Brent Danielson's Paper Patching Website

[dromia]

How sad this all is.

I don't know anything about Messers Wasserburger, DanT and Venturino other than Mr Wasserburger is a member here along with five and a half thousand others and Mr Venturino is a gun rag hack.

I also don't know what they've done to help people make and shoot paper patch boolits.

What I do know is what Brent Danielson did to help people make and shoot paper patch boolits. He took some of his life to write up what he'd learnt about the subject and make it available free of charge to other interested people via the World Wide Web. As far as I know that the others haven't been so altruistc.

So Brent your actions on this subject have far more merit in helping this pastime than the other three. Actions speak louder than words

In the www we all have to assess what value anything we read has. Some things suit some people some things suit others. It seems to me from the little I know from this thread that you allow the three gentlemen's value judgement on your web pages to have more weight than the value that hundred's if not thousands of others who visited your web pages do.

Brent why give those three such power over you?

They have quiet rightly their own view of the world, maybe Mr Wasserburger needs to be a top shot competitive shooter and sharing his hard earned knowledge and skill would jeopardise this. Mr Venturino wants to make his living as a gun writer, maybe free access to knowledge jeopardises his book and article sales. Both reasonable motivations. No one knows what their needs and motivations are, but what ever they are, they are theirs not yours Brent.

Be true to yourself Brent and do that which meets your motivation and needs not someone else's.

We are all judged on our actions. From your actions in putting up the article on the web your motivation seemed to be to share. That action was appreciated by others.

The action of taking down seems to have been motivated by the words of three other people.

This wonderful pastime of ours is supposed to be fun, it meets many needs in all of us but the future of the world isn't dependant on it.

We should all have a less than serious view on all this and when it gets a bit tense and emotions run high we should take a step back and get in into perspective.

So please Brent think of the people whose enjoyment of their pastime and themselves has been enriched by your actions and don't let that be spoiled and yourself upset by your response to the actions of three other shooters.

But then I'm not a top class caster, handloader writer or shooter. I have also never claimed to be good at anything so what would I know and why should you listen to me?

[waksupi]

It is peculiar with some of the "experts". They seem ready to tell of thier successes in a victory against very limited numbers. Yet, when they come in near last place in a large engagement, no drum beating accompanies thier approach.

I'd like to see the info available.

[docone31]

I dunno. Some of those experts gave me some good reading. I do not know if I learned a great deal from it, but, when the family was asleep I got to live in the sport of shooting.
Brent. I found his site years ago. I had read THE PAPER JACKET. I got my copy from Dixie Gun Works. I read it, and read it. I made paper cartridges for my 1853 Sharps repro, my 1861 Remington. I had a ball. Definately found out why people went to metallic cartridges.
Years later, I stumbled onto Brent's tutorial. It was great! I understood very little, but, I loved it.
It actually wasn't untill I found this site that I actually wrapped my first paper patched bullet. In 20 minutes from start to finish with no previous experience, I wrapped 50 bullets. I will be daggoned if they did not come out useable!
Brent has certainly done a serious job on his site. I go back to it from time to time. After wrapping my own, I get more out of reading his work. He did a great job, but, this site got me wrapping. I mean start to finish. People reccomended the sizing die, paper, tools, technique.
Badabing Badaboom! 50 shootable bullets.
Kudos to us.
A link to his site on here would definately be an asset also.

[alamogunr]

Somewhere in my files, I have a print out of Mr. Danielson's web page on paper patching. I'm sure there are many like me who have never tried it and may never try it but the information should be available if needed. I especially liked the picture of him with an elk killed with, I assume, a paper patched boolet.

Regarding those who objected to his web page, I read all of Mr. Venturino's articles in the slick mags (I get them from a friend who has a friend who works for the printer). He hardly ever uses anything but linotype for his smokeless bullets(our boolets) and probably commercially obtained lead/tin alloys for BP. Since I'm not a writer, I could not afford that. Also most of us are not able to shoot long range BPCR like he and Mr. Wasserberger. If I tried, the bullet would pass through three houses and a barn before it reached the target. Such are the penalties of living east of the Mississippi River.

[Nazgul]

These "experts" really do like to let us small people know how good they are. I have noticed it in MV's writing. Try counting the I,Me, Mine words in one of his articles.

Sorry if this is non productive, it irritates me some. Keep patching Brent.

Don

[kjg]

Brent, PLEEEEEEEEEEAse sir, let us at cast boolits host the paper, my buddies here have tried and tried, to help me with paper patching and I just cannot get it right, and I need help no REAL HELP (grin), i've for years had folks say crap about me and ya know what, lawenforcement teaches ya one thing words only hurt if you let it.kjg

[Morgan Astorbilt]

Brent, I think Buckshot speaks for the overwhelming majority of us.
I'm not new to shooting, but am to this board, and I make it a point to explain and illustrate(maybe overdo it), my techniques for machining pertaining to firearms, and my experiences forming and loading ammunition for obsolete cartridges. A lot of it may be "old hat" to the regulars, but new shooters are in need of info. Why let those guys win?
Morgan

[SharpsShooter]

Another vote for hosting your paper here at Cast Boolits. It would be a shame to preclude both current and future shooters a good source of information on a subject that is scarcely written about in the first place. Many experienced shooters are turning back to the paper patch as a “new” method to further their shooting knowledge and add to the nostalgia and fun of BPCR. My first attempts were guided by instructions written on the envelope that contained the patches cut by PowderBurner along with the boolits he freely gave to get me started. That’s the spirit of this board as we help one another along………BTW Thanks Dean.

Brent, I hope you will consider this for a home for your hard earned knowledge.



SS

[ktw]

Not to take anything away from Brent Danielson's paper, I too found it very worthwhile, but there's nothing stopping any one of us from putting up a tutorial on our own.

It would not even have to be an individual effort. A lot of the content is scattered around here already. All it would take is someone willing to collect it up, organize it and revise it periodically based on contributions by others...

-ktw

[405]

I don't know any of the individuals who have been presented as "experts" in the art of loading or shooting PP. I got most of my info when first starting on PP loading from Matthews. I did read BD's paper when it first came out on the iastate.edu site. Even made a copy. I liked the background info used re: original Sharps cartridges. Anything on the internet has to be taken with a brain that works and capable of some filtering. I thought and still do that BD's paper was/is useful. The more info out there the better. Still takes one's own logic and reasoning to make things work. So yes BD's paper should be available to the public.

The only part of the paper that got me head-scratching and still does is the part about "reading the patch". He spent quite a bit of time and effort on that and even presented examples from others about what a patch is and isn't supposed to look like after firing. The only thing I know is a tight weave cotton patch is supposed to come out whole when shot from a muzzleloader shooting roundball. The superiority of a paper patch coming out whole from of a fired BPCR paper patch round is beyond my experience???

[BrentD]

Guys, I really appreciate the support and the number of emails asking for help with paper patching is rising like the river in my backyard (and that is not trivial!).

So, I'll put a up revised version. It will take a while. Probably most of the summer, but I'll up it back up. I have most of it already revised but it's buggy as hell and I can't do website construction for beans.

But beware, these are only "beginner" bullets. They don't come with training wheels but they probably shoot. And don't forget I'm not an nonexpert. Anyone doubting that didn't see me shoot this weekend.

Thanks again for the support.
Brent

[duke76]

Thanks Brent, glad to hear it. Todd

[docone31]

Jeepers Brent. An honour.
Your site made a difference to me. A good start to an ultimate end.
Thanks.

[SharpsShooter]

I'll be looking forward to reading it Brent. Let us know when it is ready.

Thanks

SS

[Don McDowell]

How sad this all is.

I don't know anything about Messers Wasserburger, DanT and Venturino other than Mr Wasserburger is a member here along with five and a half thousand others and Mr Venturino is a gun rag hack.
:

It is a shame Danielson pulled his web page , as many have stated it was good info readily avialable.

Just to help fill you in dromia,
Wasserburger has 9 or 10 national championships, and some notable accomplishments in world competition. He's never been shy about anwering folks questions in person, and has many many threads on Shiloh, full of his technique and results availabe for anyone with gumption enough to go look up,and there again he hasn't failed to answer anybodies serious questions.
Dan T is another shooter of National and World acclaim, plus along with his own shooting talents, he has desigined a goodly number of bullets folks that spend a goodly amount of time in the winners circles nowdays use. He has also done quite a bit of chamber design work that is prooving itself in championships won. Besides his shooting and designing ability, he has quite a number of tutorials posted at bpcr. net,plus a number of threads about various things on the Shiloh forum.
Venturino has spent an awful lot of time writing articles, and publishing books on shooting the old obsolete stuff, and all the while getting soundly trashed for alot of his work, but he has yet to quit writing for gun rags or pulled his books off the market.

[dromia]

Thanks for the background Don, much appreciated.

[9.3X62AL]

I'm not sure what has caused the recent spate of sniping and flaming in a couple threads here, but I for one think it needs to end. Brent D's experience is EXACTLY why I say this--an experimenter or hobbyist discovers or re-discovers a process/method to enhance shooting success, takes it public in some fashion, then gets crucified for doing so. Quite a disincentive, I'd say, and such treatment will cause MANY others to stay low and keep dark rather than share experience and add to discussions. There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism done respectfully--that is how refinement occurs. But HAVE SOME CLASS, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD.

[leftiye]

Maybe a sticky?

[Finn45]

Another yes for bringing it back online thank you.

[Bigjohn]

How sad this all is.

I don't know anything about Messers Wasserburger, DanT and Venturino other than Mr Wasserburger is a member here along with five and a half thousand others and Mr Venturino is a gun rag hack.

I also don't know what they've done to help people make and shoot paper patch boolits.

What I do know is what Brent Danielson did to help people make and shoot paper patch boolits. He took some of his life to write up what he'd learnt about the subject and make it available free of charge to other interested people via the World Wide Web. As far as I know that the others haven't been so altruistc.

So Brent your actions on this subject have far more merit in helping this pastime than the other three. Actions speak louder than words

In the www we all have to assess what value anything we read has. Some things suit some people some things suit others. It seems to me from the little I know from this thread that you allow the three gentlemen's value judgement on your web pages to have more weight than the value that hundred's if not thousands of others who visited your web pages do.

Brent why give those three such power over you?

They have quiet rightly their own view of the world, maybe Mr Wasserburger needs to be a top shot competitive shooter and sharing his hard earned knowledge and skill would jeopardise this. Mr Venturino wants to make his living as a gun writer, maybe free access to knowledge jeopardises his book and article sales. Both reasonable motivations. No one knows what their needs and motivations are, but what ever they are, they are theirs not yours Brent.

Be true to yourself Brent and do that which meets your motivation and needs not someone else's.

We are all judged on our actions. From your actions in putting up the article on the web your motivation seemed to be to share. That action was appreciated by others.

The action of taking down seems to have been motivated by the words of three other people.

This wonderful pastime of ours is supposed to be fun, it meets many needs in all of us but the future of the world isn't dependant on it.

We should all have a less than serious view on all this and when it gets a bit tense and emotions run high we should take a step back and get in into perspective.

So please Brent think of the people whose enjoyment of their pastime and themselves has been enriched by your actions and don't let that be spoiled and yourself upset by your response to the actions of three other shooters.

But then I'm not a top class caster, handloader writer or shooter. I have also never claimed to be good at anything so what would I know and why should you listen to me?

Brent;
Some years ago, I did a 'search' for articles on paper patched projectiles so I could increase the knowledge I already had on the subject. Your site was the one which came in at the top of the list.
I read the information it contained with great interest and went as far as printing a copy for future reference purposes.
I also contacted your via email asking further questions on the subject and received many answers.

I belatedly 'Thank You' for your assistance at that time and for everytime I have read your works since then. This is more help than I would have been likely to receive from some of those persons mentions in Dromia's posting, who by the way, did not even register in my search.

I found and still find your articles easy to read and comprehend without the great technical foofar which some people hide behind.

I hope that your material does resurface on the net as a service to those shooters, like me who need the information they can use to get them started out.

To those people who took it upon themselves to tear Brent down, all I can say is sit back for a moment and have a damn good long look at yourselves.

YOU to, may have something to contribute to the sport, but rubbishing someone else's work for whatever reason is destructive to our sport. Help rather than hinder is the way to go.

In closing; Brent, chin up mate, and thank you again for your help,

John.