Subsonic .308 with bullseye?

[95GTSpeedDemon]

I know this is an old thread but apparently new interest in the subject. Mr. Harris himself told us under no circumstances to use a filler with the fast powders. What does it take? A white dove with a handwritten note from the Good Lord Himself telling us not to? Adding fillers is a good way to ring a chamber and ruin a good rifle.
Good Luck all, and take care,
Rick

I did see that through out my searching.

Also curious if bullseye in a 25% case fill is powder location sensitive. Since its a fast burner, it shouldnt be, but 25% is rather low.

[95GTSpeedDemon]

getting QL as close as i can to capacity with these 220gr bullets (corelokt 22792)(1.325" long), which puts it in the 48.236gr case capacity range. interpolating other like data between nosler data and QL, it could be .4gr higher capacity.
48.236 cap with 7.4gr of BE is 25.1% fill shows 1079fps from a 16" barrel, also shows 17113 max pressure.

is this a receipt for disaster, whether from S.E.E or a bullet getting stuck?

[35 Whelen]

Come on guys, read through the thread. Bullseye is NOT position sensitive and it DOESN'T require (nor should you ever use) a filler.

35W

[95GTSpeedDemon]

Come on guys, read through the thread. Bullseye is NOT position sensitive and it DOESN'T require (nor should you ever use) a filler.

35W

Position sensitive at what fill percentage though? I feel like that probably makes a difference. If it doesn't, that is even better for what I'm trying to do.

[95GTSpeedDemon]

I went back thru the thread and re-read. Percentage fill was brought up and it seems like I'm in a safe Zone as it was tested to like 18% fill. That was cast boolits, so is it still safe to use jacketed bullets?

[Kestrel4k]

I know this thread is very old... I was curious if the people who have tried this have updates.
Im looking to try loading some .308 winchester with 180 and 220gr coreloks i was given and bullseye i have.
These are jacketed bullets so i wanted to find out if jacketed stuff will still work or its cast only.

Curious if you are wedded to the idea of using those 180's & 220's in such a fashion ?
Reason I'm asking is that there are some very nice .308Win loads using 110gr FMJ's and fast powders such as Bullseye.
I have obtained excellent accuracy & a quite-usable ~1800 fps using Red Dot; I would expect a similar result with Bullseye.

[95GTSpeedDemon]

Curious if you are wedded to the idea of using those 180's & 220's in such a fashion ?
Reason I'm asking is that there are some very nice .308Win loads using 110gr FMJ's and fast powders such as Bullseye.
I have obtained excellent accuracy & a quite-usable ~1800 fps using Red Dot; I would expect a similar result with Bullseye.

yes, i was researching if i could load them with BE to make them subsonic. just for fun out of the can.
what the loading specs with red dot @ 1800fps?

most sub loads with large cases use trailboss a fluffy powder to increase fill ratio. info on that is abundant and well known.
i did find the titegroup info... very interesting. TG is only 3 places slower on the burn chart. TG shows a fill ratio of 30.7%


Bullet: 175 GR. HDY SUB-X
Diameter: 0.308"
Case: Winchester
Primer: Winchester LR, Large Rifle
Starting Load Maximum Load Availability
Manufacturer Powder C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure
Hodgdon Titegroup
2.490" 8.5 1,023 23,900 PSI Buy Now

Bullet: 190 GR. HDY SUB-X
Diameter: 0.308"
Case: Winchester
Primer: Winchester LR, Large Rifle
Starting Load Maximum Load Availability
Manufacturer Powder C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure
Hodgdon Titegroup
2.690" 8.7 1,004 23,600 PSI Buy Now

Bullet: 205 GR. SIE GK
Diameter: 0.308"
Case: Winchester
Primer: Federal 210M, Large Rifle Match
Starting Load Maximum Load Availability
Manufacturer Powder C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure
Hodgdon Titegroup
2.750" 9.3 1,062 27,000 PSI Buy Now

Bullet: 220 GR. SIE HPBT
Diameter: 0.308"
Case: Winchester
Primer: Winchester LR, Large Rifle
Starting Load Maximum Load Availability
Manufacturer Powder C.O.L. Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure Grs. Vel. (ft/s) Pressure
Hodgdon Titegroup
2.795" 9.7 1,069 29,500 PSI Buy Now

[95GTSpeedDemon]

Attachment 323054

[HumptyDumpty]

Thats excellent to hear.
I found no published data and only one or two random people that said jacketed .308 worked with BE in subs as most used cast boolits, so i was super hesistant to try. I got my hands on quickload and it yelled at me about the starting pressure, which others said it does with jacketed bullets.
Did you use a filler?

I did not use a filler.

[Larry Gibson]

Come on guys, read through the thread. Bullseye is NOT position sensitive and it DOESN'T require (nor should you ever use) a filler.

35W

Concur with 35W, never use a filler with bullseye or similar burn rate powders. With Bullseye, as mentioned, they are simply not needed.

[libertyman777]

Trail boss is your friend in .308

[Larry Gibson]

In my suppressed 308W rifle the standard cast bullet load is a Lee 170 gr FP over 6.5 gr Bullseye in LC M80 cases, fire formed with the flash holes drilled. Velocity runs just under 1100 fps [900 - 2000 feet elevation]. It is quite accurate and thumps with authority.

[uscra112]

I've used a tuft of kapok to hold powder closer to the primer, but not with Bullseye. Have never used Cream of Wheat or anything like.

FWIW I do a trick for slugging barrels that involves a VERY small charge of Bullseye to deliberately stick the bullet in the barrel. For the .303 Savage I last did this with it was 3 grains. THAT tiny load was highly position sensitive. Muzzle down it never ignited at all. Muzzle vertical was the only way it would fire and move the bullet. So yes, at some point it becomes position sensitive, but probably not at any load we would normally use.

[95GTSpeedDemon]

So my buddy had some tight group so we loaded 9.7 grains of that with the 220 grain core lock in my 16 in AR. It went 1200 feet per second which is 150 faster than what Hodgson says it'll do. We then loaded 6.8 grains of Bullseye and it went around 850. And we put 7.4 and got around 950.

[john.k]

I suggest you read up on 'ringing chambers' before shooting any more .........I read up 'after' ......too late.

[95GTSpeedDemon]

I suggest you read up on 'ringing chambers' before shooting any more .........I read up 'after' ......too late.

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...t=ring+chamber
Easily-ignited, relatively fast-burning pistol or shotgun powders, having NO deterrent coating, and which tolerate the free airspace in the case, such as Bullseye, Unique, PB, Universal, SR7625, Herco are not the problem.

Most prone to chamber ringing are heavily deterrent coated, spheroidal powders such as 296, H110, 680, 1680, H335, Ball C2, 748, H380, H450, etc. in which there is a high percentage of deterrent coating, and a small particle size in the base grain.

[racepres]

Glad this came back around. I have been working with Nitro100NF. 45ACP, 45LC, 38SPL, and some very mild 44Mag.
I notice it is a bit bulkier than Bullseye. Recommended charge weight is close! So it may be a Natural for the loadings I was Doing with Bullseye, and Maybe even the Red Dot Loads... Red Dot is still more Bulky, than Nitro100NF...FWIW
At these Charge levels...I do Not worry much about % of Fill...I try to use what is Published...but, have gone Much Under!
Let the Warnings Begin!!!

Edit; Tho we are all Reloaders, and Therefor, naturally cautious, and detail oriented. We May need to adjust our Nomenclature a Bit, since Many of us are using BE-86 Powder.. the BE thing is Distracting...Not Problematic, just Distracting. For My Old Butt anyway

[popper]

The normal procedure for sub loads is start a min load and work DOWN. Was reading a post that a guy was getting stuck bullets (jacketed, 30 cal) at 700 fps. Why that low? Yup, he'd pound out the stuck one and then no problem. He's looking for a problem!! No real reason to go below 900 fps. Even in a pistol. Go throw rocks if you want slower. Personally I have no use for subs but do shoot @ 1200-1500 fps depending on mood.

[GONRA]

GONRA reminds ya'll - a "stuck bullet" in any blowback semiauto - KABOOM! !!
WATCHOUT! !!

[nanuk]

For the .303 Savage I last did this with it was 3 grains. THAT tiny load was highly position sensitive. Muzzle down it never ignited at all.

When you pulled those bullets and dumped the powder, what did it look like? Could it be used again?