone uses that fence. Wouldn't a single barbed wire do just as well? The deer jump and don't clear the fence and when they flip over the two wire trap their hooves and they can't get out. What a waste.

[44man]

I believe that hunters and outdoors people love and care for wildlife way more than any greenie city slickers.

Tim

Exactly right. I have gotten more soft with age and care about animals more.

[Hamish]

It ticks me off when people shoot fawns or does with fawns. I have two neighbors that do it.

I do not need the meat that badly.

Don Verna

I loves me some Bambi meats.

Not too many years ago the state was running a "Take a doe so the herd won't grow" program, with special emphasis on harvesting young does so that you not only eliminated her, but also the fawns produced in the next couple of years.

Ive eaten LOTS of bow and gun tags, but when it comes down to end of season, I'll drop Bambi and her mom in a heartbeat. DNR issues X amount of doe tags per season for a reason. Your "moral" judgement has no place in herd management.

[RP]

I been saving deer all year it seems passed on several cow horns about 6 three and four points and a couple of 6 points. I got tried of passing and needing some meat I took a fair size 8 point. Been waiting on that older doe but none to be seen by me just some small ones. Passed on two bucks today hoping for a doe their harder to find then big bucks this year aggggggg. I did look real hard at a nice 8 point about 18 inch spread but some of the guys have never got a deer worth putting on the wall so I let it walk also. But spread the word to all the guys hunting with me I am meat hunting and if they shoot me a doe or two I keep letting those bucks walk lol.

[TXGunNut]

It's all about management plans. If the plan calls for a drastic reduction in herd size does need to be killed. The lease I hunt has a good population of deer so I will only kill dry/lone does or management bucks. If I kill a doe with a fawn I might as well kill the fawn, it's chances for survival are almost zero. I've hunted areas where habitat would not support the herd for the winter, we were asked to kill any antlerless deer and some of the adult does were quite small. We killed them so that the rest of the herd had a better chance to survive.
But no, I don't want to kill fawns. I'm proud of Carol for rescuing that fawn, I hope it found it's way back to Mama.
My theory is that yearling fawns are growing fast and eating like teenage kids. A yearling may eat as much as two adult deer. An adult deer has a better chance of survival than a yearling.
I'm just glad that the area I hunt does not require killing does with fawns or fawns but that is only because the population is in balance with the habitat.

[richhodg66]

Just how old does a fawn need to be to be able to survive on its own? Obviously needs to be weaned, but realistically, at what point during the year are they grown enough that they have a good chance to make it without their mothers?

[44man]

The young I see are long weaned and very large for the most point but there are still some small ones. The youngest doe will be bred late after the older ones.
I want to know what a "DRY" doe is? Is it because she is alone? I have killed very large and old does with milk and never ever seen one "DRY." Nature does not shut off the spigot even if fawns are grown. The only dry doe is a fawn never bred.
I keep reading it so some have Mark V eyeballs and can tell. Or they tweak a teat before shooting.
If a fawn is eating leaves, twigs and grass, it will survive. Time to wean is very short.
But the doe will always have milk and once bred again, it continues until too old to breed, like eating an old dead milk cow---TERRIBLE!

[Texas by God]

Goat wire is bad on deer. I have rescued a couple that were ok but most need a coup de grace. We will eat them if on our property. Freeing them can get you hurt so be careful folks. A 70 # doe can kick a grown man's butt in an instant. My rule of thumb is if the fawn is 3/4" the size of the doe it's big enough to shoot. I will not let spikes & 3 points walk while waiting for Mr Big. He can wait. The gene pool needs attention. Best, Thomas.

[Hamish]

Just how old does a fawn need to be to be able to survive on its own? Obviously needs to be weaned, but realistically, at what point during the year are they grown enough that they have a good chance to make it without their mothers?

Ideally, after the doe kicks the fawn off the teat. But 44's post raises an important point. The younger does being bred last is far from true in an unbalanced herd, and I don't know of ANY wild populations that are anywhere even near a 1:1 ratio. And the more unbalanced the ratio, the earlier and later does are bred, and the percentage of satellite breeding goes up substantially.

In a "normal" year the nutritional requirements of a within carrying capacity are within the optimal periods, i.e., browse foliage is green at the right time, and equally as important, the fawn was born and weaned within the right period to be mature enough to have put on enough reserves to survive until next green up.

Breed too early and late means seeing big brown young of the year and puny spotted babies at the same time in the late Fall/early Winter. Not good herd mgt.

I know the older fellows who grew up with few or no deer were raised to never kill a doe, but having seen what 1:14-1:15 ratios do to browse with accompanied die offsI have ZERO compunction harvesting any animal I have a DNR issued tag for.

[44man]

True, a fawn with spots in Nov might not make it through the winter, let alone the 42" of snow we had last year.
I have shot many small deer and it is prime. But saving any deer from a fence is not hunting anyway. I still want to help them. It is a harsh death. Starvation is also harsh so to not harvest means you do not think of whether the deer can make it or die very badly.
I will never bash anyone with a small deer. It is just circumstances.
I have found dead fawns in my fence when I needed them for horses, etc. I have been removing fence since we have no more animals. I was sick of replacing wire deer or trees broke. I am FREE of the chore.
The fawn carol saved was inches from the opening the doe went through. I will get more cut out.

[white eagle]

I doubt that you kill a doe with a fawn the fawn will die as a result
by the time the hunting season is in swing the fawn has learned much needed
survival instincts from doe