My Hawken has a Bob Roller trigger and lock, same thing. I have an H&H barrel. Had to call and convince Bob to make the parts for us. He was disgusted with American shooters being cheap and was only making the parts for Germany at the time.Originally Posted by jcwit
My flinters can go off with a breath of wind.
Worst triggers to work were old pre 64 WW rifles. I did it then too. Blink and the shot was gone!
there is a winter seed coming up Dec 4 but I think we are already busy that day I would have to travel to an inferno seed the last time we were over 100 was 2012AND, I want the Winterseed Patch. Given for a Rifleman's score below freezing.
A fella could do worse than patch all 3 in a year.
but below 32 that's easy weather to find, although the transition to sitting in snow pants might prove a challenge
Whatever you be , Be a good one
Interesting R5R. Seems only Olympic & 3 gun still use it in comp. I'm speaking true kneeling ***., not 'short legged off hand' or supported like 3-gun. All we did at Pendelton boot was standing, sitting and prone (M1). I did try it a few years back in the field in Ar. Much better sitting. Guess Appleseed is pre-training/selection for Olympics.
Whatever!
Appleseed is all about making 4MOA shooters the no specialized equipment any service grade gun and a GI cotton web sling the lesson is in body mechanics use your body don't fight it
learn hasty sling well and you should be looking at standing groups the size of a squirrel head
a set of easy to make shooting sticks may also help you with the squirrel hunting or other hunting.
Whatever you be , Be a good one
The "rice patty squat" is a pretty stable platform to shoot from. I would hope it's being taught/discussed in our Armed Forces rifle basic training???
Just a tip FWIW, but I've long shot with a sling, and if the barrel bears on the forend, using a tight sling WILL move POI, which can't be a good thing. What I've always done, to "cure" that, is to free float the barrel from the chamber area forward. I usually bed my guns from the action through the chamber area, and leave the barrel free floated. If you shoot with a sling, you have to have a bit more of a gap between barrel and forend to allow for a tiny bit of bending. Thicker forends of course bend less, while thinner ones are more easily bent. And it doesn't take much of a bend to have the forend touch the barrel, and change your POI. With the 10/22, you can't bed it that way very handily, but some bed the area of the barrel where the forend screw attaches the barreled action to the stock, and free float both the action and barrel forward of that point. This tends to eliminate or at worst, minimize the effect of a tight sling.
One other tip, with a stock that bends, like some of the injection molded plastic stocks, hogging out the forend helps often, and using a lightly tensioned sling will usually be allowed without POI changes IF you use that lighter tension on the sling. But you have to get out and test it to see how much pressure and tension you can get away with on any given stock.
Hope this helps? Using a sling is a GREAT aid in getting those bullets to go precisely where you want them to.
Appleseed is good at teaching the basics Standing, sitting and prone. I went to Appleseed and got Rifleman on the second day. I like how they train the basics so much that I brung my brothers out the next year.
I'd do that in a heartbeat Blackwater but the Take Down 10/22 attaches the front to the rear via the barrel. So the forestock is attached the to barrel rather than the receiver or the butt stock. There are alignment pins that connect the front stock to the back stock but all the tensioning occurs at the barrel (is my understanding).
Much easier to clean, much easier to carry when it's in two pieces and it holds its zero very nicely during attachment and disassembly - but I'm loathe to use a sling and tension it properly. The article I posted noted that he didn't use his sling tightly while my training says "MAKE IT TIGHT" never broken a sling but I've lost circulation in my hand a time or two...
if you shoot rifleman near the end of the second day you know you had to be working the possition in good form , the sling ,the NPOA getting it all right because your about spent , you hurt,your getting weak.
once you have it all down it's no fluke to shoot rifleman you are shooting it or very close to it nearly every target then it is whether you have an equipment malfunction or your neighbor shoots your target a few times if you make it or not.
I like the 5 spot drills , you can drill on what they are lacking , like shifting NPOA load 10 , on each spot find npoa fire 2 shift fire 2 , legs better be moving after every 2 shots
Whatever you be , Be a good one
it sounds like you need to try getting down in prone with a rest shoot a group then attach the sling and shoot a group and see the difference , there was a guy at the Appleseed a few weeks ago with a 10/22 take down with tech sights I didn't notice how he shot he was further down the line but he had the sling on his gun and he was getting in prone with a sling like everyone else.
he did not make rifleman but only 8 of nearly 40 did
as long as the sling tension is the same every time you can probably just adjust your sights to it
Whatever you be , Be a good one
Some pretty good info here and as shooting position plays such a large part in marksmanship, maybe some 'field' hunting position tips? Like a towel or soft pad for blind shooting? Sling is good but I've never seen it used in the field. Nothing against Apppleseed or any like it - just seems like comp. training, not field.
Whatever!
I have taken a few deer kneeling hasty sling before I even knew what appleseed was using a sling in a hang on tree stand is a sitting position
most of these deer were threading the needle shots I could see the deer walking but was in enough underbrush that I set up on the next opening and waited for the deer to walk into the cross hairs
one of the first things I do for the day when I get out hunting is make sure my sling is the right length for hasty sling and the clothing I am wearing it is only an adjustment of an inch or two conveniently at least for me a sling the right length for hasty sling works well for carrying the gun over my shoulder or under slung depending on barrel length
I haven't ever seen loop sling used in the field I agree that is a competition thing but hasty sling can be very useful in the field
Appleseed gets it's roots from Military training they are the RWVA revolutionary war veterans association.
Whatever you be , Be a good one
This is perhaps the most eloquent post on the matter I have ever read!
More "This is what happened when I,,,,," and less "What would happen if I,,,,"
Last of the original Group Buy Honcho's.
"Dueling should have never been made illegal in this country. It settled lots of issues between folks."- Char-Gar
Perpetual Student, you're right. I missed the takedown feature. Would a single point shooting sling work on the front end, with the barrel glassed in? Not ideal, but I've been shooting with a sling so long I feel naked without one.
And Green County Pete, like you, probably at least half the deer I've shot were with clamp on stands, and with a hasty sling. ALL of them over 100 yds, I think, were taken with a sling. I used to sit in my stand with the rifle sling wrapped around my arm so that whenever I brought it up, it just naturally tightened up. This lets me place my shots much better. Around here, most affix some sort of "rifle rest" in their stands. It REALLY helps the mediocre shots, but I think a few of them would miss if you could sit them INSIDE the deer! It's amazing how bad some folks are at shooting. I'd have thought one would have had to practice to get THAT bad! And not one of them will even make the least effort to learn to use a sling. You couldn't make them use one if it'd help them win the lottery!
I've nearly quit trying to help them. They're almost consistently the ones who simply won't do what you tell them to, and if I haven't heard ALL the possible reasons they won't even try, the few remaining ones are probably awaiting me next time I try to help. Very frustrating, and I've started almost consciously trying to offend them. If you can't deal with them and their natural attitude, sometimes offending them at least gets their attention. I've had a couple come back some time later, usually a pretty good while, and ask me for help again, and promising they'll at least try what I tell them to do. And it's always helped in every case I've had actually DO what I told them to do. They may not win any matches, but they do become better shots, and at least stand a chance of getting a good deer now and then. And maybe not wounding some to go off and die a terrible death. Some of these are the same guys who, if the deer reaches any kind of cover, stop their search right there. I just can't relate to folks like that very well, it seems. But in all honesty, I've kind'a quit trying to after a few inane treatments of what I've tried to do for them. If I can't help, at least I can cut my own losses. If their attitudes change, I'll try again, but it's got to be a significant attitude change. Those are few and far between usually, but they do happen. Missing a number of deer in close and "unmissable" sometimes has a beneficial effect on them. Many also have to go to a smaller caliber like .243, etc., so they're not afraid of their rifle's recoil. Very few of the bad shots will use ear muffs, too, and I've come to tell them if they won't wear the muffs, I can't teach them. Most will wear the muffs, but not all. I wish I'd worn muffs for thousands of .357 and .44 full loads! That nagging ringing might not be so loud now!
X16
X11
Semper Fi!!!
Hard to quantify but I know it when I see it.
Always thought of myself as a average shooter at best until started attending a few different forum shoots and range days.
I guess it was due to comparing myself to the best shooters at state and national championships with rifle and pistol. Now these shooters are the best in the country, compete at Olympics world champs etc so it is no surprise there skill level is way above mine.
When I compared myself against the average bloke I suddenly found my skill level was above average.
Outside of range shooting I think more important than skill level is knowing what shots you can make, those you cant and having the discipline to walk away on those you cant.
Son is quite a good shot having made state teams and winning more than his fair share of things along the way. I'm probably more proud of the fact he chose to pass up the first few oppertunites he had to bag his first deer because he wasn't confident in taking them than what he has won.
I strive to be as good a rifle/pistol shooter as my shooting buddies tell people I am, lol. I've done enough comp shooting to know what a really good shot can do and I'm not the shooter my buddies think I am. Still trying to learn to shoot a shotgun but some days I just can't get mad enough at those little orange birds.
Endowment Life Member NRA, Life Member TSRA, Member WACA, NRA Whittington Center, BBHC
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call, Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of depleted counterbalance devices.
Interesting read, different from the army rifle text. http://www.ar-15.ca/pdf/Section_08_S..._Positions.pdf
Whatever!
USMC 7th award Expert. Best shot--300 yd. headshot chipmunk with m-16 open sights
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I had expert with every weapon. My daughter has all of my stuff. But I was a shooter before going into service. I wish we had more to teach the young like old days. I learned myself though for the love. Today they shoot by pushing a button on a machine. My dad might have never fired a gun or caught a fish but I was a fishing nut. Fishing and hunting every spare second. I don't know where it came from with no help. I was left alone to do what I wanted to. Outside in the morning and might not go home until way after dark. Ride a bike 30 miles to fish.
Best time was when a neighbor went fishing to take me. I would tie a string to my foot and hang it out the window so when he got up, he would yank on it. Yeah, life was great back then and we were free from liberals. Born and raised in Cleveland and roamed the whole city as kids. Took guns to school to hunt and check traps after. Yeah, even in the city. Short distance out of town to find pheasant and quail, squirrels and fish.
Parents get arrested today if kids roam. In 1956 and later I never was anywhere without a BH .44 on my hip. Model 27 way before that and the Mark I. Loaded my own for everything, shotgun to rifle.
I was working a paper route on a bike, go to Avon Hardware and buy a .220 Swift or .300 Weatherby, Got the BH in the mail from Kleins Sporting Goods in CHI. Lived with Herter's catalogs.
Most here were not even thought of or born, you just don't know.
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