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Thread: Why powder coat?

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    Why powder coat?

    We get so many posts in the “Coatings & Alternatives” and their real question is powder coating worthwhile and why should I give it a try. With the help of others I have compiled a list of my reasons to powder coat and I am sure there are more:

    WHY POWDER COAT?

    · Lubed bullets are simply that, grease applied to the bullet alloy to reduce leading; Powder Coating (PC) is more than just another lube or coating providing lubrication. A properly applied and cured PC actually creates a Polymer Jacket that does not leave any leading or copper fouling in your barrel, so cleaning time is significantly reduced and money spent on exotic cleaners is not needed. The fact is lubed lead bullets leave lead residue and copper jacketed/plated bullets leave copper residue in barrels. Added 3/19: Now that Federal has introduced their own commercial line of coated bullets and Federal states the coating is in fact a jacket, I think it can now be accepted that the term Polymer Jacket is correct.

    · Since PC does not leave a lead residue it can be shot in polygonal barrels such as Glocks. Firing lubed lead bullets is a safety issue posted by Glock as the polygonal rifling swages the bullet causing sever leading. However, shooting any reloaded ammunition voids Glocks warranty. PC save the expense of purchasing a non-polygonal barrel just to shoot lubed lead bullets.

    • PC is a superior bullet lubricant at preventing lead deposits. In a recent test of identical loads where several different lubricants were compared, PC bullets chronographed approximately 4% higher velocity over all conventionally lubed bullets with no lead deposits.
    Added 3/19: Federal has published test results not only indicating PC is a superior lubricant giving an increase in velocity but due to less friction the gun barrels run cooler.

    • Powder Coating add thickness the cast bullet diameter, which can be of benefit for bullet molds that cast undersize or for oversize barrels.


    · Powder coating creates a very tough and 2H+ hard chemically bonded Polymer Jacket that can totally encase the lead making it safer to handle and to shoot than lubed lead bullets.

    · The Polymer Jacket (PJ) created by the powder coating process virtually eliminates feeding problems in semi-autos, both rifle & pistol. A PC bullet will reliably feed when bare lead, plated, coated and metal jacketed bullets will not because the entire PC surface acts as a lubricant due to the slickness.

    · Powder coating is hard, but more than hard it is tough. A bullet alloy can be hard, but lacks toughness and with the increase of alloy hardness other problems increase, like brittleness and inaccuracy.

    · Typical PC creates a polymer jacket similar in thickness and hardness of pure copper plating, but PC does not have the velocity restrictions (1250 fps) of a standard copper plated bullet. Due to the chemical bond and toughness of the Polymer Jacket the coating does not flow back under pressure like copper plating. This can be easily verified by recovered bullets.

    · The polymer jacket created by PC resists the stress force created by chamber pressure allowing PC bullets to use a much softer alloy that lubed bullets. PC pure lead bullets can be fired at handgun velocities without leading. I as well as others on the Cast Boolits site have coated and fired PC pure lead with no leading at velocities far greater than an identical lubed bullet would allow.

    · PC saves money, by eliminating the need for copper plated/jacketed bullets for handgun calibers and many rifle calibers.

    · PC bullets do not leave a grease residue in reloading dies, eliminating the time and materials needed for cleaning. Also eliminating the constantly changing Cartridge Overall Length (COAL) as lube residue builds up in the bullet seating die.

    · PC does not pick up and trap contaminates (dirt/sand, etc.) that can then be loaded into a cartridge.

    · PC bullets function in a bullet feeder, lube bullets do not, allowing those with a progressive press and bullet feeder to increase the speed of production.

    · When tumble coated and cooked base down PC flows into the imperfection on the cast bullet’s base creating a much more uniform flat base for accuracy similar to a gas check. The imperfections due to the cut sprue on the base of the bullet remain on standard lubed bullets. The coating on the base of the bullet also insulates the bullet from the heat of ignition, resisting gas erosion, similar to a gas check and the tough coat appears to have a much higher shearing resistance than the lead substrate.

    · Powder coating may eliminate the need for gas checks, but more high velocity testing must be performed. Lubed lead bullets and other coatings offer no protection against gas erosion, necessitating the need for gas checks at higher pressures.
    Added 3/19: When gas checks are used, PC can bond the check in place to assure it remains intact. Charles Darnall the maker & designer of the Freechex gas check making tools states from his testing, "Powder Coating eliminates the need for a gas check to seal & protect the bullet alloy from the heat of ignition." However I believe a gas check should be used if the bullet is a GC design to improve accuracy.

    · PC does not burn with the heat of ignition, altering the chamber pressure/velocity as bullet lube can do when ignited. With PC there is no infamous lube burning smoke cloud that obliterates the view of the target, annoys others and has the indoor range office asking you to leave the range or shoot something other than lubed bullets.

    · PC bullets are accurate. My Ransom Rest testing of PC handgun bullets indicates accuracy equal to jacketed bullets. Others are finding excellent accuracy in rifle calibers.

    · PC bullets will store indefinitely with no special care. Storage temperature is not an issue as it is with lubed bullets.

    · Powder coating in different colors allows quick identification not only of a particular bullet design; it can be used to define a particular load. A 44 magnum cartridge loaded at maximum for a rifle looks just like a 44 magnum cartridge loaded for a pistol. If one load has a red bullet and one a blue bullet it makes identification easy and could save damage to a gun and possible injury.

    · PC can be achieved with a minimal investment in time, materials or equipment.

    · PC eliminates the boredom of the casting process and opens up new venues of creativity and enjoyment of a hobby. PC is a good topic of conversation for range talk, generating more associates and friends. Powder coated bullets are prettier than lead bullets; Women love PC bullets and detest ugly, sticky lead bullets.

    .Added 3/19: The statements above were made with the assumption that the applied PC would be of suitable thickness and cured following the specific curing instructions of the Powder Manufacturer of the particular powder used. It is also understood all polymers may not be suitable for coating bullets and the end results may vary.
    Last edited by Dragonheart; 03-28-2019 at 08:29 AM. Reason: additions

  2. #2
    Boolit Master

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    Great post Dragon heart. I might add, that PC can slightly add to the dimension/diameter of a boolit when needed.
    Maker of Silver Boolits for Werewolf hunting

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hickok View Post
    Great post Dragon heart. I might add, that PC can slightly add to the dimension/diameter of a boolit when needed.
    Good point, I will add to the list as others come up with more.

  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master fredj338's Avatar
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    I can't disagree with most of that. The better lubricant part though, not buying it. Make a bullet slicker, it builds less pressure, less vel, not more for a given powder charge. My own vel testing with identical bullets, lubed, PC or HT, within the std dev for a given load. Temp or altitude will have a greater affect on vel.
    EVERY GOOD SHOOTER NEEDS TO BE A HANDLOADER.
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  5. #5
    Boolit Master flyingmonkey35's Avatar
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    PC is now a recognized by the ammunition manufacturers.

    (Not that lubed aren't)

  6. #6
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    The only down-side I have observed during my powder coating and shooting is that the process is much slower than running them through a lube/sizer (have to pick each bullet out of the air soft BB's one at a time). I shoot way to many home-cast handgun bullets to keep up if I powder coated all the bullets I shoot. But, there are some applications that I have gone to powder coating as the lube method over 50/50 NRA Alox...but not all. And I am definitely not going to remove the Alox from all those bullets I have in storage and powder coat, and then re-size them again...I will shoot them up as they are, but I am going to be doing way less lube/sizing with NRA Alox from now on.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

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    Some of the claims are only true within a narrow frame of reference. PC does work but is not a magical fix for bad bullet casting and reloading methods. It is simply an alternate way to achieve a limited set of objectives.
    Liberalism is the triumph of emotion over intellect, but masquerading as the reverse.

    I don't know how we ever shot maximum loads before P/C come along and saved us all. R5R

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    "Dueling should have never been made illegal in this country. It settled lots of issues between folks."- Char-Gar

  8. #8
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Quote Originally Posted by dahermit View Post
    The only down-side I have observed during my powder coating and shooting is that the process is much slower than running them through a lube/sizer (have to pick each bullet out of the air soft BB's one at a time). I shoot way to many home-cast handgun bullets to keep up if I powder coated all the bullets I shoot. But, there are some applications that I have gone to powder coating as the lube method over 50/50 NRA Alox...but not all. And I am definitely not going to remove the Alox from all those bullets I have in storage and powder coat, and then re-size them again...I will shoot them up as they are, but I am going to be doing way less lube/sizing with NRA Alox from now on.
    I recently started powder coating and have asked the question but have seen no reply. Why use the air soft pellets at all? I bought some but have not used them when powder coating and see no reason they are needed. They coat just fine without them. and it would speed up the process.
    Aim small, miss small!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooman76 View Post
    I recently started powder coating and have asked the question but have seen no reply. Why use the air soft pellets at all? I bought some but have not used them when powder coating and see no reason they are needed. They coat just fine without them. and it would speed up the process.
    It is generally held on these forums that the Air Soft BB's do two things...increase the static charge and cushion the bullets from banging into each other and knocking the powder off. If you have achieved successful coverage without them, by all means do not bother with them then. I cannot see how eliminating them would speed up the process to any extent in that inasmuch as the bullets still need be picked-up one at a time and placed on a rack to bake...that is what adds to the time. I dump my Powder Coated bullets and BB's onto a paper plate and pick them up from there.

  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master fredj338's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooman76 View Post
    I recently started powder coating and have asked the question but have seen no reply. Why use the air soft pellets at all? I bought some but have not used them when powder coating and see no reason they are needed. They coat just fine without them. and it would speed up the process.
    Not sure how it would speed things up, you are still plucking or dumping out on wire to claim the coated bullets. My understanding is the ASBB help with the static charge that gets the powder to stick well to the bullets. I find I use very little powder to do 100s of bullets using the ASBB method.
    EVERY GOOD SHOOTER NEEDS TO BE A HANDLOADER.
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  11. #11
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    I don't use the BB's...and it works fine.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    What ever works for you, because we all live in different parts of the country.

    Here on the Gulf Coast humidity is a real problem when tumble coating. I use the BB's because it helps build the static charge, but I can see that those that live in Arizona probably get complete coverage with little effort in 30 seconds.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master Tenbender's Avatar
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    I like the fact that I can use a softer alloy with PC. In a hunting bullet softer is usually better. For plinking a lube bullet does all I need and is much quicker. However most of the time I PC a lot of boolits after I get set up. I keep finding little tricks along the way to cut the time factor and waste.
    Another thing I like about PC. You can pick up a hundred or two fps with the same powder charge depending on the round.
    It is a hobby and experimenting will answer lots of questions. Reading the forum on the experiments of others also answers a lot.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    Pistols SO EASY to clean after shooting PC boolits. Well worth the effort.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master flyingmonkey35's Avatar
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    Question. When you say compare a PC bullets to a jacketed bullet.

    So you would like a shot for shot comparison for the same type of bullet.

    For example

    9mm 124 grain round nose bullet.

    Cast powder coated / vs fmj round nose.

    Bench rest.

    What type of gun? How many yards is good?

    I want to know for a base line for my own studies.

    As I have shot the above and saw no difference in performance or accuracy in any of my guns.


    I don't own a crony so I can't test ballistics.

    And some of you dead shots out there can shoot a fly with a bent barrel at 50 yards. So your thoughts on accuracy can be skewed

    BTW federal is marketing PC line as target ammo. Not self defense loads.

    So we should do the same. Target loads cast PC vs lube vs fmj.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by flyingmonkey35 View Post
    Question. When you say compare a PC bullets to a jacketed bullet.

    So you would like a shot for shot comparison for the same type of bullet.

    For example

    9mm 124 grain round nose bullet.

    Cast powder coated / vs fmj round nose.

    Bench rest.

    What type of gun? How many yards is good?

    I want to know for a base line for my own studies.

    As I have shot the above and saw no difference in performance or accuracy in any of my guns.


    I don't own a crony so I can't test ballistics.

    And some of you dead shots out there can shoot a fly with a bent barrel at 50 yards. So your thoughts on accuracy can be skewed

    BTW federal is marketing PC line as target ammo. Not self defense loads.

    So we should do the same. Target loads cast PC vs lube vs fmj.
    Unfortunately I don't have a lot of test targets to post as I record my tests and keep the results in a spreadsheet. I am also hesitant to post load data on an open forum. Basically, I do all my tests from a well secured Ransom Rest confirming the handgun returns to the same position with a dial caliper. I believe that taking the human element out as much as possible is the only way to get a true compairson for a load. I shoot 5 round chronographed groups and repeat only if a group shows promise. I have run tests using guns from a number of manufactures Glock, Sig, Walther, Kimber, Colt, S&W. Typically all my tests are done at 25 years because I see no point in repeatedly walking 50 yards to post targets just to determine a good load for a handgun. I pay close attention to the assembly of loading the cartridge and each of the 5 cartridges tested are as close as I can make them without getting insane.

    As far as my personal criteria for what I call a "Good" handgun load is one that will consistently group under two inches at 25 yards. I consider loads that will consistently group under one and a half inches "Excellent" and I believe most Bullseye Competition Shooter would agree.

    I have tested plated, jacketed, lubed, moly coated and limited bullet weights of powder coated bullets. My test guns of choice for accuracy are 1911's in 45ACP and 9mm. I have also done some jacketed bullet tests of the .380. I have no preconceived bias as to the bullet, case, primer or powder as I do these test for my own information and my own use as my interest is finding the load that is optimal for a particular gun.

    So, when I say powder coated bullets are accurate, that means I have developed loads that fall into my "Excellent " category, not to say there are not other bullets that also fall into that category.

    As far as 9mm loads with a 125 grain bullet I have tested a number of jacketed, powder coated and lubed bullets and on the whole have had poor success with that weight bullet. I have found no loads that consistently fall into "excellent" under one and a half inches and just a few loads in the "good" under 2". Surprising to me those few good 125 gr. bullet loads were using PC bullets. I have gotten the best 9mm accuracy using bullets lighter than 125 grains, but to date I have not tested any 9mm light powder coated bullets. if you need some load data for the 125gr. PM me and I will give you load that should save you a lot of time, but I can also tell you the choice of handgun will make a difference, so it's just a good starting point.

  17. #17
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Although I think this is a rather silly thread I would like to comment - as a former Bullseye shooter.

    First. If you want to determine accuracy with a pistol, NOTHING is better than a Ransom rest.

    Second. Accuracy testing is done at 50 yards - period. That is the distance for the slow fire target and it is the most difficult stage to shoot a good score on. If you have an accurate 50 yard load, it will run X's in timed and rapid at closer range. We shot 50 shot groups at 50 yards with a Ransom rest to determine accuracy. 5 shot groups are next to useless. Anyone who had done much testing, or has an elementary knowledge of probability, will know that.

  18. #18
    Boolit Master flyingmonkey35's Avatar
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    Wow I was looking up a ransom rest. Pricey. Pretty cool though
    I learned something new.

    I'll have to see if any local ranges have one to use for testing . and would let me use with cast / reloads.


    Rereading dragon hearts post.

    He said he used a ransom rest and found them to be on par with other bullets.

    He also clearly states that it is more like a cooper plating. But with out the load restrictions.

    The whole point of the copper plating and fmj was to encapsulate the lead core to prevent it from spinning apart at supersonic speeds.

    And to prevent leading

    This allowed us to push rifle rounds farther and faster.




    I also watched a great video by hickock 45 about what accuracy is.

    He states it has two meanings.

    Can you shoot the target your aiming at. Steel plates or paper.

    Are you happy with the loads you shoot? To 95% of of us shooting that is what makes us happy.


    Then there's Bullseye. Can you shoot one hole shot groups?

    How far can you push your gun and skills.

    Wich shooter are you?

    Now that I have deviated from the topic.

    Enjoy casting and shooting.
    Last edited by flyingmonkey35; 02-22-2016 at 10:45 PM.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    I really don't understand why any one is upset about with Dragonheart's statement, "My Ransom rest testing of PC bullets indicates accuracy equal to jacketed bullets."

    I have an older Smith & Wesson Model 29-3 .44 Magnum with .433" throats that wont shoot .429-430" jacketed bullets worth spit.

    My mold drops 44 boolits at .431", so I PC, gain some diameter, size to .433", and it is a tack driver. The PC boolit not only shoots as good, it shoots better than any jacketed bullet I can find for this revolver. Same goes for any good cast boolits and regular loob properly fitted to a revolver.

    Same with the older .45 Colt SAA's with .456-.457" throats. See how well a .451" jacketed shoots compared to a good cast boolit with loob or a PC boolit properly.

    I have a Winchester 1894AE 38/55 26" barrel, with a .379" bore. Jacketed Winchester 38/55 ammo uses .377" jacketed bullets, they only shoot fair in this rifle. I have an Accurate Mold from Tom, PC the boolit, size to .381" That puts 5 shots into 2" or less @ 100 yards with iron sights. The Winchester factory jacketed ammo made for this rifle will do 4" for 5 shots @ 100 yards.

    And yes jacketed bullets will out shoot cast. But I have also out shot jacketed with cast/ loobed and cast PCed. I know others here have too.

    Dragonheart made no false statements. His testing tells him that PC boolits can equal accuracy of jacketed bullets. I believe that statement and have found it true in my testing. Does it happen all the time, no.

    Let's change the statement around to this, "Jacketed bullets can equal the accuracy of PCed boolits." Is this true, yes. Does it happen all the time, no.

    "Jacketed bullets can equal the accuracy of cast bullets with grease lube." Is this true, yes. Does it happen all the time, no.

    PCed boolits can equal the accuracy of jacketed bullets, so I have no problem with Dragonhearts statement.
    Maker of Silver Boolits for Werewolf hunting

  20. #20
    Boolit Master gpidaho's Avatar
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    ^^^^^^^^I agree with Hickok Gp

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check