45 Colt Brass I loaded may be bad.

[Weaponologist]

Hi Everyone.
I bought some once fired 45 Colt Brass. At least that's how it was advertised. It's Hornady brand and looked good when inspected.
After cleaning and prep I fired 3 cylinders or 18 rounds before finding a load I liked. The load I chose was 6.4 grains of Unique so there not fire balls or anything like that.
After picking my load I went ahead and loaded the rest of the brass which came to 210 rounds. Later this after noon I decided I would knock out the old primers from the 18 test rounds and put the brass in their assigned bin because that's what I do. I deprime the fired brass and put them in bins by caliber. However when I started to debrime the brass the primers would fall out with just a touch of the deprime pin. Now I was using a Harvey hand deprimer but I have never had primers fall out so easy.
When I was priming and loading I didn't notice the primers being extra easy to install But now I'm concerned about the 210 I have loaded. I guess I should also tell you this was my first time loading 45 colt but I have been reloading for many many years. I normally trash brass for loose primer pockets way before they get this bad. Should I pull all these or shoot them then trash the brass?? I can't believe this would be normal for 45 colt brass. Is it??

[Greg S]

The brass might be fine, on the brass you just deprimed did you notice any soot around the primer to indicate a gass leak? Since you already have them loaded I would shoot them but look for signs of gas leaking which will flame cut your breech face. Your primer might be loose due to the light load you are using also. Take some of the cases you just deprimed and seat some CCI 300s and note the effort required to seat them. If you have gas leaking on a standard load (255gr @ 850-900) with a CCI300 the brass is scrap.

[Weaponologist]

Greg S. I didn't notice any soot...BUT.. I did noticed the primers where a little flattened and they shouldn't have been with that load.??

I will do another check with cci primers...I was using Federal

[dudel]

How did the primers feel when they were being seated? If they were fine when seated, the brass was fine and something you did put too much pressure on it. How much crimp did you put on the case. You mention the charge, but the projectile type, weight and size are equally important. What's the cylinder (not barrel) size? If oversize, the brass had to expand more than normal. What dies did you size with? Some dies size tighter than others. What did the bore slug at? How much oversize was the projectile to the bore?

Off the top, it appears the brass is ok; but your problem is elsewhere. It's just a matter of chasing it down.

[bedbugbilly]

I'm just getting started in reloading 45 Colt but have already learned a LOT. I'm using a Uberti 7 1/2" Uberti - Lyman 454-190 cast.

With that booklet . . . I followed advice of a number of folks as far as Unique went and loaded mine up with hat boolit over 8.0 grains. My revolver shot pretty much POI to POA at 25 yards if I did my part. I don't like loading "hot" for any cartridge I do so I fully understand you wanting a milder load and why.

Here's some things I've learned so far. I don't know what you are shooting them in . . but on my Uberti, the chambers are very generous in size. I bought some Starline brass as well as some supposedly 1X fired. I started out with the Starline. Normally, I'd FL size new brass. I measured the Starline just so I'd know what it was . . and then slid the unsized brass in my chambers - more than enough room. I decided to just neck size the brass to the depth of seating. My throats measure .4525 and my boolits are dropping at 453 so I'm loading them just as they drop from the mold.

My thoughts are that since I'm only shooting them in one revolver . . they should fire form and expand if they are going to and the neck sizing will work fine and hopefully put less wear on the casings - time will tell. With 8 gr. of Unique, I had some soot on them but with the size of the chambers, etc. . . I can live with that. I checked my brass - in particular the primers, etc. even though I know this is a safe load - no issues with the primers (CCI) and when I reloaded the casings, no issue with seating primers, etc.

None of the above will probably be of any help I'm sure but put it out there anyway. In looking at my Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook (2nd edition) . . it shows a minimum charge of 6.0 gr. of Unique for the "minimum start" for 235 gr., 250 gr. and 255 gr. weight lead bullets . . . so your 6.4 gr. of Unique is certainly between the min and max. But, the charge is on the low end so I'm wondering if that is part of it or a combination of the other things mentioned? i.e. boolit size and crimp? Could it be that the charge is not putting the pressure needed that would normally expand the skirt of the primer when the cartridge base meets with the recoil shield face when fired?

Just for what it's worth . . . I also tried the same boolit (454-190) over 6 gr. of Red Dot. I was pleased with the results of it as I was also hitting pretty much POI to POA at 25 yards . . and I did notice that the recoil, etc. was milder than the Unique load.

It will be interesting to hear what folks who are well versed on the 45 Colt have to say from your post/issue. We can all learn from it.

[M-Tecs]

Could it be that the charge is not putting the pressure needed that would normally expand the skirt of the primer when the cartridge base meets with the recoil shield face when fired?

That would be my guess. Really low pressure loads tend to give flattened primers since the primer backs out then the case reseats them under pressure.

[Weaponologist]

Thanks for all the info guys,
I'm shooting a Uberty Cimarron Outlaw, Bore is .450 I'm using Lee Dies and a RCBS Taper crimp. I'm loading a 236grain at .452 cast boolit.
I could be very well Under loading and probably to much Crimp, I've read so much about crimp I really laid the crimp to them...
However, it wasn't enough to cause a noticeable mark on the brass as far as being a ring or dent in the boolit..

[Bent Ramrod]

Have you tried seating a new primer in the deprimed shells? That is how I determine whether I have a loose primer pocket or not.

[Weaponologist]

Bent Ramrod, I haven't yet but I will today...

[dudel]

Have you tried seating a new primer in the deprimed shells? That is how I determine whether I have a loose primer pocket or not.

+1 Test by seating primers. You may have to try other primer brands as well. I've heard S&B and Tulas are on the large side of the spec.

Even if they are loose (hoping they aren't), I believe there are pocket swagers that will tighten up the pistol/rifle primer pockets.

Loose pockets are not uncommon in shotshells!
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/516...re-to-10-gauge

[M-Tecs]

http://www.rwhart.com/store/proddeta...dhb-f-swage-lg

[Weaponologist]

Ok,...Good news. I tried new primers and the pockets are still tight. I couldn't even start the primer with out using a priming tool. So, Looks like I just need to work on what I'm doing to flatten the primers which is making them want to fall out. Thanks for all the help. I have several things I need to address on my next round of 45 colt loading.
I'm going to double check all my sizes, will try the neck sizing if possible and look at my powder load and my crimp.. Thanks again for every ones instruction. It is greatly appreciated...Bill

[Hardcast416taylor]

My experiences of using Hornady pistol brass is they have a tight primer pocket more so than some other brands.Robert

[smkummer]

Increase your charge to at least 7.5 grains unique and I bet your issue goes away. Unique is probably not expanding the cases at that low of pressure enough and all kinds of funny things can happen. 700X and red dot works way better at light loads than unique in 45 Colt.

[DougGuy]

6.4gr Unique is not a good load for that gun by any means and could very well be a dangerous load. Alliant lists 7.8gr as the lowest starting charge for any listed loads, and this if for a 250gr boolit. 8.0gr is nearly a standard factory load. 8.5gr is a sensible max for an old Colt or Colt clone although it should not hurt it to go as far as 9.0gr. The boolit you are using is also a little on the light side. 255gr is standard load for factory .45 Colt.

Do NOT taper crimp a rimmed pistol case, roll crimp those. Taper crimp is for rimless/auto pistol cases. Your Lee seating die will apply the correct roll crimp as it seats.

Being that you already have some unfavorable signs with the primers, I would pull all those rounds. I would mic the boolits and discard any that have been squeezed down severely by the taper crimp, as you have admitted to crimping them fairly hard. Start with 8.0gr Unique and a roll crimp. You certainly will not hurt that Colt clone with this load. I would try a string at 8.0gr and another string at 8.5gr and see which one it likes the best.

[Char-Gar]

6.4gr Unique is not a good load for that gun by any means and could very well be a dangerous load. Alliant lists 7.8gr as the lowest starting charge for any listed loads, and this if for a 250gr boolit. 8.0gr is nearly a standard factory load. 8.5gr is a sensible max for an old Colt or Colt clone although it should not hurt it to go as far as 9.0gr. The boolit you are using is also a little on the light side. 255gr is standard load for factory .45 Colt.

Do NOT taper crimp a rimmed pistol case, roll crimp those. Taper crimp is for rimless/auto pistol cases. Your Lee seating die will apply the correct roll crimp as it seats.

Being that you already have some unfavorable signs with the primers, I would pull all those rounds. I would mic the boolits and discard any that have been squeezed down severely by the taper crimp, as you have admitted to crimping them fairly hard. Start with 8.0gr Unique and a roll crimp. You certainly will not hurt that Colt clone with this load. I would try a string at 8.0gr and another string at 8.5gr and see which one it likes the best.

I concur completely. 6.4 grains of Bulleye would be a good factory level load, but not the same charge of Unique. If a fellow uses Unique in the 45 Colt, 8 to 8.5 grains is the sweet spot.

Caution in handloading is a good trait, but it can be taken too far, as is the case here.

[Weaponologist]

Thanks for the info,, I can use it all.
I was only going by the reloading manual and trying to be safe and start just a little over minimum load.
How do some of you feel about Titegroup? I have plenty of that as well. What would be a good plinking load for 45colt and 44magnum with Titegroup??

[Char-Gar]

Thanks for the info,, I can use it all.
I was only going by the reloading manual and trying to be safe and start just a little over minimum load.
How do some of you feel about Titegroup? I have plenty of that as well. What would be a good plinking load for 45colt and 44magnum with Titegroup??

Which reloading manual said 6.4/Unique was a starting load?

[Weaponologist]

I'll have to pull them back out and look tomorrow when I go to the Loading Room.
But BedBugBilly even saw that the load started at 6.0 and I added the .4 to start,, just to see how it shot.
I'm not debating that the load is to lite, It was just a new Caliber for me and I didn't know how hand gun loads react with lite loads. I had started my reloading of handgun ammo with 38special and those went with out a hitch. Up till then I've been souly a Rifle loader. It's just a learning curve. I've gotten plenty of info from this thread already. Just need to get some feed back on Titegroup if anyone has tried it..If not I'll need to go Powder shopping for some Red dot.

[wrench man]

I'm using Lee Dies and a RCBS Taper crimp. I'm loading a 236grain at .452 cast boolit.

Sounds like these boolits are for the 45 ACP?, do they have a crimp groove?, I put a HEAVY ROLL crimp on all my revolver/lever gun ammo.