Ruger no.1 build underway, 1000 yrd rifle.

[Jedman]

Your project seems to be moving along at a good pace, much faster then my projects ever go.
It has only been less than a month since you started this thread about your rifle and have made great progress.
Looking forward to seeing future pics on the progress and to see it when finished and hear how She shoots since her name is Ma Belle.

Jedman

[Tnfalconer]

I have little doubt it will shoot well at this point but there is always a chance that it will need tweeking for sure. I like to get all the parts together before I really start in on a project. This one has been rolling around in my head for quite some time so it just needed to be put together. When you know what you want it's sort of easy to get things rolling. I am also very lucky to have good friends in the industry to help me get things done. I still have quite a ways to go as all I have at this point is a big pile of parts. Most of which require hand work now to finish. The stocks will take most of a month to finish by themselves so this is just the beginning.

[Tnfalconer]

So after a decent hiatus, I am back in the shop working on the Ruger. No.1

It seems the farther I get with this project the more questions I create versus answers. Now that the 50BMG barrel has been turned down and fitted it's time to chamber. The caliber selected is 50-90 sharps and I am giving thought to gas checks, grease or paper patching. Black powder will be the propellant of choice that I have established. Case capacity, even with this larger cartridge is a concern. Keep in mind this is a 1-15 twist barrel. Using the rockrat 880 grn bullet as the standard I plan to use, here are some questions.

Gas checks and grease work, will gas checks and paper patching work or offer any advantage? If paper patching will allow the bullet to be seated shallow in the case, I would prefer to use it. For no other reason than it allows more capacity. I do want the ability to extract a loaded round. In doing so I will need to throat the barrel for the deeper bullet. So that is what I am looking for information on now as I am at the point of chambering, loading and getting some smoke out of the thing finally.

[Chill Wills]

All I can think of is recoil. Should be a full, stout, shoulder banger.

GC at bp velocity are not likely needed. I guess they (GC's) are used at the "Q"? Maybe not so at other matches.

An almost 900 grain bullet propelled by BP supplied from the 50-90 Sharps (50-2.5") right? With this pairing I am seeing just about 1000 -1050 FPS with Swiss 1.5Fg. Not much more. Oh, and some recoil.

I am not sure you have any ballistic advantage here and likely a 45-70 BP paired with 540gr Money type bullet will best it hands down. If I understand what you propose, anyway. Not trying to be a killjoy, just thinking aloud - on the keyboard, as it were....

[Tnfalconer]

The major advantage will be ballistics. Particularly the BC of the bullet I have chosen to use, one reason for it being so heavy is that it is LONG. It has a BC that is twice that of the "Money" bullet. That means less elevation and less correction for the wind as well with the weight. Those 45-70's get pushed around a LOT down there in June with 20 plus variable winds being a near constant. This one will not get pushed around, at least not as much. I am looking for MV of 1300 FPS. If straight BP doesn't get me there, I will duplex as a last resort. It will be a kicker for sure. No way to get around that. With a rifle in the estimated 19-23 pound range, should help. The rest I will just suck up.

[Chill Wills]

So you have a bullet with a Bc of 1.1 - 1.2? Measured at what velocity range?

I think to get 1300fps out of it you will be loading smokeless and topping off with BP as a filler.

I would be interested in an image of the bullet if one is available. Who is the maker, rockrat bullets, maybe rockrat bullet mold? I am unsure who that is.

Sorry, I do not want to sound like a ___________ - it is this is a bit out of the norm. I have questions

[Tnfalconer]

Me too...that's why I am building it.

[rockrat]

Chill Wills----go to the NOE site and look up his .512 mould selection and you will find the image of the boolit




Rockrat

50BMG.pdf

[bigted]

im just prusing thru and wanted to coment on your bullet dropper. sounds fun [except for the recoil ... my 45-120 gives me all i want and then some with a 600 gr paper patch ... not too many of those in a row for me]. cant wait to see your finished rifle. sounds rite down sexy.

[Tnfalconer]

This is one that Rock rat sent me before Lathe turning....

[Chill Wills]

This is one that Rock rat sent me before Lathe turning....

So, .... if you are going to double the Bc of the pictured bullet, (lathe turning) it will be unrecognizable from the one pictured. Again, not being cranky, but the bullet pictured and in the posted plans isn't of much help (to us) if the one you are going to use in matches is nothing like it.

A 1.0 Bc, give or take, would be a very long, slippery bullet, with all the correct angles, radius, and nose geometry. And I would like to see a plan or image of that. I am thinking if everything is correct a bullet length much greater than two inches and maybe three plus is required. There is a point where diminished returns negates all else.

[marlinman93]

I'm wondering if your shoulder will stand 48 shots for score, plus sighters during the preceding days to know sight settings? I'm sure it will do better in the wind, just not sure it will matter to your body.

[Tnfalconer]

It will certainly be a hammer. In that respect I am quite accustomed and comfortable with heavy recoiling rifles. Time will tell how bad it actually is when it is all said and done. My reference for another gunsmith friend was "I plan to load it until I can't stand to shoot it anymore, and stop there". I have been running ballistic calculations this afternoon and what I am seeing is very, VERY promising. All things being equal starting at 1300 FPS it only drops 300 FPS at 1,000 yards. Velocity estimated at 900-980 depending on the parameters entered, wind and whatnot. Dropping the muzzle velocity to 1000 FPS shows an even small drop of just 180 FPS at 1,000 yards. As I have mentioned before in another thread it is very promising on paper and computer modeling. The proof will be in the pudding and the targets for sure and I am just as anxious to get it working to put these theories to the test.

[Tnfalconer]

So, .... if you are going to double the Bc of the pictured bullet, (lathe turning) it will be unrecognizable from the one pictured. Again, not being cranky, but the bullet pictured and in the posted plans isn't of much help (to us) if the one you are going to use in matches is nothing like it.

A 1.0 Bc, give or take, would be a very long, slippery bullet, with all the correct angles, radius, and nose geometry. And I would like to see a plan or image of that. I am thinking if everything is correct a bullet length much greater than two inches and maybe three plus is required. There is a point where diminished returns negates all else.

The long and short of it is I won't be posting my homework for the bullet itself until it is all hammered in stone. The ones I plan to use in matches will not be posted at all for public view. After all this thread is about the rifle, not the bullet. I am aware however that the bullet is a HUGE hinge component of all of this working out. Not being secret squirrel or anything I am just not sure I want someone standing on my work just yet. Just know that no matter what I do it will be a solid lead projectile to be in accordance with the rules of the match. There is no definition or rule as to what it has to look like. The fact is it may take several attempts to get it just right. When I get it "just right", I will be glad to post a pic of it but as far as posting schematics or dimensions on it, I won't be doing that either. 1.0 BC is the goal and a lofty one at that. So far with computer modeling all I have been able to achieve is around .6 with a poured bullet. With CNC I can not only increase the BC by modifying the shape for a higher BC but I can also control a lot of other small things. It's going to be a good amount of work, I know. I like playing with things like this and if it doesn't fulfill all of my hopes and dreams for it that's cool too. I just don't see that happening.

[Chill Wills]

Okay. 10-4 on that. I will bug out and wait to see you shooting lights out at some Creedmoor match. The Q is one venue and paper matches are another. I favor the paper matches - more resolution on the target for accuracy feedback - but that is me.

All the best. I hope you are shooting soon - like this season.

I will be the guy watching from the peanut gallery.

[Tnfalconer]

Unfortunately this rifle won't be legal for any of the NRA matches, at least not for score anyway. The ruger no.1 isn't an approved action for competition. It has to have an exposed hammer to be admitted. I will be shooting the local 1k buffalo matches and the mile match I mentioned earlier. Along with the "Q" it should be plenty along with the other matches held in Forsyth, I should be good to go.

I will be load developing on paper so I will post some of that. Our local spot has video on target out to 1500 yards so I can maybe post some video as well as targets when we get a little farther along. For now I am still batting around paper patching or just sticking with a grease bullet and letting it rip, that and getting some more 50-90 brass are really all that is holding me up from load development. The rifle isn't finished mind you but it will be ready to shoot soon. After I am done screwing with the chambering it will need to be torn all apart again for refinishing, of which I haven't decided on yet.

[Chill Wills]

That is not true. The Ruger #1 action is legal for all NRA black powder target rifle matches.

[woodbutcher]

This looks like fun.I`ll saddle up and go along for the ride.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

[Tnfalconer]

That is not true. The Ruger #1 action is legal for all NRA black powder target rifle matches.

Last time I looked at the rules the black powder silhouette matches require an external hammer rifle. Unless it has changed.

[Tnfalconer]

3.4 Black Powder Cartridge Rifle - A hunting or military style rifle, single shot, originally made for black powder cartridges, of United States manufacture prior to 1896 and being typical of the era. Replicas thereof, regardless of origin of manufacture, are permitted. Hammer must be exposed. If replacement barrels, stocks, or other parts are used, they must be as original. No Schuetzen-style rifles permitted. One rifle will be used during all phases of the match. Examples of permissible rifles are: Ballard, Buck, Bullard, Cole, Farrow, Maynard, Peabody, Redfield, Remington Hepburn, Remington Rolling Block, Sharps, Springfield Trapdoor, Stevens Tip-up, Stevens No. 44, Wesson Falling Block, Wesson (hinged barrel), Whitney Phoenix, Whitney Rolling Block, Winchester 1885, and Wurfflein. While the following single shot actions may not conform to the exact criteria of Rule 3.4, they are allowed because they conform to the spirit of the competition in forth and function, provided the firearms conform to all other configurations of Rule 3.4: Browning Model 1878, Browning Model 1885, C. Sharps '75, Falling Block Works, Stevens 44 1/2 and Wickliff '76. Replicas other than exact reproductions of pre-1896 Black Powder actions as described above and shooting equipment as described herein, must be passed by the Silhouette Committee with the advice of the Black Powder Committee. It shall be the competitor's responsibility to provide any documentation which may be required to establish that all Black Powder Cartridge Rifle equipment conforms to these rules.