swedish mauser incident at the range yesterday

[Sur-shot]

By the way, the test pressure for every 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser gun is 65,992 psi, with no adverse effect. Every gun must stand up to one round of that blue pill, pressure test. So you were way above the standard pressure of a 30-06.
Ed

[Buckshot]

..............Yup, it'd been posted several times over the years. A very valuable lesson, especially for one who thought his reloading habits were top notch. Not so much as the results show No injuries. The action was shattered (and that's the correct word) because the casehead let go. This old NRA sporter had belonged to my great grandfather. My grandfather gave it to me along with quite a collection of factory/military 30-06 ammo. I happily and gleefully shot it all up over the years. Amazing to me is that the bore wasn't trashed due to corrosive priming, as I KNOW a lot of it was old military stuff. All I ever used was Hoppe's #9, because that's what g'pa had I had it all shot up before I could drive, and only shot it on the occasional visit.

After I got out of the Navy in '73 is when my real shooting/reloading started and that old "Sprangf'ld launched many a factory round and reload (cast AND jacketed) downrange. What I learned is that simply peering down though a case's mouth (especially one as long as the '06) is no bueno por ca-ca, as per the example of the result in the photo's. Ever since, I use a 1/4" x 3" wooden dowel as a positive check on partial/light loads.

I also got to see the aftermath of a guy shooting one of his buddies reloads at the range one time. I dis-remember the cartridge but the rifle was a stainless Savage bolt action, which managed to blow the barrel out of the action into the dirt about 10' in front of the bench. His scope's objective was bent straight up, and other then the missing barrel nothing else seemed amiss

..............Buckshot

[Kestrel4k]

By the way, the test pressure for every 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser gun is 65,992 psi, with no adverse effect. Every gun must stand up to one round of that blue pill, pressure test. So you were way above the standard pressure of a 30-06.

I was curious to model the OP's two loading configurations with Quickload:

From my understanding of the OP's postings (please correct if wrong), the standard load was 17gr of SR4759 w/ a 150gr cast bullet; then the excess case capacity was eliminated via Cream of Wheat to result in the outcome posted in this thread.

Although QL doesn't have a powder file for SR4759, I substituted 2400 for a comparable burning rate.
Big assumption I know, but it could still give us a ballpark figure.

The initial (& functional) 150gr cast load could have had a peak chamber pressure of ~21,000 psi - sounds reasonable so far.

Eliminating the unfilled case capacity with an uncompressible solid (COW in this case) could yield a new peak chamber pressure of something on the order of ~115,000 psi.

This assumes the COW was able to flow through the bottleneck and didn't compress into a unit, further increasing pressures beyond this figure.

Again, some pretty big assumptions for modeling, but it at least provides something to work with. Idle curiosity on my part is all.
Best regards,

[EDG]

use 4227 as a substitute for SR4759

I was curious to model the OP's two loading configurations with Quickload:

From my understanding of the OP's postings (please correct if wrong), the standard load was 17gr of SR4759 w/ a 150gr cast bullet; then the excess case capacity was eliminated via Cream of Wheat to result in the outcome posted in this thread.

Although QL doesn't have a powder file for SR4759, I substituted 2400 for a comparable burning rate.
Big assumption I know, but it could still give us a ballpark figure.

The initial (& functional) 150gr cast load could have had a peak chamber pressure of ~21,000 psi - sounds reasonable so far.

Eliminating the unfilled case capacity with an uncompressible solid (COW in this case) could yield a new peak chamber pressure of something on the order of ~115,000 psi.

This assumes the COW was able to flow through the bottleneck and didn't compress into a unit, further increasing pressures beyond this figure.

Again, some pretty big assumptions for modeling, but it at least provides something to work with. Idle curiosity on my part is all.
Best regards,

[Shiloh]

I went shooting yesterday with my Swedish mauser and got scared ****less when the extractor bent, got a unusual case head separation and got powder in my face coming out of the vent hole.

I had used my usual lucky pet load of 17 gr. SR4759 with a GC cast 150gr boolit. Can't figure out what the heck happened.

DO you trickle powder?? I loaded that powder in a Springfield. I used a designated caseful of powder for trickling. Somehow it got mixed in.
I was about four gr. over maximum load for a cast boolit. I was able to open the action and straighten out the extractor. Been shooting it for years since with no issues. Thank goodness it was an '03 rather than a Krag. I now double check, no longer trickle charges, and weigh the finished rounds.

I learned my lesson.

Shiloh

[guicksylver]

..ata boy...so now we know why COW MAY at times be appropriate for STRAIGHT walled cases like the 45-70 , 38-55, 32-40..BUT NEVER in a bottle neck case...

Also ..ALL powders will bridge given the right conditions..throw away the loading blocks when using fast powders in rifle cartridges... weight each charge AND load them ONE AT A TIME...too slow..you say ..I've had no problems you say..well NOT YET..you haven't..but now you know what you've got to look forward too..

As for the other Dacron type fillers ..perhaps they work..they don't for me ..but if you're not experienced enough and know exactly what you're doing they can blow groups and ring a barrel..I know guys are going to chime in here who have used them successfully...but not everyone follows the best practices for doing so and have ended up either ruining groups or barrels..

Really glad you got through this unharmed..sorry for the loss of your gun...eat the rest of your COW, get a new gun, forget the fillers and load one at a time..SLOW DOWN..

[jsn]

IIRC the concept is that anything that is a de facto wad in a bottle neck case could lead to ringing the chamber or worse.

COW, an actual wad, filler compressed that acts like a wad, etc.

I have been hand weighing all of my rifle charges and any magnum pistol for some time. There's too much at stake.

[Larry Gibson]

The key to using a Dacron filler is to use it correctly. Just like most everything we do in reloading there are correct ways to use/do things. There are also incorrect ways. Do them the incorrect way is what gets you into trouble.

I do not recommend a COW filler, even in straight walled cases.

I never recommend a wad which leaves a space between the wad and the base of the bullet.

There is a distinct difference between a wad and a filler for the use discussed here.

The OP stated this;

"One thing I did that I had never done before with this caliber and petload was using COW filler. Now, would this cause the pressure to go high enough to have something like this happen, could be."

The obvious answer to his question is; YES.

Classic case of using the wrong type of filler and not understanding the correct use of a filler thus using it incorrectly. Both serious errors, fortunately the OP was not injured.

[yeahbub]

Wow, what a wake-up call! That case condition tells what happened, though not what led to it. Not only massive extrusion, but major separation as well. From experience, I attribute this to three things: the decrease in expansion space occupied by the cream of wheat, the added mass, and the plug it formed when slammed forward blocking the exit. The interlocking nature of the granules under such pressure likely compressed it into a near-solid mass which had to be made to flow through a 6.5mm hole to escape. Very fortunately, it did. Unfortunately, not before some damage was done, but you were uninjured! What a generous blessing!

The M93 Mauser action is stronger than commonly given credit for. Some years ago, H. P. White Labs was tasked with testing two Swedes to destruction when they began to be imported and people were concerned about their safety. IIRC, one blew at 98,000 psi and the other at 106,000 psi. The report is published, for those who are interested, but I no longer have the link for it.

[prsman23]

Glad you are ok!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Larry Gibson]

but yet I still can find 8 year old posts through google searches using Cream of wheat as a filler

You can find a lot of things via a google search that are unsafe. Just because it is on the internet does not mean it is true, factual or safe.

I have measured the pressures of enough loads in a "straight walled" 45-70 case using different powders with a COW filler to know how quickly and sometimes dangerously if raises the psi. It was so indicative of excessive psi in the 45-70 there is no way I would even test it in a bottle necked cartridge.

[rintinglen]

Over forty years ago, The American Rifleman ran a public safety article disavowing the previously recommended practice of using Cream of Wheat Fillers. There had been numerous reports of ringed chambers and damaged rifles, to the point that they finally declared that practice to be unsafe. The use of dacron and kapok fillers was also thrown into the discard at that time.

I do not use fillers anymore. I can't easily replace my firearms anymore, and the cost of repairs has grown exponentially over the years.

[richhodg66]

The key to using a Dacron filler is to use it correctly. Just like most everything we do in reloading there are correct ways to use/do things. There are also incorrect ways. Do them the incorrect way is what gets you into trouble.

I do not recommend a COW filler, even in straight walled cases.

I never recommend a wad which leaves a space between the wad and the base of the bullet.

There is a distinct difference between a wad and a filler for the use discussed here.

The OP stated this;

"One thing I did that I had never done before with this caliber and petload was using COW filler. Now, would this cause the pressure to go high enough to have something like this happen, could be."

The obvious answer to his question is; YES.

Classic case of using the wrong type of filler and not understanding the correct use of a filler thus using it incorrectly. Both serious errors, fortunately the OP was not injured.

There's a sticky about fillers in which, Larry gave an excellent write up on when it's appropriate and how to do it correctly. I've followed this advice and it has helped a good bit in some instances and I never had a problem. I always scratched my head about using cream of wheat, just never seemed like a good idea so I never did it. The Dacron works in some applications.

Sticky here;

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...use-of-fillers