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Thread: 32-40 Brass Shortage Solved!

  1. #1
    Boolit Buddy rr2241tx's Avatar
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    32-40 Brass Shortage Solved!

    As has been endlessly discussed, seasonally available, periodically available, etc., brass has about dried up for many older chamberings. Now that Winchester is apparently out of the business of supplying brass and possibly even loaded ammo for 32-40 Winchester those of us who enjoy shooting ours have to get by on gun show/estate sale finds or make our own. My rifle is a Falling Block Works Model J with an RKSmith gain twist barrel, shuetzen rifle so a few cases will last a long time. But, here's the problem: I've only ever had 20 cases for this rifle and there is a 100 Shot offhand match coming up. Breech seating and reloading one case 120+ times in July heat and humidity isn't my idea of a good time. So to prepare for (heresy) shooting this match I bought a new NOE 4 hole bullet mold, a big box of Starline 38-55 Winchester brass and a set of RCBS Cowboy 32-40 Win dies. And, yes, my chamber is the Winchester (2.085") depth not the older 2.125". Still working on alloy, temperature and pace with the mold but that will get sorted out.

    Starline says their brass is hard and the case mouths may be dented. They aren't kidding. I began by trying to size the cases in one step. I got 20 made but lost 5 in the process. So the first step was to run a batch over a .375 expander to round out their mouths because almost any visible defect in the case mouth resulted in a folded case. As long as I was at it I set up the annealer and ran 200 of the expanded cases through it. This greatly reduced the reject rate but I still got a few folded cases. Each of the folded cases had a nick or burr on the case mouth before swaging, so maybe I should have trimmed and deburred after expanding them. All up I ended up with 216 usable cases and 12 fatalities. They all drop right in, so they're not too long and once trimmed to uniform length, inside and outside chamfered are ready to be loaded. All in all a pretty good way to spend a rainy afternoon. Here's a photo of the results:
    rr2241tx
    Timin' has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master MarkP's Avatar
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    Any defect will cause problems, in industry the trimming operation after head turning would sometime cause a little nick which result in a scrapped case. To reduce loss a mouth ironing operation is preformed just prior to the first taper die to iron out the imperfections. The punch fits the ID of the draw and a spring loaded die with an ID that is slightly larger than the OD of the final draw slips over the mouth. This is done on a double acting press (sub axis on the main ram)

    Die setup would be similar to a reloading die where the expander would be adjusted into the neck section of the die.

  3. #3
    Boolit Buddy
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    Those look good from over here. I made mine out of range pickup 30-30 cases but then I am not shooting the old Marlin in competitions. Enjoy your project!

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy rr2241tx's Avatar
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    MarkP, the industry guys obviously have a better method than mine. I had 6 of 200 fold on me and one that I discovered a crack in the mouth after I ran them through the annealer and 38-55 expander to round out the mouths. It seems to me that the folds began before the 32 expander would have come into play had I used that die to begin the reduction instead of going directly to the 32-40 full length size die, but maybe not. I'll try that next time.

    CW, range pickup 30-30 cases evaporated like spit on the sidewalk when the 2006 Mid-term elections were held. I have been shooting this rifle in competition since 2012 using a single W-W case. The Independence Day 100 Shot Offhand Match last year was the first time I'd attempted to shoot it in that match and by the end of the day I was turning in 10 shot targets with 4 hits on them. This year, I'm going in with sighters and record rounds preloaded and seated long enough to engrave the first driving band when chambered. May not improve my score, but I won't know that until it's tried.
    rr2241tx
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  5. #5
    Boolit Master

    Baja_Traveler's Avatar
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    I'm still perplexed as to why Starline isn't already making these.

    When I obtain a 32-40 barrel for my CPA, I'll have to duplicate your efforts.

  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy rr2241tx's Avatar
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    Starline recently did make a run of correctly headstamped brass for 32-40 for a company that plans to complete the transformation from 38-55 blanks to 32-40 but sieve-like memory has lost the name of that company. Apparently Starline feels that the demand does not justify the investment in tooling to make 32-40.
    rr2241tx
    Timin' has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    Like the idea of using the rcbs cowboy dies to form 32-40 cases from 38-55 ones. I have a rcbs case forming die around here some place now only if I can find it. I have 40 rem 32-40 cases and 40 Canadian CIL cases so that if in the case of me aquiring a 32-40 rifle at lease I'm set for cases for awhile. Frank

  8. #8
    Boolit Master gandydancer's Avatar
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    I have 12 20 round boxes of new winchester 32/40 Brass I've had for over 30 years also a hundred more in a plastic bag. guess i should look for a 32/40 rifle.

    I have a 32-40 rifle to use. I will be using new winchester Brass that's 30 years old. annealing this new/old brass a good idea or no? thanks for any information. Tom/gd
    Last edited by gandydancer; 06-06-2016 at 01:13 AM.
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  9. #9
    Boolit Buddy rr2241tx's Avatar
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    Gandy, I feel your pain. I have 19 rounds of 30-40 Krag and 47 rounds of 22 Mag that were given to me four or five years ago and I still don't have a rifle in either caliber. For that matter, there's 6 empty 32 WS cases I picked up at the range and haven't managed to find a rifle for as well. If all this stuff was Beany Babies instead of reloading gear my wife would think I'm a hoarder.
    rr2241tx
    Timin' has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    Name of company making 32/40 is Load X in N. CA . hope this helps .

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy rr2241tx's Avatar
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    Thought I'd pad my post count by letting you know how this all worked out. First, the cases I made in May didn't get used in July as planned. Long story, I shot that match with another rifle after wasting a lot of time experimenting with the new mold and several alloy mixes. I finally did find an alloy that made uniform bullets and performed well as fixed ammo during testing and made a pile of them.

    A couple of days prior to the October match, I greased the new bullets for the match and loaded up what I judged to be enough for sighters and record shots. That night, a fellow competitor commented that he was going to be close on having enough bullets to shoot the second day's 100 shot match. Hmm! Didn't see that on the announcement. So, I dug through the stash and located a box of 100 of the tapered bullets I had shot previously. Those were re-greased and hastily loaded up. All of which meant I had enough ammo but it was in two lots and needed to be shot in a specific order in order to have sighters for the 100 shot match and one round for the King Target. I wrote it all down and then promptly forgot to read the note while on the bench at the match.

    The new alloy/bullet shot pretty well but engraving more than a few at a time with my thumb proved to be a painful and ultimately fruitless endeavor. Lacking a cartridge seater, I pressed a small Grace screwdriver into service and managed to get them all seated for the first day's matches. In order to shoot the 100 shot match the second day, I needed to shoot at least two targets with the harder new bullet, switch to the sighter target and re-zero with the old, softer and heavier bullet then shoot the last eight targets with those rounds. This would leave me a few extra cartridges of that series to shoot the King Target. That plan went out the window. Conditions were very different the second day and I used all the sighters just getting on paper. About midway across target nine, I realized I had no cartridge to shoot the King Target with once I shot target ten. By that time I was getting pretty well satisfied with just keeping all the hits on paper so I pulled the best looking cartridge I had left and put it aside, leaving me one shot short.

    A brainstorm turned out to be just a mental disturbance and I decided that I could bum components to make the required 100th shot. A greased bullet of unknown age, weight and lube content was borrowed, a loose primer of unknown origin was scrounged, another competitor charged my case with powder from a measure labelled as 13.1 gr #9 which while safe, was quite different from the load I was zeroed with. The bummed bullet was barely started into the case and the whole conglomeration rammed home with the screwdriver handle as all the guilty parties looked on in anticipation as I fired the final mutt round. It hit the target posted 1 row up and 1 column left of target 10! Worse, it just nicked the paper, which cost me a shot that would have scored 25 on that target and left me short on target 10 resulting in the loss of another potential 25 points.

    Later on in the afternoon when the King Target was being shot, I pulled out my hoarded cartridge and did my best to hold steady on the target after a long day and nearly 140 shots already fired that day. The 20X scope barely had enough field of view to keep the target in the field of view. I missed the target so badly that the backer was unmarked! Luckily, the berm is high or I might have hit myself in the back of the head.

    Conclusions: While 214 cartridges is plenty for a 100 shot match, it isn't enough for a 201 shot match. Hard bullets need to be seated OFF the lands, engraving them by pushing the cases in by hand is hard on thumbs. If you're short of ammo, just be short. It costs fewer points to be one hit shy than to have extra hits on a target you have already shot and still be short on the last target. A bad day at the range is better than a good day at the office!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by rr2241tx; 10-11-2016 at 03:47 PM.
    rr2241tx
    Timin' has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

  12. #12
    In Remembrance Reverend Al's Avatar
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    I've mentioned this on other similar posts, but will repeat it again here. I have several .32-40 rifles and for years have fire-formed and used short .30-30 brass in them with very good results. Still bothers me to not have full, chamber length brass though so I finally broke down and bought a "Kal Max Case Stretcher" from Red River Rick out in Winnipeg, Manitoba. It's a jig with an extruding die which is used in conjunction with a 10 ton (in my case) porta-powder cylinder to stretch short cases in up to 3 draws to much longer lengths. Since I have a LOT of .30-30 brass and .32-40 and .38-55 rifles I felt the cost of purchase was justified. I also bought his accessory dies to extrude and lengthen .45-70 cases for my .40-82 WCF and .303 British cases for my .35 WCF 1895 rifle. The other advantage is that the cases can be stretched longer than the individual rifle's chamber and then trimmed back to exact chamber length (for best target shooting results in quality rifles). In the end it cost me about the same as buying another medium price range rifle to add to my already large collection of guns so I felt the cost was justified in my case. Unfortunately, since I have a LONG list of ongoing projects I haven't really played around with it too much yet, but plan to stretch a lot of short cases to suitable longer lengths ...

    http://kal.castpics.net/CaseStretcher.html

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  13. #13
    Boolit Bub
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    I would love to find some 32/40 cases.
    Visit us at The C+R Gun Collectors Forums

    [http://p090.ezboard.com/bcollectorguns35625

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    ive had far better luck forming 32 40 s from 30 30 than 38 55 who cares if there short your not filling them to the max on powder anyways
    iam i missing something here? is it too easy

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
    GOPHER SLAYER's Avatar
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    I have two 32-40 rifles and to supply ammo for them I simply run 32 Special brass thru my cowboy action sizing die. It only takes one pass and since it is already 32 caliber there is no need to expand the neck. I bought a gun collection a few years ago and with it I got several boxes of new 32 Special ammo. I pulled the bullets and used the brass. Works great.
    A GUN THAT'S COCKED AND UNLOADED AIN'T GOOD FOR NUTHIN'........... ROOSTER COGBURN

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Starline does make 32/40 brass but by Contract only . One as above Load X the the other is Track of the Wolf. under contract agreement
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  17. #17
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    I found a bag of about fifty primed cases last night rumaging thru my stash looking for misplaced 444 Brass! I had a bad of 100New 32/40 somewhere! Always wanted to build a single shot on a low wall in 32/40.
    Probably never will.

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  18. #18
    Boolit Master
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    if you use 30/30 brass to form 32/40 what is entailed? is it the same for 32/W,SPL.? and is 32,W,SPL. short also?

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master uscra112's Avatar
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    I've been wondering when somebody would come up with a tool like this.
    Cognitive Dissident

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
    GOPHER SLAYER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toot View Post
    if you use 30/30 brass to form 32/40 what is entailed? is it the same for 32/W,SPL.? and is 32,W,SPL. short also?
    Yes but your rifle will not know the difference. If you use 32SPL brass, at least the brass will have a 32 stamped on the bottom.
    A GUN THAT'S COCKED AND UNLOADED AIN'T GOOD FOR NUTHIN'........... ROOSTER COGBURN

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check