Lee Classic Loader- found something interesting

[Magnum0710]

Hello everyone,
I'm new to reloading so I thought the best place to start would be with a Lee Classic aka the whack a mole. I got a 38 special loader used but it was missing the priming rod/Capper. I went to the Lee website to look for replacement parts, also decided to get the dipper and load data for 357 magnum since I had to place an order anyway.
While I was going through the replacement parts I happened to notice something very interesting. As I'm sure you all know the 38 loader can be used to load 357 and vice versa. I was also interested in the 9mm loader as well and low and behold roughly 90% of the parts for the 38/357 are also used in the 9mm Lee Loader.
Everything but the main body die and the decapping chamber are exactly the same between 9mm and 38! Lose a part of one kit and you can use the same part from another. Lee had the 9mm body for sale as a replacement part, until I made the mistake of emailing them to make sure I was correct in my assumption. They took it down once they realized anyone with a 38 or 357 loader could basically buy the 9mm body and load 9mm as well.
I deprimed a piece of 9mm brass with the 38 decap chamber and it worked too so you could literally just swap the body and load 9mm as well. This revelation got me to thinking and I wanted to get some advice.
Since most of the parts are the same between 38/357 and 9mm I'm thinking most of the parts would be the same in the discontinued 380 auto Lee Classic as well.
Is there anyway to resize brass without a press, or are the dimensions close enough to reload 380 with the 38/357 body? They're both straight walled so it wouldn't be like using the 9mm loader to load 380. I've heard of people reloading 380 with the 9mm loader and it working out fine. I have a copy of the 380 charge table, if I order the .3 cc dipper and can find a way to resize the brass I believe I could load 380 auto as well. I've heard that 380 could be resized on a normal 38 reloading die but I don't know how true that is.
I would really like to get the 380 Lee Classic just for kicks but unfortunately Lee doesn't make it anymore. I found one on ebay but the bid went up to almost $100 and at that point I could get a hand press and 380 dies for the same price.
I don't plan to do this as a regular thing I'm more or less wondering if it can be done in an emergency shtf situation.
I do plan on getting a press and dies which is why I decided against getting a 9mm Loader in addition to my 38/357 loader. I found someone willing to sell me the 9mm body but figured im better off putting the money into a press. I just can't help but wonder if something like this couldn't be pulled off it was absolutely necessary.

[john.k]

Get a press ,and forget all the hand stuff ........unfortunately? the older stuff has become collectors items ,for people who probably dont even know what reloading is ,but just have zillions of different collectables for sale on various net forums.............I must say my very first Lee hand loader was just plain wrong ,and that put me off them ,permanently (thats around 1970,by the way)

[Land Owner]

Go to SAAMI Z299.3 Centerfire Pistol Revolver, download each cartridge case measurements, and compare them side-by-side. Reloading dies are cut to SAAMI Standards. If there are ANY measurements that do not match up, BEWARE, as you will be treading into uncharted territory.

[Bmi48219]

Magnum0710,
Welcome to the CB Forum. As you have noticed some of the parts in Lee Classic Loaders are used in multiple different cartridge kits. I don’t know that Lee Engineering tries to hide this fact, it makes sense from a manufacturing perspective use as many common parts as possible.
I have several Lee Classic kits (but not one for .380). I use the 9 mm depriming punch and base for depriming everything from .380 to 45 acp.
The point made in post #2 has merit. As finances allow you’ll progress to more refined loading equipment. You could probably cobble together a multi-caliber Lee Classic kit for emergency use but as post #3 states, SAAMI specs are everything. You may be disappointed with the results.
A used Lee Classic kit costs about as much as you’ll have to pay for a used set of dies or a used mechanical powder scale. Each of these will last forever but you’ll ultimately get far more use from the powder scale.
Plan your acquisitions to compliment the reloading setup you want to have a year from now.
The CB Swapping and Selling Sub-forum is a good place to get the equipment you need at reasonable cost. You may need to have 30 posts to place a ‘Want To Buy’ post there but you can watch for the items you want and buy them if someone else posts them for sale.
Good Luck!

[Magnum0710]

Thanks everyone!
I definitely want to move up to a press sooner rather than later. It will probably have to be the Lee portable hand press, I live in an apartment and just don't have the room for a dedicated set up right now.
I did take a look at the SAAMI specs for 38 special and 380, they are off by a hair so not something I would exactly trust. For now I'm just going to focus on 38/357 and worry about my other calibers once I get a press and dies. 38 and 357 is by far the most expensive caliber I use and the one I enjoy shooting the most so that's my main focus anyway.
Now I just have to find a local source for powder and primers and I'll be good to go!

[MUSTANG]

Magnum0710:

Many years ago (1970's); I used the basic "Wack-A-Mole" Lee reloading kits for reloading .38/357, 9mm, .45ACP, and 30-06. They took very little storage space for a young Marine who had little space in the barracks - and the were easy to put into a sea bag when reassigned, TAD, or.... Still have them "Just in Case" in Ammo Can storage.

When conditions allow it for you; step up to a press as it makes reloading easier. I started out in the 1970's with an RCBS Rock Chucker press (Bought the "Reloading Kit" they had with press, powder measurers, etc...). Buy a good quality press within your budget, take care of it, and it will be with you for a long while. My Rock Chucker still performs most of my pistol and .223 reloading duties; and is sitting un front of me tight now after many/many/many 10's of thousands of rounds reloaded.

Best wishes on your reloading journey. Where are you located?

[Texas by God]

I started out with Lee Loaders for my 22-250 rifle and .38 S&W revolver in 1972 at the age of 14.
It took time to load a batch, but back then twenty rifle shells and 50 revolver shells would last me a week.
Within a year or two my brothers and I chipped in for a RCBS JR press- and history ensued.
I only have two Lee Loaders at present.
One is for .223; out of curiosity I loaded some ammo to see if it would run in an AR15- which it did with no problem.
The other is the Target version- for 30-06.
It lives up to its name; producing very accurate ammo(according to my Tikka T3).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Wayne Smith]

Years ago I came across an old salesman's display case - and lo and behold I could put my RCBS Jr. 2 in it, the clamps and towel I put on the table and the board I put under the dining room table when I mounted it, four sets of die boxes, and my RCBS 505 scale and my RCBS powder measure. That case served me for years before it essentially disintegrated. By then I was in a house.

[farmbif]

there is nothing at all wrong with a lee loader, back about 40 something years ago when money was very tight and it was imperative to eliminate the critters that could destroy our harvest thats all we used to reload the old 222 rem and those lee loader rounds produced one shot kills each and every time.

[Magnum0710]

I'm hoping to load my first rounds later this week, I have 300 Hornady 158 grain swc and brass for days. I'll be going to pick up powder and primers sometime in the next couple days. I'm really leaning towards Unique but just incase the shop doesn't have it I'm going to bring some different load data with me so I can settle on 1 or 2 different powders if need be.
I did have an idea I'd like to get some advice on, general consensus is this would be safe even if slightly inaccurate. As some of you may know Federal announced the HST in 357 magnum and to this day it still hasn't came out. I saw a video where a guy loaded some 9mm 147 grain HST bullets in 357 magnum and got some impressive results. I also read an article on the history of the Hydra-Shok and apparently Federal loaded the 147 grain 9mm Hydra-Shok in a 38 special +p+ load for the fbi. The idea was to give agents with revolvers the same performance they were getting with the 9mm.
I can get a pretty good deal of 500 pulled HST bullets (124 or 147) and I'm thinking about giving it a try. I figured worst case if they end up being super inaccurate or end up key holing I could save the rest for 9mm since I plan on reloading 9mm down the road anyway. What do you all think?

https://youtu.be/DUS_VHoSrBY?si=Xb5K2DYHc9lk2XJo

https://revolverguy.com/the-38-speci...-deep-journey/

[Land Owner]

Strictly "dimensional":
Brass OD - 357 Mag (0.3790") is 0.0010" diameter smaller than the 9mm (0.3800").

357 Mag - bullet diameter is 0.357" and the cartridge headspaces on the case rim.

9mm - bullet diameter is 0.355" and the cartridge headspaces on the case mouth.



I do not have "advice" in your thinking as I have neither experience with 9mm nor HST bullets.



It is an observation that a jacketed 0.355" 9mm bullet in a 0.357" Mag barrel is likely to be "difficult" to stabilize. You will be in "uncharted" territory, even if "close to the pin". Recommendation - buy HST's now and use later to reload for 9mm ammo.

If you reload a 147 grain HST bullet, designed for 9mm ammunition, in a 357 Magnum revolver or pistol, you do so, like all other "wildcatters", at your own risk. We "wildcat" (more than we admit) with projectiles of different diameter (or weight) than those published in the reloading manuals.

I size and shoot lead-alloy boolits, which are probably more "forgiving" than jacketed bullets, to 1.) bore diameter, 2.) +0.001" bore diameter, and 3.) +0.002" bore diameter. SO FAR - without mishap.

Depending on the lead-alloy, I regularly reload and shoot boolits for 380 ACP, 38 Spc., 357 Mag., 45 ACP, and 45 Colt, weighing slightly more (or less) than similar boolits of published loads. Recognize, not every die has been "tested" except as "similar" (wildcat) to those published. I have powder charged for similar, but unpublished, jacketed bullet and cast boolit weights (and Mfg.) that are "close to the pin". SO FAR - without mishap.

My "experimenting days" (if you can call it that) are pretty much over although I still ladder-load within published data.

[Scrounge]

Get a press ,and forget all the hand stuff ........unfortunately? the older stuff has become collectors items ,for people who probably dont even know what reloading is ,but just have zillions of different collectables for sale on various net forums.............I must say my very first Lee hand loader was just plain wrong ,and that put me off them ,permanently (thats around 1970,by the way)

Or get a lathe, and maybe a mill, learn to use them, and make your own. "Try it! You'll like it! Nothing bad will happen!"

Hi! My name is Bill, and I'm a toolohaulic!

[Castaway]

I have a press/dies for 45 Colt and also have a Lee Loader. For black powder loads, I usually go the Lee Loader route. Almost as fast and I fell I have greater control. I cheat and use a decrimper and also a priming tool. I also use a compression die so o can easily seat the bullet over a full case without deforming the bullet. A simple wack to seat bullet, turn over and crimp and you’re done

[sarge912]

It depends on what your goal is.
My favorite outdoor range is over an hour's drive.
If I want to test various loads of 45-70. as an example, I can pre-prep the cases at home on the press, prime them and then bring the different powders and bullets that I want to compare.

(I would also have a variety of starter rounds already completed.)
I have found other practical uses and have Lee Loaders in all the major calibers that I reload.
Of course, I picked most of them up at very reasonable prices, around $20 each, not too many to find anymore at that price range.

[deces]

If you are looking for a deal on reloading gear, check out Lee Precision. They are a sponsor of this board and the have a clearance section on their website for things that are roughly half off.

[gwpercle]

I started reloading with the Classic Loaders , still keep several around ...
But the Lee Hand Press Kit and a set of dies have the Classic Loader beat Seven Ways to Sunday . I can reload inside the house without all that banging .

The little hand press is just a neat thing to have ...I love it for decapping and priming cases .
I now reload all my handgun ammo on them inside my house or at my office desk .
It might prove cost efficient to go Hand Press and Dies for the 380 auto ...and who knows what else down the road .
I will admit the hand press is much faster than the Classic Loader !
Gary

[Magnum0710]

I'm planning on moving up to a hand press as soon as possible. It'll be more efficient and I have a bunch of 9mm and no way to load it right now. I couldn't pass up those HSTs they were definitely a steal. Factory HSTs go for $30 for 20 round boxes locally and if you're lucky you can get the 50 round boxes for right around $50 online. I got 500 bullets for $55 and then another 500 124 grain for $45.

[Land Owner]

Now you're talking! Here are the three "Retail" rules:
1.) Buy low.
2.) Sell high.
3.) Do not forget what's going on in the meantime.

Eleven ($0.11) cents apiece for the HST's and nine ($0.09) cents apiece for the lesser weight bullets is, I think, pretty good for jacketed projectiles in these high demand - low supply times.

Of course, purchasing a mold, scrounging some lead and WW's, purchasing a bit of Tin, and making your own lead-alloy projectiles is probably the least cost in the long run as you can make as many as you can shoot for very little "up front" cost, amortized to nearly "zero dollars" in equipment cost over the totality of number of boolits you make.

Example (ymmv):

Cost of mold: $30 (used, 2 cavity, 9mm x 124 gr., steel)
Cost of lead & WW's: $10 for 50#'s (or scrounge for free)
Cost of Tin: $10 for 1# (or flea market for less)
out of date steel, propane, 1/2 tank: $5 (flea market)
Propane: $25 for 20#'s
Turkey fryer: $10 (flea market)

[$30 + $10 + $10 + $5 + $25 +$10] = $90 for equipment


Make lead-alloy of (say) 49-49-2 percent Pb-WW-Sn
Tin at 2% ==> 1.0# of Tin divided by 0.02 Tin per # of lead = 50#'s of lead

(50#'s of lead times 7,000 grains per pound ) divided by 124 gr. per boolit = 2,822 boolits (theoretically and probably a little less)

Cost of equipment = $90 divided by 2,800 (say) = $0.0321 (~3 cents) per boolit.

The more you pour, the less the equipment costs (==> approaching $0.00), and 20#'s of propane goes a LONG way. Keep track of your FIXED (non-recurring) and CONSUMABLE (recurring) costs and see for yourself that reloading cast lead-alloy IS the economic way forward for practice, fun, and defense. Of course, jacketed factory projectiles have a defensive use too and should not be overlooked when their price is right.

[GONRA]

GONRA sez - magnum0710 - yer gonna drive yerself nuts with this.....
Listen to john.k

[15meter]

If you want to see the original owners "manual".

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...m-instructions