Highwall Questions

[Les Staley]

Somebody please tell me what CPA stands for!

[Don McDowell]

Somebody please tell me what CPA stands for!

http://singleshotrifles.com

[GOPHER SLAYER]

I own an original Winchester 1885 and a Uberti clone, both in 38-55. Both of them shoot very well. I used the Uberti in black powder matches because the Winchester's chamber was a bit too tight for my black powder reloads. While I have never owned the Jap version, I have heard and read that you best not take one apart unless you are a factory engineer. I think that is a bit of an exaggeration but I have read several times that owners of the rifle took them apart and had to hire someone to put them back together.

[NSB]

I have read several times that owners of the rifle took them apart and had to hire someone to put them back together.

That part is true. It's also true that there are a lot of people who've taken all sorts of guns apart and had to get someone to put them back together for them. I lost count of how many Ruger semi rimfire I've had to re-assemble for people. The High Wall is probably one of the most difficult. Fortunately, it rarely needs to come apart. You can do a Lee Shaver trigger job on one of these without the services of a gunsmith. Lee will send you almost idiot proof instructions on how to get the parts out he needs to work on, and for about thirty-five bucks you get a 1.5lb trigger with almost no creep in it at all. Other than that, you can shoot them for years without complete disassembly. A bit complicated? Yes, but they're still a very high quality, accurate rifle. No reason not to buy one.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

NSB, I agree that the Jap hi-wall is a very well made rifle. The problem I had with the earlier ones is that they were made as a modern rifle, that is with no tang and to be used for hunting and not target shooting. In my opinion the gun was too lite for the 45-70 cartridge. When the black powder cartridge version came out, that was more to my liking. I have no idea how well they performed in matches. BTW, I have owned several hi-walls over the years and never took one apart or felt the need to. My Winchester has a Don Rice set trigger and sometimes while cleaning the bore between shots I would accidently push forward on the set trigger when the lever was down and I would then have to remove the butt stock and reset the lever on the trigger. A real pain when you are in the middle of a match.

[NSB]

NSB, I agree that the Jap hi-wall is a very well made rifle. The problem I had with the earlier ones is that they were made as a modern rifle, that is with no tang and to be used for hunting and not target shooting. In my opinion the gun was too lite for the 45-70 cartridge. When the black powder cartridge version came out, that was more to my liking. I have no idea how well they performed in matches. BTW, I have owned several hi-walls over the years and never took one apart or felt the need to. My Winchester has a Don Rice set trigger and sometimes while cleaning the bore between shots I would accidently push forward on the set trigger when the lever was down and I would then have to remove the butt stock and reset the lever on the trigger. A real pain when you are in the middle of a match.

The Winchester/Miroku High Walls all had tangs on them. The Browning High Walls did not have tangs on them unless they were the BPCR model which had Badger barrels and tangs on them for target shooting. The BPCR's performed very, very well in matches but weren't really set up for hunting. They were longer, heavier, and had no sling swivel studs on them. The studs could be easily remedied, but the weight and length could not. At this time, it's very difficult to even find a good used Browning High Wall, even the ones without the tang. The Winchester's are still available if you look and you can even find them NIB at some locations. For the money, I've never owned a better made or more accurate rifle than the one I have now.....and I've owned a lot of guns.

[oldred]

I have had a new Winchester apart several times and while it's not as difficult to reassemble as say a Remington nylon 66 it's not for the casual tinkerer either and certainly not even close to being as simple as the classic 1885. That is just one of the points of my earlier posts, folks often discuss these rifles and lump them all together as if they are somehow the same rifle when nothing could be father from the truth, not everyone is aware of these differences nor the fact that the Jap rifles are a modern design and not the classic 1885 as it was.

[Les Staley]

Thanks for the reply, Don. Can I blame you if I just have to get one?

[Don McDowell]

That'ld be fine Les, I won one in the drawing at the BPTR nationals a couple years ago, have bought two more since then...

[grizzly]

Thanks for all the input. I think I am going to opt for the Winchester. While I like the looks of the Uberti with the case hardened frame, I think the Winchester will suit my needs just as well. I'm more interested in the action style and just shooting that any period type nostalgia. I have been eyeballing the Marlin cowboy too though. All I been reading is it shoots very well also.

[Baja_Traveler]

Somebody please tell me what CPA stands for!

OK - While I had Gale on the phone yesterday ordering a capper/decapper for schuetzen, I asked this question for you and here is the answer:

Way back in the day Caroline and Paul Shuttleworth started a company and called it CP & Associates (First initials of their first names) - later to be shortened to CPA

[grizzly]

Just to update this thread. I decided to pull the proverbial trigger and get the Winchester in the 45-70 flavor. It's ordered and should arrive in the next 5-7 business days.

I thought long and hard about getting the Uberti. In fact I returned to the store today and looked it over again. It was nice. The buckhorn sights are horrendous. One would need to immediately outfit with a vernier style. I figured this would set it back another $200 minimum. While I am sure the dealer was wrong, He stated that I would need to drill and tap the tang for a sight. I wasn't interested in that and I still think he was wrong. A call to Uberti didn't yield much info either.

In the end the Winchester will be better suited overall. Its equipped with swivel studs ad drilled and tapped for a scope if I ever consider scoping it. Slightly modernized by externally simple.

I do have a question for those who are in the know with single shot shooting. This isn't a BPCR. But, I'm unsure what the overall differences are other than barrel weight and length and the CCH. This model is a 28" Hunter 1885 High Wall.

I've considered getting texasmacs book even though it isn't a BPCR. I am going to try my hand at some BPCR loads though. Would the book be beneficial?

Thanks for the guidance.

[bigted]

Definitely get the book ... YES IT IS THAT GOOD. I have the Browning BPCR gun in 45-70 and love it to pieces. Also the Browning has an extractor ... Not the ejector you will get on the hunter model.

Your hunter is equiped with a case stop that is adjustable to stop the ejected case, block its travel either left or right, or do nothing at all which allows the ejected case to be slung straight back outta the action. Great rifles and im certain you will have a super good time with it.

[grizzly]

Definitely get the book ... YES IT IS THAT GOOD. I have the Browning BPCR gun in 45-70 and love it to pieces. Also the Browning has an extractor ... Not the ejector you will get on the hunter model.

Your hunter is equiped with a case stop that is adjustable to stop the ejected case, block its travel either left or right, or do nothing at all which allows the ejected case to be slung straight back outta the action. Great rifles and im certain you will have a super good time with it.

Thanks. Definitely going to order that book this evening.

i was reading the manual I downloaded this evening. The difference in ejection seems different as you said.

Also so what is the actual difference aside from that and the CHF from the BPCR? This has perplexed me. There isn't a tremendous amount of info on these newer rifles.

[EDG]

The Hunter has a straight grip and the curved rifle butt with a medium to light weight barrel of unknown origin.

The BPCR has a shotgun butt with a heavy pistol grip butt stock. The barrels were made by Badger and were a heavy half round half octagon 30" long.
The BPCRs included a decent tang and globe front sight.

The BPCR rifles have an extractor only and no deflector. There are no sling swivel bases

The non BPCR rifles have an ejector and the adjustable ejection deflector. There are sling swivel bases.

Thanks. Definitely going to order that book this evening.

i was reading the manual I downloaded this evening. The difference in ejection seems different as you said.

Also so what is the actual difference aside from that and the CHF from the BPCR? This has perplexed me. There isn't a tremendous amount of info on these newer rifles.

[grizzly]

Thanks EDG. Definitely seems like a rifle more for competition. I'd like to put hands on one. These rifles around these parts are like unicorns.

In other news. Today Cabelas was offering a Veterans Day discount. I looked at a Pedersoli 1875 Sharps. Sadly I walked out of the store with it. With all the discounts I got, I couldn't turn it down. After some range time in afraid this will quickly lead to an addiction.

The buckhorn sights took a few shots to get used to. But once I did she put 4 in a 1 1/2" group at 100. My eyes suck, and I was using a BR target intended for scopes. I was more than satisfied with that performance.

[EDG]

The author of the book on the Browning/Winchester Miroku rifles, Wayne McLerran, deals in these rifles and he can find you one or you can troll Gun Broker and the BPCR and Single Shot Rifle forums. The standard rifles weigh about 8.5lbs to 9lbs. The BPCR weighs about 2 oz short of 12 lbs.
Wayne's handle is TexasMac.

http://www.texas-mac.com/index.html

I bought a BPCR rifle in 2000 right after they had been discontinued. They have nearly doubled in price since then.

Thanks EDG. Definitely seems like a rifle more for competition. I'd like to put hands on one. These rifles around these parts are like unicorns.

In other news. Today Cabelas was offering a Veterans Day discount. I looked at a Pedersoli 1875 Sharps. Sadly I walked out of the store with it. With all the discounts I got, I couldn't turn it down. After some range time in afraid this will quickly lead to an addiction.

The buckhorn sights took a few shots to get used to. But once I did she put 4 in a 1 1/2" group at 100. My eyes suck, and I was using a BR target intended for scopes. I was more than satisfied with that performance.

[supe47]

Somebody please tell me what CPA stands for!

John Boy
11-06-2014, 08:55 PM

Folks, we all know CPA Rifles. I asked Paul on day - "What does CPA stand for?
Reply ... Catherine Paul Associates, aka CPA

[Ed in North Texas]

I regularly shoot an 1872 NYSM Roller and an 1874 Swede Roller. I do reload for both, keeping to black powder cast boolit loads. Modern commercial loads for the .38-55 would be kept to the SAAMI pressure spec for original rifles. Why wouldn't you reload boolit loads and know for sure exactly what you have?