Reworking surplus 7.62x54r steel case ammo?

[Silvercreek Farmer]

The Mosin is fun, but I am not quite ready to gear up for cast. I was wondering if I could pull the j-word from a surplus round, replace the powder with an appropriate charge of Red Dot or 2400 and reseat the bullet without dies for a light plinking load. Any chance it could work? I do have a 30-06 seating die. A Lee Loader might do the trick, but there are other calibers in line ahead of the 7.62x54 at the moment.

[Outpost75]

Pulling the jacketed bullet and trying to reseat a cast bullet, without inside deburring and properly mouth expanding the case to accept the larger diameter cast bullet, won't work because you will wreck the soft, lead bullet in seating it.

At minimum you need to inside deburr the case mouth to put a good chamfer on it, then can try seating a cast bullet with your Lee Loader and see if it can be done without shaving lead. If you are just going to pull the jacketed bullet, dump the powder charge, replace the powder with a lighter load, then reseat the jacketed bullet, that works fine without further case prep.

The powder in 7.62x54R rounds is a stick type similar to 4064 or 4350. I would pull ten rounds and dump the charges on the scale pan, weighing them together and simply move the decimal point to determine the average charge. Then set up your powder measure to throw a charge which is reduced about 15-20% from the full charge of regular ball ammo. I would not reduce the service powder load any more than that, because you know nothing about the powders characteristics and how it responds to reduced charges and airspace in the case. Most stick powders can be safely reduced up to about 20% below a maximum load without you getting into trouble. Beyond that you need to know what the powder actually is and how it behaves. This is not a place to experiment blindly.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Thanks. Don't even have a Lee loader in 7.62x52r at the moment, any other recommended ways to reseat the original bullet?

[9w1911]

Thanks. Don't even have a Lee loader in 7.62x52r at the moment, any other recommended ways to re-seat the original bullet?

No, you will loose neck tension and my guess is the bullets will be at all kinds of different depths and run the risk of setting the bullet depth back to a dangerous level when chambering the round. Just my .02

[9w1911]

I am actually kinda shocked you asked.

[Kraschenbirn]

Have you tried pulling bullets from steel-case 7.62x54R? If you're going to be working with milsurp ammo, all I can say is 'GOOD LUCK'! I had some Bulgarian stuff with horribly erratic ignition...like there was sometimes enough delay that you could hear the firing pin drop before the primer went off...that I tried to pull. Bullets were sealed into the case with some kind of lacquer and, using an RCBS collet puller in my Rock Chucker, I couldn't get enough grip to pull the bullet without deforming the jacket. Tried breaking the seal by pushing bullet deeper with a correct 7.62x54R seating die and actually wrinkled the shoulder on a couple rounds without getting the bullet to move.


Bill

[CHeatermk3]

Recommend you just shoot the milsurp stuff as-is. How many rounds are you considering doing this with?

If you keep your eyes open you're sure to be able to buy the cases and dies you'll need here on the Swappin and sellin' forum then for light plinking type loads you're wanting just get a second-hand or Lee mould and a dipper--It's really not all that complicated... for light loads a plain-base mould will fill the bill. You will prolly find one for less than the cost of a box of bullets.

The x54r case is by far the wrong shape and tapered to boot for you to be able to use '06 dies for anything having to do with the x54r.

You must have some tools already; just save up the $$ and get the correct tooling.

[Tackleberry41]

Way I read his post, he was reusing the original pulled bullet vs a cast bullet. People used to do this in a time when all that was available was FMJ ammo, and brass to reload was nearly unobtainable. They would pull the bullet and put in a soft point. Not sure a 30-06 die would work, Russian stuff is 54mm long, 30-06 is 63mm. Would depend on how deep the seater would thread in. Fun part would be getting them out, the steel cased surplus stuff is generally sealed.

Way better off to invest in a bag of brass, or buy a couple boxes of brass cased ammo, but not S&B, can't put rifle primers in them. A set of dies from Lee is little less then $30, then a .311 Enfield expander.

I know how it is, when I bought my first Mosin, I swore it would be a zero dollar rifle, no accessories, no dies for reloading, just shoot it. But got into casting, and then a second mosin so made sense to buy some brass and reload.

[GhostHawk]

IMO essentially what you are talking about here is "Mexican Match"

First off you need tools, a press, a set of dies, a lee universal flaring tool and ideally cheap lead bullets. (ones you cast)

Back 2 years ago when I got back into shooting and reloading I did some of this. Except most of mine was a 3 way.

I would use a kinetic hammer to take apart 7.62x54r. Bullet went into stock, powder went into a container, it was marked which round it came from and charge weight.

I would replace powderr with a light charge of IMR 4895, reduced a fair amount as I was reloading them with a boolit from a Lee .312 185 gr gas check, beagled and cast and sized at .314. Those worked fine for me. By the time I has shot them up I had primers and a variety of powders.

Bullets went into 7.62x39 cases again over a reduced load of 4895. (124 gr to 155 gr so adjusted powder)
A lot of these were loaded into cheap Tulammo steeel cases and shot great. Being soft point they were legal for hunting. At the time I was having a hard time finding good brass cases with boxer primers in soft point loads.

I still have A box or 2 of those, great for times I don't want to fuss with finding brass and more accurate that the originals.

There is a lot you can do with not a lot of money, but get setup to start casting even if it is with a 3$ cast iron pan, a ladle and your kitchen stove. Bells and whistles can come later.

But you do need a press, dies for each caliber, and a way to flare those necks.

To that I would add a decent scale not digital, primers, and a few powders.
The threee I use the most are Red Dot, (everything) IMR 4227 (.357 mag) and IMR 4895 or 3031 both very good slower rifle powders.

[Artful]

I'm still shooting up my surplus tins - but it's a great fun rifle, but eventually you will become too fond of it and start the road to customizing.


click for enlarged view.

It sounds to me like he wants to reduce the punishment of the rifle against his shoulder.
Looking for more of a plinking load - cast or jacketed

[LAGS]

I have been tearing down 7.62x54R since 1978.
I was buying the Spam Can stuff for $35.00 for 800 rounds back then when I could find it.
Most of the problem was with the Primers.
Either they were very corrosive, or old and incnsistant.
I would thear them down, and save the primed Brass or Steel cases and load them up with cast boolits using a Lee Classic reloader that I still have, and use Unique , 2400 or other shotgun powders.
The powder and bullets that I salvaged were kept seperate by case lots or different Headstamps.
Then reloaded in two boxes of Norma cases that I bought, ( I still have and shoot some of those two boxes of Norma Brass)
I still tear down the surplus ammo and have two sets of Dies, Molds and Lots of reloadable cases from many manufactures.
I currently down to one 300 round can of Chinese Brass cased ammo I bought 25 years ago from Federal Ordanance in California where I use to live.
It too will be torn down eventually, and with the shortage of J bullets in recent years, the tear down operation kept me shooting when I wanted to, both J bullets as well as Home Cast boolits
Buy a Wack A Mole set up from Lee and get too it.
The primers in the Surplus stuff are still plenty good enough for cast loads.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

Decided to give it a go. Bullets pulled just fine, easier than most cast boolits I have pulled. Replaced the powder with 13 grains of Red Dot. As mentioned, the 30-06 die would not accept the taper of the 7.62x54r. Instead I used a Lee 44 mag seating die pretty much as an anvil to reseat the bullet with the case just sitting on the top of the ram. There was no obvious runout and I was unable to move the bullet by hand afterwards. My guess is that the stiffer steel case both helped to guide the bullet and maintain neck tension, not sure if it would work as well with a brass case. Rounds fired just fine and offhand accuracy was plenty good enough to shoot a few water jugs at 35 yards. All said and done the process was much faster than a typical reload (minus the cleaning for the corrosive primers!). I wouldn't hesitate to do it again. I am interested to see what the long range accuracy is compared to the unaltered ammo.

[gordie]

i read the above, and was encouraged, but wanted to ask...

my goal is to reduce recoil.

7.62x51 on a "belt" w/ a tracer rd every so often. disassembled into singles.

i pulled some bullets & weight the powder charges, looks like ball powder, 41.5grs..

can i reduce the powder charge 10% and be safe & reduce recoil ?
i would reseat the same bullet over the reduced charge.

thanks for your input...

[gew98]

Bill ; In the field I often was tasked with pitching gobs of live 7,62 ammo in the nearby river or bog at two posts on the east coast back in the 80's. Was a common thing back then before things got crazy after 9/11. Anyhow I often had time to pull a wad of the projos to save for reloading I would take two fired 7,62 cases and drop them in a 50 cal fired case. Then drop your 7,62 loaded round into the the top mouth of a fired 7,62 and put another 50 bmg case over th eback of th elive round and start the circular twisting and bend the case neck of the 7,62 to where you could then pull the bullet out by hand. Saved alot fo M80 ball and M62 tracer projos for fun later on.
I have done the same with 7,62x54 steel fodder. I eventually made a small aluminum block that you could place two 7,62x54's in and drilled a peice of oak with two 'about 30 cal holes' and used that method to loosen th enecks up good so I could easily salvage bullets on dud & or corroded surplus.

Have you tried pulling bullets from steel-case 7.62x54R? If you're going to be working with milsurp ammo, all I can say is 'GOOD LUCK'! I had some Bulgarian stuff with horribly erratic ignition...like there was sometimes enough delay that you could hear the firing pin drop before the primer went off...that I tried to pull. Bullets were sealed into the case with some kind of lacquer and, using an RCBS collet puller in my Rock Chucker, I couldn't get enough grip to pull the bullet without deforming the jacket. Tried breaking the seal by pushing bullet deeper with a correct 7.62x54R seating die and actually wrinkled the shoulder on a couple rounds without getting the bullet to move.


Bill

[gew98]

i read the above, and was encouraged, but wanted to ask...

my goal is to reduce recoil.

7.62x51 on a "belt" w/ a tracer rd every so often. disassembled into singles.

i pulled some bullets & weight the powder charges, looks like ball powder, 41.5grs..

can i reduce the powder charge 10% and be safe & reduce recoil ?
i would reseat the same bullet over the reduced charge.

thanks for your input...

Sounds like a good plan...just crimp bullets when you reseat them. What are you planning on doing wiht the M62 tracer pulls ?.

[bruce drake]

Look up Mexican Match on the google machine. Many old time highpower shooters would take the Government surplus M1 30-06 and 7.62x51 ammo and pull the 150 and 147gr FMJ and replace them with equivalent weight match bullets for better accuracy.

I've done the same for both 7.62x51 with 150gr A-Max bullets and 7.62x54R reloads with .311" 174gr Sierra MKs.

[Oklahoma Rebel]

sellior and belloit or whatever are reloadable I have done so myself around here (Tulsa) a box of sp's goes for bout 23.99 as far as I know all ammo of this brand is boxer primed, and as far as the 30-06 dies, the 54r is way fatter and wouldn't fit

[Uncle R.]

Look up Mexican Match on the google machine. Many old time highpower shooters would take the Government surplus M1 30-06 and 7.62x51 ammo and pull the 150 and 147gr FMJ and replace them with equivalent weight match bullets for better accuracy.

I've done the same for both 7.62x51 with 150gr A-Max bullets and 7.62x54R reloads with .311" 174gr Sierra MKs.

I used to do this with steel cased Chinese 7.62 x 39 way back in the 80s. I would pull the bullets with a side cutter, since I didn't care about them anyway. Put the loaded round in the proper shell holder in my JR press, and run it up until the bullet just projects beyond the threaded hole for the die. Clamp a big side cutter onto the bullet - deforming and cutting into the jacket as required to get a good grip. Lower the ram and out comes the bullet. Fast and easy. The bullet is damaged but I didn't want the dang thing anyway. I'd take those Chinese cases with their original powder charge and seat a Hornady bullet of equal weight in place of the Chinese bullet in a Lee seater die.

I could cut my group sizes by very nearly half with those Mexican match loads. My Chinese SKS would go from a near 5 minute rifle with that Chinese ammo to a solidly under 3 minute rifle just by switching to Hornady bullets.

I plan to try the same stunt with my Mosin one of these days, but first I'll have to break down and buy some 7.62 x 54R dies. I haven't tried pulling a bullet yet but it's hard to imagine that my big side cutters and a JR press can't do it.

Uncle R.