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Thread: Vintage ctg conversion book for $1 worth it?

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy
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    Another thing on the eBay scores. Sometimes guy stuff auctions expire when other more popular guy stuff is on TV.

    If you're going to sell guy stuff on eBay, NEVER have an auction expire during popular sports or TV events (like the Walking Dead season premiere). I always had mine expire on T/W/Th at somewhere before 10:00pm EST so that the most people could bid in a reasonable time.

  2. #22
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    Ballistics is right about the bookselling sites except sometimes the stores that populate those sites don't have a clue what they are trying to sell. Some will value a book at many times what it is worth and other times at a fraction of its' worth.

    I got several of the more uncommon books in my "library" on Ebay over 15-20 years ago. Those bargains are in the past for me. I wasn't aware of the followed search feature he mentioned. I don't go to Ebay any more. Not much there that interests me.
    John
    W.TN

  3. #23
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    [QUOTE=alamogunr;3830595]Ballistics is right about the bookselling sites except sometimes the stores that populate those sites don't have a clue what they are trying to sell. Some will value a book at many times what it is worth...[QUOTE]

    There is a perfectly logical reason for that. They want the money. On eBay I think fewer of them check the website to see what the book is selling for (or having more asked for it) by other sellers. Sometimes there is no reason for a high price but copying one another. I stalked this gentleman's rather ordinarily bound 1960s autobiography for over a year while they asked up to hundreds of pounds for it, till I got it for £4.95. He was what Japanese sword collectors term a living national treasure.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Wintle

    I also got for a very similar amount the autobiography, "The Dark Invader", of Captain von Rintelen, who led the sabotage of the American arms trade to the Allies in 1915. He became a personal friend of Admiral Hall, who caught him, and attended the wedding of Hall's daughter with his own daughter serving as bridesmaids, and eleven British admirals as fellow-guests. Now there is a wall I wouldn't have minded being a fly upon.

  4. #24
    Boolit Buddy mwells72774's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lotech View Post
    I bought the Donnelly book when it came out. Great reference source. However, try to verify information before you use it. Allegedly, the book contains a number of errors. I contacted Donnelly a long time ago and he intended to put out a revised edition. Don't know whether this ever happened. Probably the best of these books is the one by Ken Howell. As for the George Nonte book, most would find it of little value.

  5. #25
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    My reading of Donnelly's first edition left the impression that it was rather hastily thrown together (it does cover a lot of ground) and a checking of dimensions and recommendations against other references like Cartridges of the World and Nonte's conversion book would be needed. But of course, this is warranted in any case, just as loading recommendations need to be checked through multiple sources.

    I don't agree that Nonte's book is of limited value. It was written before the rise of the everybody-else-is-responsible-for-whatever-fine-mess-I-get-myself-into litigation industry, and lists forming techniques that are deliberately left out of Howell's otherwise much more comprehensive book. If one is cautious, as Nonte's recommends, cases for light cast boolit loads can be made by these techniques.

    I have all three books, and could probably find room for a revision of Donnelly's first edition, if I came across a copy. We are fortunate that all three are becoming somewhat obsolescent in spots because of the reissue, by specialty companies, of a lot of the brass cases that used to have to be formed.

  6. #26
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    In my estimation ANY gun book has to be worth a dollar! I have never gotten a gun book that I did not get at least a dollars worth of information from.
    R.D.M.

  7. #27
    Boolit Master Pavogrande's Avatar
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    I agree with bent ramrod about nontes' book --
    my copy is 1961 and it was really the only publication available then that addressed cartridge conversions.
    Yes, it is outdated in some ways but as BR pointed out he shows many politically incorrect ways of getting the job done using rudimentary methods -

    This was a time of a lot of really cheap old military weapons on the market with virtually no ammo. No 11mm mauser, berdan 1,7.5 swiss (90), or a score of others available anywhere --

    my ha-penny

  8. #28
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    If mwells72774 post is "vintage" what do I call my original "The Home Guide To Cartridge Conversions" - ©1961, by George C. Nonte?

    Attachment 180682
    Try being informed instead of just opinionated.
    Sometimes it is better to just smile and walk away.

    You can always tell a Handloader, by his unceasing quest for spent brass.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bent Ramrod View Post
    My reading of Donnelly's first edition left the impression that it was rather hastily thrown together (it does cover a lot of ground) and a checking of dimensions and recommendations against other references like Cartridges of the World and Nonte's conversion book would be needed. But of course, this is warranted in any case, just as loading recommendations need to be checked through multiple sources.

    I don't agree that Nonte's book is of limited value. It was written before the rise of the everybody-else-is-responsible-for-whatever-fine-mess-I-get-myself-into litigation industry, and lists forming techniques that are deliberately left out of Howell's otherwise much more comprehensive book. If one is cautious, as Nonte's recommends, cases for light cast boolit loads can be made by these techniques.

    I have all three books, and could probably find room for a revision of Donnelly's first edition, if I came across a copy. We are fortunate that all three are becoming somewhat obsolescent in spots because of the reissue, by specialty companies, of a lot of the brass cases that used to have to be formed.
    Yes, the Donnelly book does seem to have been put together at high speed, though there is so much that it could still have as many man-hours in it as a slimmer volume. One thing that may have been difficult to get around by computer graphics in 1987 was that the drawings for cases are standard ones for rimmed, rimless, bottlenecked, straight etc., and not to scale. Nowadays even I could alter a standard drawing to scale in a few minutes per cartridge, using AutoCAD (very expensive) or something like Draftsight (free from, of all people, Dassault Systems, or a cheap DVD on eBay:

    https://draftsight.en.softonic.com/

    Donnelly says in his foreword that all the dimensions he has taken from other sources have been checked. Well maybe they have, in the sense of making sure that is what people really wrote. There are certainly errors which come from Barnes, and probably others before him. On obsolete cartridge dimensions you have to walk softly and expect a big stick. He does include rim thicknesses, as few others do.

    I have never even seen George Hoyem's books, which I believe are very good. In general though, reference books on cartridges are partly aimed at the forensic market, and how often are crimes committed with rifles? Both of these are extremely good, except that they give the extremely wide range of dimensions in which cartridges can be found, which may not be what the reloader wants:

    Brandt, Jakob H.: Manualof Pistol and Revolver Cartridges (Journal-Verlag Schwend, Schwabisch Hall,Germany, single volume edition in English 1998.)

    White,H.P.,Munhall,B.D. and Bearse , Ray: CenterfirePistol and Revolver Cartridges (new edition combining Vols. I and II,A.S. Barnes and Co. CranburyNJ, 1967.)

    Brandt is a very expensive book, and the only object of value I have ever had chewed by the infant whose portrait I have on my coffee mug. It covers and probably copies the material from White et al., so you'd be disappointed by buying both...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The only book of Nonte's I have read is "Pistolsmithing" - principally out of curiosity, as I have done hardly any pistolsmithing. I was impressed by his attitude to what can be done, what is worth doing, and whether shortcuts can be found.







  10. #30
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    I'll give you FIVE dollars for it!!! Best, Thomas.

  11. #31
    Boolit Grand Master in Remembrance


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    Have one, paid alot more than a dollar. Get it!
    Lets make America GREAT again!
    Go, Go, Go, Go, Go Donald Trump

    Keep your head on your shoulders
    Sit with your back to the wall
    Be ready to draw on a moments notice

  12. #32
    Boolit Master

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    Book is well worth the buck. However, be forewarned, they make some conversions from donor brass that is expensive, maybe more expensive that resulting brass could be found. This book kinda predates Bertram, Starline and the European makers. Just shop around before you invest in some big project. IIRC, some of his solutions were NOT the cheapest or fastest way to either.

  13. #33
    Boolit Buddy mwells72774's Avatar
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    There have been a few that I had to scratch my head about the parent case.

  14. #34
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    I have three of the Hoyem books. They are more for collectors than users, with full size photos of cartridges and their variations, pictures of the packaging, the history, including that of the gun and ammo manufacturers, catalog reprints, applicable patents and so forth. Few mentions of dimensions, and those mostly concerning length, and no tables.

    Impressive books though. They were never cheap, and seem to go for ridiculous money nowadays, but if you want to know what something looks like, it's in one or more of them.

  15. #35
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackthorn View Post
    In my estimation ANY gun book has to be worth a dollar! I have never gotten a gun book that I did not get at least a dollars worth of information from.
    Absolutely! Even books I've read at the library I'll pick up at the used book store if the price is right.

  16. #36
    Boolit Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by blackthorn View Post
    In my estimation ANY gun book has to be worth a dollar! I have never gotten a gun book that I did not get at least a dollars worth of information from.
    yes I have one gun book from a popular auction site that is printed up side down backwards and contains material not related at all. Worth a buck just for laughs.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master beezapilot's Avatar
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    I've done a lot of business with this company- it is nice that no matter how many books you order S/H is $3.50
    https://www.hamiltonbook.com/Fishing...fourth-edition

    https://www.hamiltonbook.com/Fishing-Hunting

    https://www.hamiltonbook.com/Collect...rch&cat_id=FKN
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  18. #38
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    [QUOTE=Ballistics in Scotland;3830901][QUOTE=alamogunr;3830595]Ballistics is right about the bookselling sites except sometimes the stores that populate those sites don't have a clue what they are trying to sell. Some will value a book at many times what it is worth...

    There is a perfectly logical reason for that. They want the money. On eBay I think fewer of them check the website to see what the book is selling for (or having more asked for it) by other sellers. Sometimes there is no reason for a high price but copying one another. I stalked this gentleman's rather ordinarily bound 1960s autobiography for over a year while they asked up to hundreds of pounds for it, till I got it for £4.95. He was what Japanese sword collectors term a living national treasure.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Wintle

    I also got for a very similar amount the autobiography, "The Dark Invader", of Captain von Rintelen, who led the sabotage of the American arms trade to the Allies in 1915. He became a personal friend of Admiral Hall, who caught him, and attended the wedding of Hall's daughter with his own daughter serving as bridesmaids, and eleven British admirals as fellow-guests. Now there is a wall I wouldn't have minded being a fly upon.
    Coming back to this thread due to a email notification of a recent post, I went to the linked Wikipedia article. Probably the most interesting Wikipedia article I have ever read. I can see why you spent more than a year chasing his autobiography.

    Holy Moly! Just went to a book search site looking for the autobiography. Cheapest I found was $195. I'm satisfied with the Wikipedia write up.
    John
    W.TN

  19. #39
    Boolit Grand Master In Remembrance
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    FREE Spreadsheet conversions 1406 calibers, for your computer files ... http://www.castpics.net/subsite/Conv...onversions.xls
    Regards
    John

  20. #40
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    I don't do any wildcatting nor do I need to make "odd" or hard to find brass, but I really enjoy my copy of "...Cartridge Conversions".
    My Anchor is holding fast!

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check