200 grain for 9mm, 9mm largo, 38 super, or 9x23?

[docmagnum357]

I loaded a bunch of flat base, 1r 9mm 150 grain boolits as an experiment to see if I could get lower recoil, better accuracy from my 9mms. The most accurate 38 special load I ever worked with was 200 grain SWC and 2400 powder. Had a recipe that made major and was not +p. I was looking for the same thing in 9mm...more bearing surface, more weight, better penetration for a "woods gun" and of course it had to feed.
The taper issue is a big deal. With soft lead i believe you can use the Lee factory crimp die and kind of "iron out " any bulge you might get. Not good, but if the alloy is soft it will "slug up" under firing pressure. Mine did. No leading and mild recoil . I only experimented with fast powders. I was looking for low recoil, quick recovery from recoil. It is also nice to shoot a 9 and not have the ear splitting sonic crack. I have read of British loads for suppressed STENs that used 160- 170 grain boolits but I can't remember where and don't remember many details.
9mm cartridge development has indeed gone the wrong way. Faster, lighter bullets make pretty flowers in gelatin but big heavy blunt boolits make gaping bleeding holes all the way through critters and tend to shoot without the snap and crack of the lighter faster loads. I think 9mm will run out of room before the recoil toleration level and recoil recovery level of most folks is reached. There really is something Special about the 38 special. A 38 Super is a much better platform. Probably a bout perfect case size.

[bobthenailer]

I have seen a few published loads for the 38 super & 180 gr jacketed & cast bullets

[reddog81]

Here's a 200 grain bullet I tried shooting recently in a S&W 929. The results were the worst of the day. bullets were tumbling at 15 yards and only 3 of the 8 bullets hit the 6" target. These were seated really long and would only work in a revolver. I was trying out half a dozen different bullets with 3.5 grains Bullseye and figured I try this one out just for giggles. It was a failure. The bullet was seated so it took up less room in the case than a 158 grain bullet would and I used 158 grain data.

I thought I had a picture of the bullet sitting next to the case but couldn't find it. The bullet is just as long as the case is.

[475AR]

I was thinking about the old british 38/200 load. This round routinely performed better on flesh than paper.

I carry a Tokarev, in 7.62x25 and am very happy with it's performance with the PPU JHPs.

I have some extra barrels in 9mm bore that can easily be chambered for 9mm largo, 9x23, 38 super.

So if I wanted to load a max weight cast boolit and drive it at moderate speeds, what are my options?

Load a really long nose in a 9x19 case?
Use 9mm largo cases? Or 38 super?

How do I overcome internal case taper?

I designed a cast bullet for my DI 9mm AR15, it casts @ 180gr with my lead. It was designed to fit and maximize case capacity in the 9mm. It is mold # 35-188DZ Tom @ Accurate Molds cut it. I bet it would work great for what you are wanting to do.

[Walkingwolf]

I was thinking about the old british 38/200 load. This round routinely performed better on flesh than paper.

I carry a Tokarev, in 7.62x25 and am very happy with it's performance with the PPU JHPs.

I have some extra barrels in 9mm bore that can easily be chambered for 9mm largo, 9x23, 38 super.

So if I wanted to load a max weight cast boolit and drive it at moderate speeds, what are my options?

Load a really long nose in a 9x19 case?
Use 9mm largo cases? Or 38 super?

How do I overcome internal case taper?

The 38/200 load had a very wide meplat, something that is going to be hard to get with a semi auto. Personally I believe the best possibility to duplicate the 38/200 load is with the 40 S&W using a 200 grain bullet downloaded for suppressor.

Berry's 200 grain flat point.



ETA I carry my 1911 with a 200 grain RNFP at a mild 800fps. With the wide 45 bullet it matches the performance of the 38/200.

[Harter66]

Just because a 148 WC fits , feeds , and shoots well doesn't necessarily make it a good idea .
Attachment 212129

This is in a Win case and fed in a FEG HP9 and a P95 DA .

[Petander]

To the right: My neverending 166 grain 9mm subsonic project has been quite ok,I still do get minor leading depending on the gun. Mostly expander thing I suppose.

That's a Lee 158,gives me 166. I keep casting and testing alloys and size,shoots and feeds great.


To the left is a dummy 230 grain 35 Whelen ... It fits in the 9mm chamber,too. But my Quick Load accrobacy isn't good enough for load stunts like that.

Attachment 218619

[lar45]

I've done a little bit with the 190 Ranch Dog in my Star Super in 9mm Largo and have reached 1000 fps with Bluedot.
I do have a Wolf extra power spring in it.
I tried them powder coated first, but it looks like they work better lubed with Carnauba Blue.

[Outpost75]

These are the primary bullets I am shooting now in the .38 S&W Ruger India Model and also in the 9mm revolvers;

Attachment 218632Attachment 218633

[RJM52]

The .38 Super is a straight walled case and is easy to use heavy bullets without case bulging.

I have used 160 grain Hornady FMJ bullets as well as 160 grain LRN. The FMJs could be pushed to 1100 fps in a non-supported chamber barrel and the 160 lead up to 1170...this was my standard IPSC load for 15 years. Have seen loading data from I believe Layne Simpson up to the 170 and 180 grain FMJ bullets.

This was the last of my IPSC ammo..50' offhand..9 rounds...before the eyes went to ****...




Bob

[RJM52]

The 38/200 load had a very wide meplat, something that is going to be hard to get with a semi auto. .com/pub/products/40-401-200gr-fp-250ct-50400.jpg[/img]

The 38/200 had a long tapered bullet...there was no flat meplat....none that I have ever seen that is...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38/200

Bob