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Thread: H4227 or IMR 4227 as used in the 45 colt

  1. #21
    Boolit Master



    cwlongshot's Avatar
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    Odd because I cannot replicate accuracy I HAD with H4227. Using IMR MARKED 4227... NOT even close!!

    CW
    NRA Life member REMEMBER, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE its being paid for in BLOOD.

  2. #22
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    I did NOT know that 20 grains of IMR4227 and a 250 gr bullet was the 'Hank Williams Jr' load. I started using 20 grs of IMR4227 over a Lyman 454424, .454 WW bullet in 1968 in a Hawes .45 Colt. It was/is a very accurate combination.

  3. #23
    Is it (HWjr load) safe for Colts SAA and Ubertis? Thanks

  4. #24
    Boolit Master rondog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Martin Luber View Post
    Is it (HWjr load) safe for Colts SAA and Ubertis? Thanks
    Um, I'm no expert, but I'd be REAL careful about that! I use 21gr if IMR4227 under a 255 in my Rossi rifle, and it's a thumper. NWIH I'd use it in my Uberti Cattleman 6-gun.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master rondog's Avatar
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    I used 21gr IMR4227 under a Lee 255 LRN to take a doe at 250 yards. I wouldn't recommend that load in Colt SAA's, Uberti's, or any other light revolvers.

  6. #26
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    Agreed!! Unique (like powders) is all ill shoot outta mine!

    CW
    NRA Life member REMEMBER, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE its being paid for in BLOOD.

  7. #27
    Boolit Man dakota's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cowboy4evr View Post
    I had a Smith 25-10 , 45 Colt with the 6" barrel . The accuracy was marginal . After slugging the barrel and taking 2 measurements , first at the muzzle and the 2nd after pushing the lead slug ( should say pounding ) all the way through the barrel I found I had a tight spot where the barrel threaded onto the frame . It was over 4 thousandths choke (tight spot) . I had to fire lap the barrel and have a taller front sight installed . The cylinder throats were a bit undersize as well . Regards, Paul
    I've heard elsewhere that when S&W changed from pin and recessed this was an issue. I was hoping that they learned how to not do this.
    How did you measure the muzzle diameter? I'd like to do the same.

  8. #28
    Boolit Man dakota's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dakota View Post
    I've heard elsewhere that when S&W changed from pin and recessed this was an issue. I was hoping that they learned how to not do this.
    How did you measure the muzzle diameter? I'd like to do the same.
    I just pounded a lead ball through the barrel. The tightest spot DEFINITELY was where the barrel threaded to the frame. My 25 is a 25-15. So fire lapping here I come. Question, How many rounds did it take for your revolver?

  9. #29
    Boolit Man dakota's Avatar
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    Fire lapping seemed to help some. The bore sure seems polished too. I'm thinking my revolver may need the cylinder/chambers opened???

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by dakota View Post
    I'm thinking my revolver may need the cylinder/chambers opened???
    Easy to check your throats. Take a jacketed .45 ACP bullet (.451") and try to push it thru each throat. If it doesn't want to pass thru relatively easy, you have tight throats that should be opened up.

    Don
    NRA Certified Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor

  11. #31
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    This thread is an old one from 2015 that got resurrected. I don't care for relatively light loads of 4227 in the .45 Colt. When I tested 20 and 21 grains of older IMR-4227 with the 45-270-SAA in my 7.5" .45 Colt Redhawk, after firing just 12 rounds the bench I was firing over looked like I'd take a full pepper shaker and dumped it on the bench there was so much unburned powder. The loads were accurate enough, just seemed way too light for the powder. I've never tried H4227, and maybe that works much better. Since I was using the Redhawk, I also tested 24 grains with the same bullet, and of course it cleaned up but was basically a magnum load at that level.

    I much prefer either 8 grains of 231 or 10 grains of Power Pistol with a 250-270 grain SWC. Just as accurate, far lower standard deviation, and much, much cleaner.

  12. #32
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    Yep, 4227 is too slow a powder for light loads.

    Don
    NRA Certified Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor

  13. #33
    Boolit Man dakota's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USSR View Post
    Easy to check your throats. Take a jacketed .45 ACP bullet (.451") and try to push it thru each throat. If it doesn't want to pass thru relatively easy, you have tight throats that should be opened up.

    Don
    I did that thanks!

    It is a tight fit! I miked the Jacketed bullet - .451

    The lead balls I pounded through were ~~ .453.

    Shouldn't the cylinder be larger than the bore for best accuracy?
    Last edited by dakota; 11-23-2019 at 07:31 PM.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by dakota View Post
    I did that thanks!

    It is a tight fit! I miked the Jacketed bullet - .451

    The lead balls I pounded through were ~~ .453.

    Shouldn't the cylinder be larger than the bore for best accuracy?
    If the .451" jacketed bullets were a tight fit in your throats and you intend to use lead bullets, I would have your throats opened up a thou or two. There is a guy on this site that does it.

    Don
    NRA Certified Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor

  15. #35
    Boolit Man dakota's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USSR View Post
    If the .451" jacketed bullets were a tight fit in your throats and you intend to use lead bullets, I would have your throats opened up a thou or two. There is a guy on this site that does it.

    Don
    Cylinder sent to Doug

  16. #36
    Boolit Mold
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    I have used 4227 in the past but have decided it's just too slow of a burn rate powder for such a low pressure round and it used way too much powder . The slowest powder I use these days is Blue Dot in 45 Colt using current Alliant load data . Most of my loads use either Red Dot , Ramshot Zip , WSF or Accurate #2 . I recently tried some BE-86 and liked it , but want some more testing before it becomes one of the favorites . OMG , I almost forgot . I tried recently some Ramshot True Blue . That shot very well . I"m very happy with my results using it . I will be keeping that one in stock . I use the original Keith swc , HG 501 , 255gr . I have a 4 cav mold , complete with handles I bought from an estate . Regards, Paul

  17. #37
    Boolit Master 1bluehorse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by USSR View Post
    CW,

    The old H4227 is the new IMR4227. When Hodgdon got the rights to IMR powder, they found that the IMR name outsold the H name powder, and since they didn't need both, they renamed their H4227 powder to IMR4227 and dropped the original IMR4227 powder. So their old H4227 is now sold as IMR4227.

    Don
    There still seems to be a "bit" of confusion between these two. Without getting into "used to be" and "now is", the easy way to tell which you have is look at the label on the container. If it's from Australia it is H4227 period. If it's from Canada it is IMR 4227. If it says it's IMR 4227 AND IT'S MADE IN AUSTRALIA it's H4227. The "originals" were close to each other but not the same with H4227 being just a bit slower and said to be one of their extreme powders.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1bluehorse View Post
    There still seems to be a "bit" of confusion between these two. Without getting into "used to be" and "now is", the easy way to tell which you have is look at the label on the container. If it's from Australia it is H4227 period. If it's from Canada it is IMR 4227. If it says it's IMR 4227 AND IT'S MADE IN AUSTRALIA it's H4227. The "originals" were close to each other but not the same with H4227 being just a bit slower and said to be one of their extreme powders.
    Thank you!

    CW
    NRA Life member REMEMBER, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE its being paid for in BLOOD.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check