Boolits and bullets foul bores. Do gas checks?

[rockydoc]

Do gas checks foul? I know how to remove copper fouling and lead fouling. How would one remove aluminum fouling?

[Dragonheart]

Powder coat and not worry about it.

[Walter Laich]

Powder coat and not worry about it.

+1
there is a whole subsection on coating bullets--I do it and won't be going back to lubing

[Yodogsandman]

I asked the same question about using aluminum checks. The answer came back loud and clear that they really don't foul the bore. Now, I need to test that out for myself!

[Boolseye]

When used correctly, gas checks prevent fouling.
Any fouling I have ever had with a gas check boolit was lead fouling, and it was due to poor boolit fit.

[MT Chambers]

I believe that copper gas checks help clean the bore from lead and carbon, though prolly not copper fouling, aluminum checks scare me because aluminum has a tendency to gall and that would be very hard to remove if evident.

[rockydoc]

Powder coat and not worry about it.

Thanks.
I have read some of the stickys on Powder Coating. There are a lot of differing opinions as to what is best and those opinions are STRONGLY held (and still differing).
There is: Hi-Tek; HFPC; Piglet; Spray can epoxy; ESPC; DT; BBTD; ADBB etc.,etc. The one thing most agree on is that Alternative Coatings are no substitute for Gas Checks.
I am attracted to an Alternative Coating, but I don't know which one to use. I don't care to do all the experimenting that has been done on the Alternative Coatings Forum.
Simple, easy, cheap, not too time consuming, no leading with velocity and accuracy, etc. Is there one that does ALL that? I am particularly interested in velocity and accuracy in rifles.
I realize that we have jumped from gas checks to powder coating, but I am the OP and I am following your responses. Thanks for all the expertise that is shared on this website.

[Dragonheart]

[QUOTE=rockydoc;3724488]
The one thing most agree on is that Alternative Coatings are no substitute for Gas Checks.

Rockydoc, before you accept the above statement as gospel ask those that make this statement exactly what a gas check does and what PC does for a bullet.

To answer that question I went go to the most knowledgeable person I know on the gas check subject and that man is Charles Darnall. Charlie has spent years studying and developing gas checks and is the designer and maker of a number of the Freechex gas check making tools. I own three of his tools. I think if you ask Charlie he will tell you what he has told me, that powder coating has made the gas check unnecessary as it does what a check does and more. I personally still make gas checks and for only one reason, I have some molds that are gas check molds that cast a bullet for which there is no substitute.

As far as experimenting, most of us have found a method that works for us, but we are always looking for something a little better. I suggest you give PC a try as you might be surprised and there is plenty of help here to get you started.

[Yodogsandman]

Simple, easy, cheap, not too time consuming, no leading with velocity and accuracy, etc. Is there one that does ALL that? I am particularly interested in velocity and accuracy in rifles.

rockydoc, Ben's Liquid Lube does ALL that. Some have had problems getting one of the two ingredients, Johnsons One Step Floor Wax, though. BLL is mixed 60/40, Lee Liquid Alox/Johnsons One Step. Boolits are easily tumble lubed with it and accuracy has been great with no leading. Loads have been tested to about 2500 FPS.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-L-Liquid-Lube

PC rifle boolits can be shot at high velocities with gas checks, just as regularly lubed and GC'd boolits. Accuracy is "in the eye of the beholder", though. I can't get accuracy up to my standards but, others have their own standards. Maybe you could see some of the more accurate groups shown in the PC thread to see what PC does for you.

Gas checks protect the base of the boolit from damage and seal the bore, preventing hot gasses from gas cutting the sides of the boolit and ruining accuracy. They perform the same job whether boolits are lubed or PC'd.

[rockydoc]

I suggest you give PC a try as you might be surprised and there is plenty of help here to get you started.[/QUOTE]

What method do you use?

[rockydoc]

[QUOTE=Yodogsandman;3724604]rockydoc, Ben's Liquid Lube does ALL that. Some have had problems getting one of the two ingredients, Johnsons One Step Floor Wax, though. BLL is mixed 60/40, Lee Liquid Alox/Johnsons One Step. Boolits are easily tumble lubed with it and accuracy has been great with no leading. Loads have been tested to about 2500 FPS.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-L-Liquid-Lube

I have used 45/45/10. I take it that BLL does not need the mineral spirits? Is there a difference between Johnson's One Step and Johnson's Paste Floor Wax (JPW).
Thanks.

[Dragonheart]

I started out PC on the recommendation of a fellow club member just after Sandy Hook. The evening the shooting report came over the news my wife told me I should go order enough components to keep me shooting for the next two years. I asked if she was serious and she said most definitely, so I ordered over $1K in powder and primers and within a couple of days I found she was absolutely right, because the shelves were bare. What I didn't order was more bullets as I had several thousand on hand, but with shooting and practicing in the IDPA, the bullets on hand were disappearing fast. Then an old guy in my gun club showed me his PC bullets. I had never see anything like this before and he told me he coated them by shaking bullets and powder in a cool-whip container then cured them in a toaster oven. I got enough information from him to get started and that was how I started. I quickly found I needed more production than a cool whip container and that is when I altered a small vibrator tumbler to tumble coat bullets. The tumbler enabled me to quickly coat several hundred handgun bullets at a time and my large toaster oven can cure 1K+ bullet in a single cook. I already had my operation perfected from gathering information from commercial coaters, not bullets. It was some time later that I found this site and started sharing the things I had learned like the design of my tumbler, cooking on silicon baking mats, etc. and picking up information from other doing casting and coating. I did find a lot here were spray coating so I gave it a try and now I use both coating methods. The tumbling method is faster, but spraying lays down a more even coating. PC got me back into casting something I gave up years ago because I never like the sticky mess and never planned to go back to it, for that matter I still don't. But now I cast and powder coat because I enjoy it. I have developed PC handgun loads that rival the accuracy of copper jackets at a fraction of the cost and I can control my bullet supply. Any questions you have I will be happy to answer. You can always PM me if you need a length discussion.

[Yodogsandman]

[
I have used 45/45/10. I take it that BLL does not need the mineral spirits? Is there a difference between Johnson's One Step and Johnson's Paste Floor Wax (JPW).
Thanks.

Johnsons Paste Wax

(From www.k-state.edu)

By weight: Isoparaffinic hydrocarbon solvent 75-85%, Paraffin wax 10-30%, Carnauba Wax 5-10%.

Used as a finished wood wax, also on bare metal to retard rust. Used in bullet lube blended with various lube ingredients and alone as lube. There are several good discussions on Johnsons Paste Wax as bullet lube at "CastBoolits.com", use the search function and type in Johnsons Paste Wax. From the LASC site...http://www.lasc.us/LubeIngredients.htm#JohnsonsPasteWax

Johnsons One Step Liquid Floor Wax is a floor wax that's in liquid form and dries quickly to a hard finish. The exact ingredients are proprietory. It's also been discontinued by Johnsons. Lundmark Liquid Floor Wax is being tested as a replacement (also cut with mineral spirits).

[shoot-n-lead]

powder coat and not worry about it.

x 2^^^^^

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Boolits and bullets foul bores. Do gas checks?
Do gas checks foul? I know how to remove copper fouling and lead fouling. How would one remove aluminum fouling?

Regarding cast lead boolits , if you look at the primary reason for lead fouled bores (gas cutting from undersized boolit), you can then imagine that if a installed GC (be it copper or alum), if it's undersized, it will probably also will get cut. The copper or alum will be interspersed with the lead fouling.

Regarding fouling from GCs being like jacketed bullets, I don't believe copper or alum GC's will foul the bore like a jacketed bullets, because of the lube...assuming the boolits are lubed. Which brings me to PC. I've experienced burnt PC fouling in the bore, no one ever mentions that, they just mention how great it is. bottom line, if you PC, you have to still do things correctly, it's not a fix all.

[Dragonheart]

Regarding cast lead boolits , if you look at the primary reason for lead fouled bores (gas cutting from undersized boolit), you can then imagine that if a installed GC (be it copper or alum), if it's undersized, it will probably also will get cut. The copper or alum will be interspersed with the lead fouling.

Regarding fouling from GCs being like jacketed bullets, I don't believe copper or alum GC's will foul the bore like a jacketed bullets, because of the lube...assuming the boolits are lubed. Which brings me to PC. I've experienced burnt PC fouling in the bore, no one ever mentions that, they just mention how great it is. bottom line, if you PC, you have to still do things correctly, it's not a fix all.

If you are PC correctly there won't be burnt powder coating. If you are getting paraffin residue most likely the polymer wasn't cured properly or possibly too thin of a coating. The benefits of a .002+ PC is a polymer jacket encasing a soft inner core and like other jacket material. The polymer can withstand the very short duration of high heat at ignition like a properly installed gas check or jacket. You have created a jacketed bullet so there is no need of a gas check, the polymer is doing what a gas check does. But since the base of a gas check designed bullet is not uniform, I gas check then powder coat my bullets.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Dragonheart,
The PC fouling issue I had in the past was with 40S&W TL boolits PC'd with the piglet method.
I don't PC, I've just used samples from others. Some day I'll have success in shooting PC boolits, in fact I did a recent trade and got some samples (Lee and HM² version of C312-155) to shoot in 30-06.