Remington 11-87

[lefty o]

the Beretta A400 is available in 20ga, but they arent cheap. if you can get it to fit you, the A400 is a great shotgun. i wouldnt spend my money on a new remingturd shotgun. if you just have to buy a remingturd, buy used, as in 30+yrs old.

[Greg S]

I used to shoot alot of skeet and sporting. I've got a 1100 in 20 which is fine for bird hunting but gets alittle unreliable on the skeet field after 150 rounds. The 11-80maybes same story. If I was in the market for a 20, Ixd be looking on the sporting club billboard for a used Beretta 390-1 series. My 390 in 12 runs 800-1000 7/8oz 1200 fps loads between cleanings. If it gets alittle sluggish, a few drops of oil and I can fin7sh another 2-300 rounds before I need to stop and clean it. They can be ran hard n hot and put away wet so to speak with a modest exterior wipe down.

[Petrol & Powder]

lilysdad - the AL-48 is indeed a sweet little 20 ga. but its light weight may make it a slightly better field gun than a trap/skeet gun.

Greg S - Your experience with the Berretta 390 is exactly on par with what I seen over the years. When it comes to pure reliability in a gas operated semi-auto shotgun, nothing even comes close to the Berretta. I've seen a lot shooters that run a bore snake through the barrel, wipe the outside down and put the gun away with even more rounds through the gun than you're running.

[liliysdad]

Oh...I absolutely agree on the Franchi being ill-suited to the trap/skeet game...just an off hand remark.

[Mytmousemalibu]

If you want a cheap semi-auto scattergun that is actually decent, have a look at an H&R Excell. It's actually a rebranded Verona SX-405 if memory serves me right. Not a B-gun by any means but its a much better gun than any newer Remingturd and half the cost. Made by Sarsilmaz in Turkey and most of us know the Turks can make some pretty damn good guns. I have the Excell/Verona and so far have been very happy with it! I use it for informal clay dusting fun in the back 40 and I don't see why it wouldn't be a fine field gun as that was its intended use. A fair handful of guys use them for 3-gun. I got mine on clearance from Dicks for a little over $300 out the door, comes with a set of cheap chokes, they work but some Carlson's or something better wouldn't hurt. Takes Rem chokes. Oh and it will cycle the cheap wally world light loads perfectly, thats 95% of what I feed mine, not one issue. You can flip the gas piston around for light/heavy loads. Would not hesitate to buy another!

I also have an H&R Pardner pump, defense model, just an 870 clone made by IAC Hawk, chinese (I know, i know, blasphemy) it was like $200 and actually pretty decent gun too. I like Mossbergs but prefer the 870 platform a little more. Sad thing is, IAC makes a better 870 than Remingturd does these days. The only difference mechanically is the placement of the barrel ring is set inward further on the clone. You can use any barrel made to fit an actual 870, far as I know, but you need a spacer ring to slip over the mag tube to take up the gap so the barrel will tighten down. I keep the OE barrel on mine. It has also run 100% for me and I trust my life to it. Stays propped up by my nightstand and thats the 1st gun i'll grab if called on.

I am drooling over getting a Beretta A400 Xcel, must.......acheive......................ownership!

[liliysdad]

While I am not current manufacture Remington fan....I would take the poorest example over any Turkish shotgun. Even a Stoeger would be a better choice than that, in my experience and opinion.

[Mytmousemalibu]

While I am not current manufacture Remington fan....I would take the poorest example over any Turkish shotgun. Even a Stoeger would be a better choice than that, in my experience and opinion.

I had the opportunity to handle both a brand new Remingturd 870 and 1100 or 11-87 don't recall, but you couldn't pay me to take either of them, Garbage! I wouldn't throw them in the trash only because it wouldn't be fair to the trash can. I'm not on a vendetta to defend the Turks or saying so just because I own the gun, they can make a gun as equally crappy as anyone but when they try, they make some fine guns. Canik has proven worthy with their guns, look at the popularity of the TP9 series.

[liliysdad]

Perhaps the current Remingtons are rough...but they are easily repaired, and have 50+ years of aftermarket support and OEM parts available. I will take that over some Turkish junk that may or may not have a supporting importer this time next year, and whose materials are of infinitely questionable quality.

I have seen far, far too many CZ/Huglu/Verona/ATI/Hatsan/Charles Daly/whatever its called this week go down to ever recommend anything from that country, but especially their shotguns.

[Petrol & Powder]

Alllll-righty then............Let me see if I can be productive here:

I do not think Remington's quality has held up well and there does seem to have been a noticeable drop in their final fit & finish for several decades. However, I don't think they're aiming for the upper end of the market. Remington makes guns for the masses not the elite and they seem to be turning a decent profit. They also make fairly serviceable guns. I've seen plenty of current Remington rifles that "new and out of the box" would hold a 2" with factory ammo at 100 yards; some will do better. That's not great but it's not a bad start either. Yes, the finish sucks, yes the triggers suck and yes there are some lemons that are worse. But for a factory rifle with factory loads, I'll take that as starting line.
The problem - In My Opinion - is not that Remington makes junk but rather they cost far beyond what they are worth !
A brand new 11-87 is about $400 worth of shotgun to me. If I'm going to lay out $700 for a semi-auto shotgun I'll go find a used Berretta and still get twice the gun for that money.

I own several Remington's and they are all older guns. I like them for what they are but you won't see me paying asking price for a new one.

[Greg S]

A brand new 11-87 is about $400 worth of shotgun to me. If I'm going to lay out $700 for a semi-auto shotgun I'll go find a used Berretta and still get twice the gun for that money.

Remington and semiauomatic should not be structured together in the same sentence. Remington and Jamomatic yes. The 1100s had the problem and they re-designed it with the 11-87. The problem is they didn't fix the gas system reliability problem. You want a reliable semiauto, Beretta and Benelli. Don't have any experiance with the Browning design and haven't heard of any problems with them but all the same, I didn't include them for this reason.

To add, granted the OP is probably not shooting 5-30K per year through his shottie, it's nice to know that repair parts are available all over the country through several stocking retailers and in a pinch, you can contact Beretta USA direct and they will get the part to you quickley. Yes, Remingtons parts are easily available to but once you start going with imported guns, obtaining parts and availability come into play.

[Petrol & Powder]

I not trying to bash Remington. I've owned and shot a bunch of Remington's over the years and I will continue to own and shoot Remington's. It is the PRICE that is the issue for me.
$700 for a new 11-87 and $750 for a used one? Someone might pay that but they're smoking crack if they think I'll pay that.

[rking22]

Do not be afraid to buy a used QUALITY built shotgun. If it looks well cared for then it is worth buying. I have lots of Remington shotguns, that said the newest was made in 1969! For 700$ you should be able to find a nice used and unabused Beretta 391 in 20 ga. , Thats way too much money for a Remington 1187, new or used. The Beretta will run many many rounds dirty. the Rem gas system must be kept clean and,for the most part, dry. It is an inexpensive to build system that is also inexpensive to keep running , but why bother. My experience is that the Benelli guns don't like target loads (in 12ga, don't know about 20ga). the Beretta A400 will most definately run international 24gram loads in 12 ga, and probably will be fine with the 1200fps load as well. I am a pump gun shooter, and a Beretta300 was the only autoloader I ever bought for my own use(since gone down the road as it didn't do anything a M12 or 870 didn't). There are several Beretta autos in the house that my kids used in competion, and they have been outstanding(Kids and Berettas!).

Opps, Yes, Remington has quality issues , not just 2012. A good quality autoloader is almost impossiable to hurt, short of shooting 200,000 rounds, and that kind of wear would be obvious. If it looks like it was drug behind the truck , leave it where you found it. I have worked on quite a few "turkish" guns, even own a couple, they do not fall into the catagory of buying used (soft internals),Now they make a fairly good hunting gun but if you expect to shoot it much you are better to invest in a "B" gun from the start. Quality never disapoints, and 700$ gets you there if you can be patient.

[liliysdad]

I was a long time 1100 fan, and still love shooting them. That being said, when it came time for a new shotgun, I wanted something stone reliable, but did not want to spend a small fortune. I settled on a Beretta, and could not be happier.

I still have my 1100s and 1187s, and they still shoot great. When I need a gun that I know will, without a doubt, work...its ain't a Remington.

[Petrol & Powder]

When it comes to gas operated semi-auto shotguns, Beretta is the standard that all others are measure by.

[tonyjones]

If you want a 20 ga. automatic for field use I would get the Benelli Montefeltro Super 90. I bought one the first year they were imported into the U.S. ($800 IIRC). I have shot many tens of thousands of shells through mine and for several years it was the only shot gun I hunted with; because I like it so much. They are light weight and carry/handle like a dream. Maintenance is simplicity defined. TJ

[youngmman]

I am not a high volume shooter with a shotgun but I purchased an 11-87 Police about 15 years ago and never had a malfunction of any kind except when using very light target loads that failed to actuate the gas system. It's cleaned after shooting and periodically the gas ring is replaced. It's basically the same as the 1100 except a heavier duty extractor and fireing pin, before i'm told there is no difference I keep spare parts for the 11-87 and 1100 and yes indeed there is a difference at least in the fireing pin and extractor.

I have not looked or shot recently manufactured Remington's, except the Mo. 700 Bolt rifle, so I can't say anything about them.

My first gun of any kind was a Remington 870 wingmaster purchased in about 1960. I still use it but had to replace the fireing pin once but otherwise no problems at all if it's cleaned.

[Petrol & Powder]

There are actually several differences between the 1100 and the 11-87 the most notable is the 11-87 has a gas compensation system that vents off excessive pressure when using heavy loads. There are several other differences as well. They look similar and the 11-87 is based on the 1100, but they aren't the same gun. They are both decent guns but not in the same league as the "B" guns.
The Remington makes a good field gun where the volume of shooting is lower than a trap/skeet gun.
The 870 is obviously not a semi-auto but it is in a totally different class for other reasons as well. The 870 has one of the best track records of any repeating shotgun made (11+ million made and in production since 1950). The 870 is one of the most reliable and durable pump action shotguns you can find and the cost is more in line with its quality.


tonyjones_ I agree the early Benelli Montefeltro was an outstanding gun.

[Scharfschuetze]

+1 on the Franchi 48AL. Mine in 28 gauge is light, fast to mount, 100% reliable and a death dealer on pheasants, quail, doves and clay pigeons.

Of course I like my my Auto 5 too and my Remington 1100 in 410 has been just as good a shooter as the recoil operated shotguns, especially on doves and quail.

Here's a link to the Franchi web page with a good video on the 48AL:

http://www.franchiusa.com/48-al-semi-auto-shotgun

If you're looking for a tough, bullet proof and all weather shotgun, consider a Remington 870 slide action. They're less money and kill birds just as well.

[bdicki]

Will the B guns cycle 3/4 oz 12 ga loads at 1,200 fps? Friend's Benelli would not even come close.

My 12 ga 391 does, many 1000's of them.

[osteodoc08]

I have a Remy 11-87 that I bought new probably 3-4 years ago. It is a 20 gauge camo model that I use for small game and dusting clays with friends. I've put probably 800 rounds through it without issue. I clean it when I'm done and it chugs along. Its a basic field gun. Nothign more, nothing less.

I prefer my B guns especially the Beretta 391s and 686s. I have shot them, love them and hope to add them to my modest collection down the road. I have a 73 vintage 12 guage Browning Citori I have hunted many a miles with and it shows honest wear. It was my late fathers and I take it out on special occasions only now.