32-40 with 170 Grain Boolet for deer

[DonMountain]

A bunch of years ago I purchased a Winchester 94 John Wayne in 32-40 and stored it in the back of my gun safe. Recently I discovered that I was not going to live forever, and I might as well shoot the gun. So I purchased an RCBS 170 grain flat nosed gas checked mold for it and started looking for loads for deer hunting (short range woods hunting). And all the loads listed in my Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook (Third Edition) look like pistol loads. Their maximum speed for a 164 grain boolet is 1315 fps using 8.5 grains of Unique! I run faster and heavier cast boolet loads in my 44 magnum RedHawk! So, could any of you deer hunters experienced in cast boolet shooting suggest some loads that I might use in this modern Winchester 94 in 32-40 using a 170 grain gas checked boolet? I would appreciate it.

[dk17hmr]

Seems like 32-40 can be formed from 30-30 and a 32 special is a necked up 30-30. I would bet low end 32 special load data would be a good start. 170gr fngc at about 1800fps would kill deer no problem, I would think that velocity could happen in a modern 94. I have zero experience with it though.

[richhodg66]

I recently got a .32-40 and I must have the same Lyman manual. Load data is pretty anemic. Works for me, since mine is a relined rolling block that I'm told was never a strong enough action to handle .32-40. I have a nice mold, old Ideal, plain based bullet for the .32-40 I had been using in my .32 Winchester Special. Works well.

I'm guessing your RCBS bullet, cast soft would work at those velocities if you let the deer get close and placed your shots well. I doubt it would stay in the deer on a broad side shot.

Cases are easily formed from .30-30, they come up a bit short, but work fine, just takes carefully running through a full length sizer.

[Wincacher]

The original question did not ask about reforming brass for the 32-40 but since it has been addressed here my solution is to use the short 38-55 brass (2.08") and reform it to 32-40. It will stretch to where the reformed brass is the perfect length for the 32-40, 2.130" with no trimming necessary.
As to loads, the 32-40 was never designed to be a hunting cartridge but a target round for the popular Creedmor matches. That's why you won't find published loading info approaching the 30-30 or 32 Win Special. That having been said, 20.0 grains of 5744 with the 170 gr gas check bullet will produce a velocity around 1800 fps.

[M-Tecs]

I have an original 32-40 High Wall that I want to take Deer hunting if I ever get drawn for rifle season in ND. I hunt MN archery and Black Powder but no hunting spots in a rifle zone.

https://www.loaddata.com/Cartridge/32-40/192 This requires a subscription to see the complete load, but you still can see powders and velocities.

http://reloaders.gunloads.com/showth...2-40-Load-Data

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum...734&forum_id=8 Good info starting at post seven

[jlchucker]

My gunsmith friend has formed 32-40 brass from 30-30 many times. That caliber was pretty commonly found in leverguns when I was growing up back in the 1950's. I have to say, though, that in the little town where I grew up, most of the hunters back then used factory ammo--sometimes really old factory ammo.

[Outpost75]

In a modern post-1890 rifle like the Winchester 94 or Marlin 1893 powders of choice for full power hunting loads are IMR3031, 30 grains with RCBS #32-170FN or RL7, 24.5 grains with same bullet for about 1900 fps and 30,000 cup. Published load data is held down because of the weak action rifles, Ballards, etc. which are out there, so you generally won't see loads over about 24,000 cup.

While .32 Winchester Special data can be prudently used as a guide, the case body of the .32-40 is more tapered and has less capacity. In a strong rifle you cannot get enough 4895, 4064, RL15 or Varget into the case to get into trouble, as capacity is limited to about 30 grains with bullet seated as for fixed ammunition which will fed through the magazine at 2.55" OAL.

[LIMPINGJ]

Ken Waters' Pet Loads has the Lyman 321297 with 18 gr 4198 going 1550 fps, this is about a 180 gr boolit. He list the Speer 170 gr FN with 28.5 gr of 4895 going 1830 fps as his best hunting load in the 94 Win.

[DonMountain]

So, it appears that a good deer load with 170 grain gas checked boolet might work with SR 4759, IMR 4198, Reloader 7, IMR 3031 or IMR 4895 and maybe even IMR 4064, of which I have all of these powders. Now, which ones are the best ones to try? I cast up about 400 of these boolets last night and this morning and have the sizer die all ready in the LAM-II.

I just read the previous two posts and the loads recommended are very close to the book listed loads for a 170 grain boolet in the 30-30. So maybe I can look there for similar, workable loads?

[wmitty]

DM

I'd go with Re 7 and use the starting loads for the 170 gr boolits listed for the .30-30; the 3031 is a little slower burning, and is also a great powder in the .30-30 and .32 Special. Never got to try a .32-40, but it sounds like an outstanding cast boolit cartridge.

[DonMountain]

After looking at all the loadings offered by you kind gentleman, I think I am going to start with 25.0 grains of IMR 3031 and work up to the suggested 30.0 grains, as I have seen this loading listed in other places too. Since this rifle has such a short barrel, I think the faster powders might be the best choice. That is IMR 3031 or faster. Although I might try the 4895 at some point too, but I bet all of those loads were for a much longer barrel of a schutzen type rifle.

[6pt-sika]

I had a circa 1906 Marlin 1893 in 32-40 for awhile . Gun had a half round half octagon barrel and shot very nicely with either the Lyman 321297 , RCBS 32-170GC or the Ranch Dog 323-170GC .I used XMP5744 with these bullets and deferred to Venturino's loads using no more then 15 or 16 grains of powder hence my velocity stayed down around 1400 FPS . I shot at one deer with this rifle using the RCBS bullet and killed the little buck . He was about 42 yards from me when I fired hitting him behind the shoulder and thru both lungs . He walked perhaps ten yards after the shot and lay down . Took me a few minutes to get down out the tree in which I was perched and walked to him . When I arrived he was still alive but unable to stand so I put one more in his head and that was that . He would have died in a few more minutes but I saw no need to let it go like that . Some may say a touch more velocity would have made him die quicker maybe it would have and maybe it wouldn't have . I like the 32-40 quite a bit and wish I still had that rifle but such is life .

[DonMountain]

I resized 30-30 brass to 32-40 using Lee dies, and they are a little short of the recommended length in my 1949 Lyman reloading manual. Then I loaded 25.0 grains of IMR 3031 powder and seated the RCBS 170 GC FL boolet all the way to the crimping groove and crimped them in. Loading them in my Winchester 94 rifle I discovered that they are tight, ingraving the rifling by maybe 1/10th of an inch. But I can still extract them ok with lever. So I fired one (since I had only loaded one test round). At about 50 yards the boolet hit just low of center and went straight through, not tumbling like the 237 grain Mauser boolets that I had tried earlier. And the cases still had very rounded primers and were soft shooting. So I tried loading 26.0 grains of IMR 3031 to do some more testing tonight in better light. So it looks like the 30-30 cases will work out well with this boolet. And I just need to find the powder and load that will work the best for deer hunting this year.

[bigted]

Only thing i would add here, short brass has one fault and it can be a zinger for leading and accuracy.

The short brass that lacks going to the end of the chambrr leaves a GAP ahead of the case mouth. This gap is a hindrance to boolits of even semi soft lead mix. Before the boolit can jump this gap, gas can go round the base and begin to blow melted lead down the barrel before the seal is complete. Another boner is that a softer boolit may just obturate into the gap before being forced to size itself back into the rifling proper. Just a couple things to watch for.

[richhodg66]

I haven't shot a deer with a jacketed bullet in about ten years. The biggest bucks have been with arrows, but quite a few deer now have fallen to cast in various .30s a coupld of .35s, muzzle loaders, one .45-70 and one with a .32 Winchester Special. The bollet was, if I remember right, a clone of the Ranchdog bullet I got a mold for, so a fairly wide meplat. Anyway, the small doe I shot at about 60 yards through both lungs showed probably the best terminal performance of all the cast kills I've made, the exit hole showed clearly the bullet had expanded well. She didn't make it far, but hard to tell how far as she went straight down a very, very steep ridge she was standing on (thankfully a small deer, I'm getting too old for that recovery stuff) and piled up at the bottom. It did leave an easily followed blood trail. I should think that in a strong .32-40, similar performance could be expected.

[DonMountain]

Only thing i would add here, short brass has one fault and it can be a zinger for leading and accuracy.

The short brass that lacks going to the end of the chambrr leaves a GAP ahead of the case mouth. This gap is a hindrance to boolits of even semi soft lead mix. Before the boolit can jump this gap, gas can go round the base and begin to blow melted lead down the barrel before the seal is complete. Another boner is that a softer boolit may just obturate into the gap before being forced to size itself back into the rifling proper. Just a couple things to watch for.

Unfortunately the RCBS cast projectile (32-170-FNGC) won't allow crimping into the groove on proper length brass, and still fit in the chamber. The cartridge length is too long then, and the bullet is smashed into the rifling and won't allow the lever on the rifle to come all the way up to lock the action home. I think this bullet was probably designed for the 32 Winchester Special. Fortunately for me, if I use the short 30-30 converted brass, which is short by about 0.1", when I crimp into the crimping groove the bullet is just beginning to be engraved into the rifling right where it is supposed to be. So, if I wanted to resolve the case length problem, I would also have to buy a proper 32-40 bullet mold that would allow proper crimping. But I was successful with this rifle last year, killing three deer with it and all three dropped where they stood.

[9.3X62AL]

But I was successful with this rifle last year, killing three deer with it and all three dropped where they stood.

It doesn't get any better than THAT!

In 2013 when I elected to have my Win 94 x 25/35 with ringed chamber rebored to another larger caliber, I thought long and hard about having the rifle done up in 32/40. The 32/40 did not offer any attribute not offered by the 30/30 WCF, so I opted for the 38/55's larger-diameter and heavier-weight bullets.

[bosterr]

I use the Accurate Mold 323-180C. It probably has a bit longer nose than your RCBS mold and I trim Win 32-40 brass to 2.105 and get good crimping. This is in a 1897 vintage Winchester '94 with a 24" barrel. I tried all the powders you mentioned above and settled on IMR4895. 23.0 gr. gives me just under 1700. I took a whitetail doe a few years ago at about 90 yards (Lyman tang sight). Made a pencil sized hole centered in the lungs and it traveled about 40 yds.

[TCLouis]

According to Lee's manual case capacites are
30-30 2.45 cc
32 Winchester Special 2.54 cc
32-40 2.20 cc


Dang I did not even notice how old the thread was!

[DonMountain]

I use the Accurate Mold 323-180C. It probably has a bit longer nose than your RCBS mold and I trim Win 32-40 brass to 2.105 and get good crimping. This is in a 1897 vintage Winchester '94 with a 24" barrel. I tried all the powders you mentioned above and settled on IMR4895. 23.0 gr. gives me just under 1700. I took a whitetail doe a few years ago at about 90 yards (Lyman tang sight). Made a pencil sized hole centered in the lungs and it traveled about 40 yds.

I started reloading for this 32-40 with one of my 240 grain flat nosed 8 mm Mauser bullets and discovered that no matter what powder I used or how much, the bullets always tumbled. And I tried different sizing dies from 0.321" to 0.325" also. So I purchased the RCBS 170 grain 0.321 gas checked mold and got excellent accuracy from the first shot fired. And using the resized 30-30 brass and crimping in the crimping groove on this bullet works real well for deer hunting. Since this rifle has a very short carbine barrel I don't believe I would use it for ranges any more than 100 yards due to the short sighting distance between the sights. In other words I can't see that well with it, especially in dimmer light in the woods.