Moving to Alaska

[wlc]

Paul and starmac have given good advice. I will add to it by saying this. You need to come up for a visit. Twice or three times for two or three weeks. Once in the late summer/early fall and once in the dead of winter. Most everybody loves it up here during early and mid summer, but when the rains start in late summer/early fall or its 20 or 30 below in the winter it can be a challenge. When we first moved up I had a friend that had been up here for nearly 20 years that lives in Delta Junction tell me that Alaska is a good place for men and dogs, women, not so much He also told me that AK is a place of no middle ground. You either love it and never want to leave it or you hate it and can't get out fast enough.


Moving up here isn't cheap if you bring more than you can haul in an enclosed trailer either. Better factor that in as well. Land prices aren't cheap and not much of anything else is cheap. Prices are better than they once were, but, depending on where you live now expect the average cost of stuff to be about 20% or so higher than the lower 48 although that is starting to creep down a bit on some stuff as more and more major retailers move in and more and more people move up here. The farther you live from Anchorage the higher the prices tend to get. If you live off the road system stuff goes through the roof due to transport costs.

I have a feeling that unless oil prices go back up significantly that our economy will really start hurting. Our politicians have been on a spending spree for years and need to severely reign in the spending cause oil is the source of the vast majority of our state funds. There will probably be an exodus of folks to go along with it as well. that could be good as far as a buyers market on real estate.

Whatever you do Good luck.

[jonp]

Any jobs for Truck Drivers up there? I'd love to move north.

[starmac]

Actually quite a bit of trucking goes on up here. That is what I do.

[tygar]

Everything the "Alaskans" said is right on (plus the other guys), but I think, unless I missed it, I'm the only one who has raised livestock when I lived up there almost 20 yrs total at different times.

I lived on a farm, small or large, even during my 28 in the military, except when stationed in DC & still had my horse, so I'm a real farm boy.

Forget the pigs! And I was in the pig business down south as well as cattle, sheep & horses. I had a fairly decent barn that was fairly well insulated & even though I know what I'm doing, my pigs didn't grow anywhere near as well as they should & feed amounts were a good double what I used down south & it cost a lot more than in the lower 48.

All animals costs are magnified due to cost of feed. To grain cattle & horses it takes a lot more & figure the animals weight in good hay per month, minimum.

I was good buddies with my hay guy & got a good deal on 1200# m/l round bales & would get truck loads & at a bale a month, per head, it cost! Now I lived in the MatSu so my costs were less than about anywhere else in AK for feed. Don't know what hay cost in FB.

It didn't take more than 2 or 3 yrs to get down to a couple horses & 1 or 2 head of cattle.

Oh, another thing, breaking ice or hauling water, really gets old fast. Even in the barn it sometimes froze up. Winching round bales into the feeder in feet of snow was no picnic either....etc. etc. you didn't get the chicken pen shoveled until break up.

On remote living, I had a friend that owns Willow Creek Lodge & owned a remote lodge on the Talachalitna River. My wife & I even stayed out there as caretakers for part of one winter. It's not to bad when someone else is paying for "everything", but just keeping it running, generator, wood, making sure the docks didn't get broke by the ice & making sure the the cabins were OK, clearing snow etc. Not for the faint of heart.

Now for the good part - it cost a fortune! I know some of the costs to keep that place going. In the summer running up river hauling diesel, gas, food, stuff to repair everything. Each boat trip was ove $100 in gas. In the winter after freeze up, snow machines with sleds or sno cats & in emergencies flying at big bucks.

Before you even think of living off the road system you better spend a number of years making sure you can do it.

Now if you live on the big rivers in the villages there is a barge that comes up once a year & you had better get your order for gas, diesel, food, sno gos etc right or you'll be paying "a lot" for it to be flown up. Friends in Igiugig at the mouth of Lake Iliamna, paid about 7 or 8$ for a gallon of milk in the village store & that was 25yrs ago with everything else correspondently high.

All that said, I loved Alaska! No better place in the world. Wish I could go back but got sick & needed to leave & can't take that cold, long winter, anymore.

Son, just called yesterday from Chena Hot Springs, & it was 20 below...And that ain't nuttin in Fairbanks. It'll go a lot lower.

So, you got a lot to consider.

Good luck.

[Bazoo]

I'd like to be connected to the road system so that I can get to a major city in order to buy things. I dont mind if im 8 hours from that city. But i'd like the community im associated with not be a major thoroughfare, and I dont want to live in the town, or right on the road.

So, If the cost of cows up there is astronomical? Got any idea how much a cow goes for? Round here you can get a calf for 500 or so, and a bread cow for around 1200.

I am thinking to bring a vehicle, with a trailer.

Course it'll be some years hopefully before mom passes away, and im going to have to save all I can for this venture. It crossed my mind, just selling the farm, which would be about 100k, to have a good start. I like the idea of renting it out though. But I havent made any sure plans about any of it. Im just gathering information about it all , and I appreciate all the info.

Does anyone know if there is any forums that is dedicated to moving up there, or living up there?

[paul h]

There actually is a forum dedicating to relocating to Alaska

http://forums.outdoorsdirectory.com/...ing-to-Alaska?

Well worth reading through the old posts as there is a lot of good info there. There is also a forum on the same UBB about cabins that has excellent information there.

One thing I've said many times before and it bears repeating, cheap land is always the most expensive land. The purchase price is but a very small portion of accessing and developing land, and only a small percentage of land is great land. So learn what attributes make for great land in the location you choose, and then have money in hand for the right piece of land when it comes on the market. Good land always sells, anything that has been on the market for some time has issues, and no matter how positive your attitude or how inexpensive the land, the issues will remain and cost you dearly.

If you're looking at roughly 5 years or more out, then I think the economy will be turning around and hopefully a goodly portion of the free loaders will have headed South. I'm not holding my breath as the government seems love giving money to freeloaders.

[RetAFSF]

First and foremost visit Alaska during the winter Dec Jan months then, the summer June July. In each visit Valdese (if you don't like the weather, just wait 5 minutes), Anchorage, and Fairbanks. If you don't like any of the two seasons do not live there. In the winter in 400 miles , temp can range a 100deg or more. Stationed at Mile 26 (Eielson AFB)temp was -70 deg without wind where Anchorage would be 30 above zero. That's just the beginning.

[duckey]

Seward is nice, lived there in mid 90's. Been all over SE AK and out to Kodiak. Great place.

[MaryB]

You do INSANE trucking! Some of the stories are hair raising!

Actually quite a bit of trucking goes on up here. That is what I do.

[MaryB]

I always get a chuckle about the TV shows going on and on about the extreme cold in AK... MN isn't much better! We are having a warm winter so far but if the weather pattern shifts nasty is coming! -20 for a week is nothing! One year it didn't get above -10 for 3 weeks...

Everything the "Alaskans" said is right on (plus the other guys), but I think, unless I missed it, I'm the only one who has raised livestock when I lived up there almost 20 yrs total at different times.

I lived on a farm, small or large, even during my 28 in the military, except when stationed in DC & still had my horse, so I'm a real farm boy.

Forget the pigs! And I was in the pig business down south as well as cattle, sheep & horses. I had a fairly decent barn that was fairly well insulated & even though I know what I'm doing, my pigs didn't grow anywhere near as well as they should & feed amounts were a good double what I used down south & it cost a lot more than in the lower 48.

All animals costs are magnified due to cost of feed. To grain cattle & horses it takes a lot more & figure the animals weight in good hay per month, minimum.

I was good buddies with my hay guy & got a good deal on 1200# m/l round bales & would get truck loads & at a bale a month, per head, it cost! Now I lived in the MatSu so my costs were less than about anywhere else in AK for feed. Don't know what hay cost in FB.

It didn't take more than 2 or 3 yrs to get down to a couple horses & 1 or 2 head of cattle.

Oh, another thing, breaking ice or hauling water, really gets old fast. Even in the barn it sometimes froze up. Winching round bales into the feeder in feet of snow was no picnic either....etc. etc. you didn't get the chicken pen shoveled until break up.

On remote living, I had a friend that owns Willow Creek Lodge & owned a remote lodge on the Talachalitna River. My wife & I even stayed out there as caretakers for part of one winter. It's not to bad when someone else is paying for "everything", but just keeping it running, generator, wood, making sure the docks didn't get broke by the ice & making sure the the cabins were OK, clearing snow etc. Not for the faint of heart.

Now for the good part - it cost a fortune! I know some of the costs to keep that place going. In the summer running up river hauling diesel, gas, food, stuff to repair everything. Each boat trip was ove $100 in gas. In the winter after freeze up, snow machines with sleds or sno cats & in emergencies flying at big bucks.

Before you even think of living off the road system you better spend a number of years making sure you can do it.

Now if you live on the big rivers in the villages there is a barge that comes up once a year & you had better get your order for gas, diesel, food, sno gos etc right or you'll be paying "a lot" for it to be flown up. Friends in Igiugig at the mouth of Lake Iliamna, paid about 7 or 8$ for a gallon of milk in the village store & that was 25yrs ago with everything else correspondently high.

All that said, I loved Alaska! No better place in the world. Wish I could go back but got sick & needed to leave & can't take that cold, long winter, anymore.

Son, just called yesterday from Chena Hot Springs, & it was 20 below...And that ain't nuttin in Fairbanks. It'll go a lot lower.

So, you got a lot to consider.

Good luck.

[MaryB]

Keeping the farm gives you a fall back if the AK weather and DARKNESS gets to you! Sun set here at 4:30 today, it is worse up there!

I'd like to be connected to the road system so that I can get to a major city in order to buy things. I dont mind if im 8 hours from that city. But i'd like the community im associated with not be a major thoroughfare, and I dont want to live in the town, or right on the road.

So, If the cost of cows up there is astronomical? Got any idea how much a cow goes for? Round here you can get a calf for 500 or so, and a bread cow for around 1200.

I am thinking to bring a vehicle, with a trailer.

Course it'll be some years hopefully before mom passes away, and im going to have to save all I can for this venture. It crossed my mind, just selling the farm, which would be about 100k, to have a good start. I like the idea of renting it out though. But I havent made any sure plans about any of it. Im just gathering information about it all , and I appreciate all the info.

Does anyone know if there is any forums that is dedicated to moving up there, or living up there?

[Ivantherussian03]

I did what your thinking of about 20 years back. I read everything I could about people living in AK. The first is decide the life style u want, which it sounds as if you have. There are two Alaskas in my mind, the Road and the rest. 90 percent of Ak has no road access. I live in a roadless area.

On the Road I suppose u have the coast and Interior. You have to decide between the two, or figure out how you compromise. The Interior can have terrible cold, minus 70's are possible. Anything south of Palmer seems like the Banana Belt after living in the Arctic. You mentioned raising cattle.....so you would need to know where that is possible. I have no idea but I believe there are farms as far north as Fairbanks. A lot research has gone into agriculture in the state specific to the far north.

once you decide on a location and life style, you would decide how to earn money or make a plan to earn money.

once you decide those key things the rest will follow. What machines you will need will become clear. As will everything else.

the things I think are must

22LR
30.06 or similar cartridge
shotgun
good set of tools
4 wheeler
snowgo


Alot of the other things are going to depend on you and your choices.

boats are like tools, they have specific uses. I have 16 ft Lund, with an old 50horse. I traveled over 1000 miles in that boat. They are cheap, light weight, and thus good on gas, plus they are versatile . My buddy has flat bottom fiberglass boat, good for heavy loads in fair conditions, but very dangerous in rough water. You will need a boat probably.

As as for jobs things are not good here. A third of the jobs imho are government jobs, Federal or State, or connected to govt funds: burocratic govt, schools and educational support, Fish and Game. Others have mentioned the State is in crisis financially. Another third of the jobs are resource extraction related I.e. Oil production, Red Dog mine, and others. Oil production has been dropping since 1989, and prices are down the State is feeling real pain. So right off the bat 2/3 of the state economy are contracting the number of jobs. The 1/3 of jobs are connected to tourism and appears to be fine, as L 48 economy seems fine.

Unless you have other plans to earn money. I worked several summers in the canneries. I think it wise to live and work in Ak on someone's else's dime. You can earn money trapping, or making value added goods with the furs, or peddling the tanned fur your self.
This requires a lot of learned skills, so may take time to plan and implement.


An alternative might be living in the Rocky Mountain states. The experiences is nearly the same, it is like Ak but with out the water aspect. The weather is nearly the same, as is the life style.

Living expenses on the Road are similar to the West coast. Once off the Road prices climb dramatically. Gas here was over $8 for 7 years, dropping last fall to 5.50 or so. The local food store prices 4 times Anchorage prices.

I think Alaska teaches people about what is important. Alaska will simplify everything. You will learn new things here. I would find a Honda 400 Fw Foreman made till 1999; it was the last the simple Honda. You might as well buy an older machine and start learning about them., and the same goes for snow goes. I know here in a native village they make fun of people that can't fix their own stuff. I think on the Road people mind their business more. Fixing your own stuff will reduce your needs for cash, plus I think parts are cheaper too. Just remember owning machines increases increases your dependence on the world.......they require cash. They breakdown. At some point you will know your machines very well and repair them before they break down; it might take years.

I just completed a pretty good over haul of my Honda 400fw. Long story short it took 10 months. I took the engine out 2 times, but I learned an awful lot. But boy did I take verbal abuse about it........I can't believe how people treated me about it. Now it is running and silence....no atta boys, no pats on the back, or definitely no good jobs were said to me It goes to show you I am and will always something of an outsider here. But at same time, I know am accepted on some level. Getting back to repair story, I ended up buying another 4 wheeler because I need one. Machines are force multiplier; they make our lives easier and help us do substantial work.

I would watch Life Below Zero episodes or Yukon Men; they are the best of the Alaska shows. You can learn from those programs, but they do gloss over some issues. Do you want to live without electricity? I can't think of his name ...maybe it is Ed and Chandlar. He lives alone with out electricity, or machines..so he requires less cash.







I will post more.....battery is dying.

[marvelshooter]

The TV show Alaska Railroad has "off gridders" living in the woods a mile or two off the tracks and taking the train to town when it suits them. Is there any truth to this sort of thing? It doesn't sound very off grid when all you have to is take your 4 wheeler or snow machine a mile down a trail and flag down a passing train.

[tygar]

I always get a chuckle about the TV shows going on and on about the extreme cold in AK... MN isn't much better! We are having a warm winter so far but if the weather pattern shifts nasty is coming! -20 for a week is nothing! One year it didn't get above -10 for 3 weeks...

Ya but in Alaska it's a lottt longer & up north in AK, MN can't compare. Son has a couple homes in Bimidgi(sp?) & spends a lot of time there & he says it can't compare. He lives in AK.

That said, plenty of places are as cold as lots of places in AK. e.g. WA is very similar to SE, MT, ND, MN etc are similar to Anchorage etc. but get out in Bethel or Ft Yukon in the winter with the wind blowing the snow sideways for months on end & see if you can find a comparable.

As for the people hoping on the RR, you need to experience bush living & you will vastly appreciate the ability to do that.

I know of people that actually have explored interior AK by just jumping on & off the train.

Until YOU actually experience it, you can't comprehend what AK bush life is like.

[snowwolfe]

Test yourself. Find a spot on your farm that is private and build a cabin without or limited power tools and live without running water or electricity for a year. And don't cheat

[Ivantherussian03]

life in "Bush" Alaska is going to Mars and living with the Martians is what I say to people. When I say Bush Ak , I am talking about off the Road and among Alaska Natives.

I got got the impression he wants or needs to be on the Road. He will need to be on road to raise cows.

Thetv shows gloss over some issues. The weather here can and will kill you, as will the river, and geography. Weather decides a lot of things
here for you. L 48 people rarely let the weather interfere with their plans. Winter is still long. The daylight is short in winter.

a lot of dreamers come north ....hoping to find themselves. I know of one person actually ate by wolves. Then that Into the Wild book. Testing your self sounds wise. A lot people just disappear.

Most people leave the Bush because of difficulties. I have been here twenty years, seen a lot of folks come and go. I don't know anyone like me in that regard .

[Bazoo]

I appreciate all the responses. I do watch all the shows on tv about the folks that live in alaska, Yukon men, and life below zero do seem the most realistic to me. I realize that a lot of the stuff is cut out and edited for tv.

I'd like to be able to get to town to buy things such as powder, primers, nails. But id be cool with having to take a boat up the river, or across the bay to a town. Id rather live off the road. But i dont want to live so far from town that I cant get supplies other than from the air. Also, the wife would like to be able to call her folks occasionally.

As far as living, i would prefer living without electricity. I do a lot of things the "hard" way, even with electricity. I prefer living simple. A simple life makes the heart glad. A generator to run a drill and grinder when needed would be enough. I may end up not needing it at all.

I definitely dont want to have a "job" up there. I dont want to move to alaska for the scenery, although that is a perk. I want a lifestyle change. I am transitioning from one life style to the other, living more simple all the time, here. Figuring out ways to do more with less all the time. I dont have a lot of desire for material things. Having lost all my possessions in a house fire in May really helped change the direction of my life, and gave me a new perspective of what I want out of life. It also helped reinforce the concept I already had of living simple. Everyone around here is all about money. Folks judge a person on how many hours they spent in a job. And unless you're miserable from your job, then you're not working enough. I like my "job" of making furniture. I dont make as much money as some, but I am happy. Im told im lazy because I choose not to make money with all my time. I am not lazy though. I see value in things though other than making money.

If it works out like I hope, i'll have some income coming in from my business venture. But i'll have the farm to rent out and will have income from that. I hope to live in a manner that I dont need a lot of monthly money also. Im planning to save enough money to buy a piece of land, and get set up with all the tools needed.

I want cows, but not as a source of income. I may not be able to, or want to have cows when the time comes.

I figure that I can build my own cabin and most of everything I need with my saw and an alaska mill. Then i'll be able to offer any locals boards and carpentry services. I know how to do carpentry with hand tools.

Fixing stuff myself is not a problem. I do that pretty much all myself now. Its my lifes goal to learn how to fix and repair any and all things. I am not your normal throw away and buy new type of person.

[Bazoo]

Test yourself. Find a spot on your farm that is private and build a cabin without or limited power tools and live without running water or electricity for a year. And don't cheat

Im planning to do something very similar. I've lived a week without electricity, which isnt much but it gave me a good taste of it and I liked it a lot.

[bearcove]

As a carpenter you will be fine. Live small to start. I went up with about $3000 an old pickup some tools camping gear and guns. Got there mid Sept. Camped for about 2 weeks and it started to snow. Got a 1 BR apt. Loved it! Always found plenty of work. If your not picky you can work everyday. Unless things have changed a LOT. Never regretted anything about Alaska except leaving. Trying to get back but that is going slow...

Met a guy in Florida, he said all he wanted was to go to Alaska. I had Ak tags on the truck, "How do I do it?" he asks. I pointed North and said "Head that way".

Its that simple.

[MaryB]

-41 is -41 no matter where you are! and that is common in Northern MN. Down where I am in the balmy end of the state -31 is the record low while up there it is -61. MN gets COLD. -20 is prett cmmon even in the southern end of the state along with gale force winds dropping the windchill to -100!

Ya but in Alaska it's a lottt longer & up north in AK, MN can't compare. Son has a couple homes in Bimidgi(sp?) & spends a lot of time there & he says it can't compare. He lives in AK.

That said, plenty of places are as cold as lots of places in AK. e.g. WA is very similar to SE, MT, ND, MN etc are similar to Anchorage etc. but get out in Bethel or Ft Yukon in the winter with the wind blowing the snow sideways for months on end & see if you can find a comparable.

As for the people hoping on the RR, you need to experience bush living & you will vastly appreciate the ability to do that.

I know of people that actually have explored interior AK by just jumping on & off the train.

Until YOU actually experience it, you can't comprehend what AK bush life is like.