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Thread: The 6.35x32mmSR STEWART "Mildcat", a potential Cheap Cartridge to shoot.

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    The 6.35x32mmSR STEWART "Mildcat", a potential Cheap Cartridge to shoot.

    This Thread is about a "Mildcat" cartridge that is small of capacity but long on Potential. It is a Proposed cartridge design for inclusion on another Forum's "Cartridge Data Base".

    My progress on this design is noted on this Forum in thread titled:
    .250/.257 Cartridges to .25ACP/.25 Stevens Diameters from 5.7x28mm once fired brass.

    [SIZE=4]The name Chosen for my proposal is "6.35x32mmSR STEWART" with a Short name of "6.35x32mm STEW".

    The Dimensional characteristics are mix of original and as reformed numbers.
    The cartridge rim Diameter and Thickness, the Extractor Clearance cut Diameter and height along with the angle cut are as per the original 5.7x28mm FN Cartridge drawing as Standardized by CIP in Europe. A 'Redding' #34 Universal Shell Holder or equivalent holds both the 5.7 originals and the .6.35 reformed cases. Lee #15 may or may not fit, depending upon the Lot Brass variations.
    Case Body is Basically Straight walled at .276" except for a tapered area starting about .300" above the cartridge Base and expanding to about .280" diameter just at the top of the Extractor Clearance cut.
    Case Length is Specified as nominally 32mm (actual = 1.250" +0.010"/-0.030") or a range of 1.220" minimum to 1.260" maximum.
    Overall Cartridge length is Specified as nominally 42mm (~1.653") for Spire Point Bullets with a practical loaded OAL for FMJ-RN 50 grain bullets of 1.500".
    Head space uses the Rim, like the .25ACP but with more diameter margin.
    Bullet Diameter is specified as .250" for Jacketed bullets and .251"-.253" for Cast lead.
    Maximum Peak Average Chamber pressure is the same as the 5.7x28mm parent as specified by CIP (~50,000psi Piezio). I am deliberately 'downloading' for my personal use as I doo not presently own a Firearm with Sufficient 'Strength of Action to use the Full pressure loading.
    Twist is Specified as one turn in 9 inches. I am using barrels with 1:14 to 1:9.4 Twist presently.

    The Case neck/Shoulder is expanded to fit a .250" diameter bullet by use of a .2500" diameter Expander Punch made from a HSS Drill Blank.

    Use an "RCBS Small Primer Swage Punch" or Equivalent, along with the "RCBS Primer Pocket Swaging Tool Kit" Stripper Cup topped with a 3/16" Diameter 'Fender Washer' to support the case primer pocket in the reforming process as the cases MUST be pushed into the Sizing dies to the Point the Top of the Rim is Flush with the bottom of the Die.

    At least Three Sizing dies should be used to minimize destruction of cases in the reforming process. Lee Charges $30.00 to "open" a Carbide ring sizing die to a custom size, shipping cost is added.

    I use Four Lee Carbide Ring .25ACP Sizing dies with three opened to .300", .288", and .284"-.280" respectively, the third is the standard .276" (.25ACP resizing) size.

    The Factory Applied Polymer case coating survives and eases the reforming process, save a very narrow ring just above the Extractor Clearance Groove which is removed by a thin ring of displaced Brass in the last reforming/sizing operation. This ring of displaced brass is caught by the groove and is removed manually after extracting the Case from the die.

    I use a Custom machined case extraction Punch made from a "6 inch long Roll Pin Punch of 7/32" size. This punch has the working tip cur square; tapered down to about .165" with rounded edge to clear the case internal wall taper; and the 'handle' area cut down to fit inside the top of the Lee die.

    For my light Stevens Favorite Actions, I am Starting with light, and subsonic, charges/loading recipes:

    74 grain Lead RFN-GC bullet; WSP primer; 1.0 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    74 grain Lead RFN-GC bullet; WSP primer; 1.1 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    74 grain Lead RFN-GC bullet; WSP primer; 1.2 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    74 grain Lead RFN-GC bullet; WSP primer; 1.3 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".

    50 grain Magtech FMJ-RN bullet' WSP primer; 1.0 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    50 grain Magtech FMJ-RN bullet' WSP primer; 1.1 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    50 grain Magtech FMJ-RN bullet' WSP primer; 1.2 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    50 grain Magtech FMJ-RN bullet' WSP primer; 1.3 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    50 grain Magtech FMJ-RN bullet' WSP primer; 1.4 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".
    50 grain Magtech FMJ-RN bullet' WSP primer; 1.5 grains Bullseye; OAL = 1.500".

    Enjoy This "mildcat" in old ".25 R.F." rifles converted to Center Fire or make a newer rifle and play with the maximum performance possible

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William ETC USN Retired.
    Last edited by Chev. William; 06-08-2018 at 01:34 PM. Reason: Correct and add information (change sin Bold typeface).

  2. #2
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    Ran some Calculations on "QuickLOAD" (QL) using as a starting point the .25ACP/6.35mm Browning with a .251" "Laupa 50gr FMJRN" Bullet.
    Correcting the Model to 'near worst case' conditions; I used a .251" Cast 74gr Lead RFN GC of .574" length, in a Maximum specified case length of 32mm (~1.260"), and an estimated Water Capacity of 7.55gr. (This is too low a Volume, a Better Calculation results in a Volume of 13.6 gr H2O)
    Bullet Seating Depth of ..334", OAL of 1.500", and a Barrel Length of 24".

    Starting with a 1.0 grain charge of BULLSEYE gave the following estimates:
    Grains powder; C-MAP psi; Initial psi; C-Muzzle Velocity; C-Muzzle energy.
    1.0; 10,352psi; 463psi; 889psi; 88ft.lbs.
    1.1; 12,062psi; 520psi; 961fps; 103ft.lbs.
    1.2; 13953psi; 580psi; 1032fps; 118ft.lbs.
    1.3; 15,741psi; 580psi; 1102fps; 135ft.lbs.
    1.4; 18,021psi; 645psi; 1167fps; 151ft.lbs.
    1.5; 20,493psi; 710psi; 1230fps; 168ft.lbs.
    1.6; 23,515psi; 855psi;1290fps; 185ft.lbs.
    1.65; 24,967psi; 893psi; 1320fps; 193ft.lbs.
    NOTE: This is about the Current SAAMI Rim Fire MAP Specification.

    Obviously, if a Strong action of modern Metals and technology, this could be pushed to higher MAP with improved performance. Changing Powder to a Slower Burning one would also increase performance within the MAP limits By increasing the 'area' under the Pressure-Time curve.

    A charge of about 1.3 grains of BULLSEYE looks like it would yield a Slightly Subsonic round (with Sound speed being about 1124fps) with a moderate to low muzzle 'blast' (estimated 358psi) with estimated 93.8% of Powder burned before bullet exit.

    NOTE: The Charge Recipes Listed are CALCULATED. they have NOT BEEN TEST FIRED YET and are presented for discussion purposes only at this time.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 11-15-2015 at 12:32 PM. Reason: Slight fromat Revision of Data presented.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    As of September 1, 2015 "Ammoguide Interactive" Web site has listed the "6.35x32mmSR STEWART" in their 'Cartridge Master Database'. It is the 950th Cartridge they have Listed to date.

    This is my First Published Cartridge design, and I am Very Happy Today.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William


    This is the "Ammoguide dimension guide drawing for this cartridge.
    These are the listed principal specifications:
    SPECIFICATIONS
    Bullet Diameter: .250 in.
    Max Overall Length: 1.653 in.
    Rifling Twist: 1-in-9.0 in.
    Rifling Lands: 6
    Case Capacity (est): 13.6 gr. water
    Primer Size: .175 in.

    NOMINAL PERFORMANCE
    Bullet Weight: 50 gr
    Muzzle Velocity: 1,830 fps
    Muzzle Energy: 371 ft-lbs
    (Excerpted from 'Ammoguide International" #950 Cartridge Data file.)

    For 'Weaker Actions' such as original (un-modified) Stevens Favorite 1894's I Recommend Starting LOW and limiting Muzzle Velocity to about 1000 to 1100fps similar to the Black Powder performance with 67 grain bullets in the .25Stevens (Long) R.F. cartridge.

    For middle strength action such as a Stevens upgraded Model 44 Action pressures around 25,000psi, or even 27,000psi, in this size Cartridge with up to 105 grain bullets should be reasonable.

    Higher pressures will require a more modern action for their development.

    This "QuickLOAD" calculated load is a NEAR MAXIMUM PRESSURE possible Load And HAS NOT BEEN TESTED! Do not use, for discussion purposes only!
    "6.35x32mmSR STEW ; 74 gr Lead RFN-GC; 1.500"; 1.260"; 5.05 gr Bullseye.
    WARNING: Since we have no control over equipment or data which may be used with this program, no responsibility is implied or assumed for results obtained through its use. Input data and results may be incorrect or wrong. Therefore the use of this data for loading ammunition can cause serious injury to personnel and material. The computer-results had to be checked against data available in current loading manuals.
    LOT-TO-LOT VARIATIONS OF POWDERS, PRIMER SUBSTITUTION AND COMPONENT CHANGE OFTEN RAISE PRESSURES
    TO UNSAFE LEVELS. THE USER MUST ASSUME THE ENTIRE RISK OF USING THIS DATA FOR LOADING PURPOSES.

    QuickLOAD© V.3.8.02 #534699, © Copyright 1987-2013 - H.Broemel, Babenhausen, Germany
    QuickLOAD data Update of 12JAN2014 installed.

    User Data: Date:31-Aug-2015 Time:22:45:50 File: *.dat
    Comment 50,000psiMAP/49508psi calc.; 13.60 gr H2O; IP = 3510psi
    Cartridge / Caliber .25 ACP (6.35 Browning) Bullet .251, 74, Lead RFN-GC with flatbase.
    Maximum Average Pressure, allowed 50000 psi. 3447 bar (Piezo CIP);
    Groove Caliber 0.251 in. 6.38 mm; Bullet Weight 50.0 gr. 3.24 gm;
    Case Capacity, overflow 13.6 gr. H2O 0.883 cm³; Bullet Length 0.574 in. 14.58 mm;
    Case Length 1.260 in. 32.0 mm; Bullet Seating Depth 0.334 in. 8.48 mm;
    Cartridge O.A. Length 1.500 in. 38.1 mm; Barrel/Tube Length 24.0 in. 609.6 mm;
    Shot Start / Init Pressure 3510 psi. 242.01 bar; Cross Section Area of Bore 0.04827 in.² 0.3114 cm²;
    Propellant type Alliant BULLSEYE;
    Charge Weight 5.05 gr. 0.327 gm; Load Density 135.3 gr./in.³ 0.535 gm/cm³;
    Heat of Explosion, Potential 334.2 J/gr. 5158 J/gm;
    Energy Density of Charge 45245 J/in.³ 2761 J/cm³;
    Propellant Solid Density 412.21 gr./in.³ 1.63 gm/cm³;
    Used Ratio of Specific Heats cp/cv 1.209;
    Burning Rate Factor Ba 3.63 1/s; Weighting Factor 0.75;
    Burning Function Limit Z1 0.178 Prog.-/ Degressivity Factor a0 -0.452;
    Factor b 1.058; Bulk Density 154.3 gr./in.³ 0.610 gm/cm³;
    Calculated and Estimated Data:
    Bullet Shank Seating Depth 0.334 in. 8.48 mm;
    Capacity Displaced by Seated Bullet 0.0166 in.³ 0.272 cm³;
    Useable Case Capacity 0.0373 in.³ 0.611 cm³;
    Bullet Travel at Muzzle Exit 23.07 in. 586.08 mm;
    Loading Ratio(''Density'') / Filling 87.7 %;
    Charge Fraction Burnt at Shot Start 2.82 %;

    Predicted Data:
    Maximum Chamber Pressure 49508 psi. 3413 bar;
    Bullet Travel at Pmax 0.33 in. 8.5 mm;

    at Muzzle Exit:
    Bullet Velocity 2305 fps. 702.7 m/s;
    Pressure at Muzzle 1249 psi. 86 bar;
    Bullet Energy 590 ft.lbs. 800 Joule;
    Bullet Barrel Time 1.090 ms;
    Propellant Burnt 100.0 %;
    Ballistic Efficiency 47.4 %
    WARNING: Near Maximum Average Pressure - unknown tolerances may cause dangerous pressures !
    Real maximum (peak) of pressure is reached while bullet moves within barrel.

    End of combustion reached before bullet's base passes muzzle."

    Bullseye is a Relatively Fast 'Pistol' Powder so there probably would be an improvement on performance if a Slower Burning powder were used.

    AGAIN THIS is Data for Discussion Only IT is CALCULATED but NOT TESTED!!

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 12-07-2015 at 12:00 AM.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master
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    I have Three Lead bullets and Five Jacketed Bullets that I have put in dummy cartridges, using about Constant Powder Chamber Volume (Bullet Seating depth held about constant) and find that only the Lightest Bullets end up with OAL within the published Specs. for the 6.35x32mmSR STEWART cartridge.

    The Jacketed bullets are limited to 35 grain, 50 Grain, and a 70 grain Speer Blitzking design if loaded slightly deeper into the case. The Hornady #2510 60 grain Would also be possible if it becomes available again.
    The three Lead bullets can be loaded to either a Constant overall length of 1.500" or the two lighter ones can be loaded to a constant Seating depth.
    The lead RFN designs are a 53 grain, a 65 grain, and a RFN-GC 74 grain one.

    this 74 grain RFN-GC bullet loads to Constant seating depth with about a 1.70" overall length. so can be loaded to 1.653"(42mm) length with a slight increase in seating depth or to 1.500" with even more increase in seating depth.

    The Speer Blitzking 70 grain Jacketed Spire Polymer tip bullet loads at 1.800" with a constant seating depth which is about .150" over Spec. OAL limit of 1.653"(42mm).
    It can be loaded to the Spec. limit with caution to adjust the Starting charge downward and develop an accurate charge from that point slowly.
    Loading Too Deeply results in the base of the bullet encountering the start of the interior wall Taper, which displays as a 'bulge in the outside wall at the taper area engaged.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 11-15-2015 at 12:50 PM. Reason: Added information.

  5. #5
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    So when does the case production and sales start?

    I've got two rifles that shoot this cartridge and I'm really tired of making the cases.

    PS, thanks for all the work you've done on this.
    "An armed society is a polite society" R.A. Heinlein 1907 - 1988

  6. #6
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    So far I am not contemplating trying to sell Formed Cases and Definitely not Loaded Cartridges.
    I don't want the "Licensing or Insurance 'Hassles' involved" at my Age.

    I am slowly working through reforming 800 .22 hornet cases and 1000 5.7x28mm Cases and find the 5.7 ones much easier although they take Three sizing steps compared to one for the Hornet brass.

    I also Ordered and received a Second lot of 1000 "once Fired" 5.7x28mm cases so I now have over 2000 to work with, this seems to b ea 'Lifetime supply at this time.

    I seem to have the Most problems with Expanding the Hornet Neck/Shoulder as I get about 5% "bellows formed Necks" in my method. I can salvage the results to make short, about 1" case length, cartridges but it is a frustration.

    To date my Formed 5.7 to 6.35 cases have come out in a range of lengths from 1.215" to 1.250" so most are 'short' of the '32mm nominal case length. since none of my uses requires a Crimp, the variable case length does not bother me.

    It might bother a Commercial customer though. No Thank You Very Much!
    However, if you would like to try some "6.35x32mmSR" I could mail you a few as a 'Freebie".

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 11-15-2015 at 12:54 PM. Reason: Added Information.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master

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    Thanks for the offer, but no need. I've got a bunch of 5.7 cases laying around.
    I've been converting 22 Hornet cases but I have recently acquired a 22 hornet pistol so I'm now reluctant to convent those cases.
    I need to order a couple of custom sizing dies from Lee and I'll start using the 5.7's.
    Again, thank you for all the time and work you have put into this project.
    "An armed society is a polite society" R.A. Heinlein 1907 - 1988

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    I think you will find resizing the 5.7 cases to 6.35 as I have outlined is Much Easier and has a better yield of usable cases. The Main difference is the Maximum Case length Variations from the Resizing Operations and variations on the Brass over time by FNB. To Date The Longest Case I have after forming is 1.251" and the shortest is 1.215" with most in the 1.230 area with newest Dates. I have had cases dated from 2011 to 2014 with the older ones seeming to yield the longer final lengths. Possibly due to manufacturing changes over time.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 10-27-2015 at 09:25 PM.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    I now have reformed over 400 5.7 cases into 6.35x32 cases, out of a supply of 2000 plus "once fired" ones, and now have trimmed 100 down to 1.125" case length. (I used the ones that had reformed to less Than 1.220" case length for parents for the Shortening process.)

    These are the test batch for a proposed "6.35x28.6mmSR STEWART" 'Mildcat' as an easier to form alternative to the ".25-10 Halsted" Center Fire replacement for use in 'shot out and rebored' .25 Stevens (Long) RF Rifles; obviously also converted to CF.

    The Yield in the conversion from 5.7x28mm Brass to 6.35x28.6mmSR is nearly 100 percent of starting cases compared to about 95 percent yield of reformed Hornet cases I have experienced to date, having reformed over 600 hornets to the reduced body diameters of a .25ACP or .25 Stevens (about identical body diameters but differing in Rim diameters).
    This also saves needing to Thin the Hornet Rim down to .050" thickness.
    The 5.7 Rim of .314" diameter and .050" thickness is a good fit to existing .25 Stevens Chambers as they are normally found with Rim rebates of about .350" diameter and about .053" depth.
    Being around a Century or more old and originally made in the Black Powder Era the steels are slightly soft for Jacketed Bullet use, although they will stand many shots before wear makes them less accurate, they will give longer life shooting Cast Lead Bullets.

    I lost one case in the first 50 due to a deep Score line lengthwise on the case, not noticed until the Case was Trimmed to length, that split when i tried to 'bell the mouth. so I have 99 usable test cases for the 1.125" case length.
    Range of bullets to be tested:
    1. Speer 35gr "Gold dot" JHP at .343" Bullet Length and .251" nominal diameter.
    2. Magtech 50gr "FMJ-RN" at .458" bullet length and .251" diameter as received .
    3. Hornady 60gr #2510 if it ever is put back into production.
    4. Sierra 70gr "Blitzking" #1605 at .685" bullet length and .257" diameter as received (.251" after resizing through a Lee Push Through resizing die).
    5. Carolina Cast bullets commercial Lead "Ranch Dog" .25ACP 51gr at .415" bullet length and nominal .258" diameter (.251" after resizing as above).
    6. Lyman #257420 Lead 65gr at .547" Bullet Length and nominal .257" Bullet diameter (.251" after resizing as above).
    7. Purchased Lead 74gr bullet at .605" bullet length and nominal .257 diameter (.251" after resizing as above).

    These are the first few I have to test in this shorter case length.

    I will probably start test loading with "Bullseye" powder as it is the most "frugal" one I have on hand (small charges for given results).

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 11-15-2015 at 01:02 PM. Reason: Correct Data and add information.

  10. #10
    Boolit Master

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    I have a RCBS 25-050-RN mold that I've been using in the 25 Steven. If you would like to try them for lighter loads let me know and I will send you some. From memory (not the best now-a-days:^) I use 1.1 grains of Bullseye behind them in a converted 22 Hornet case. I haven't shot them across the chronograph yet so don't know the fps.
    Gar
    "An armed society is a polite society" R.A. Heinlein 1907 - 1988

  11. #11
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    Given that probably nobody will make up a barrel in .251" diameter when .257" exists from many big name makers, the simple question of why .257" wasn't selected comes up. Boring, rifling and making up as "special" a .251" diameter rifle barrel seems to be a way to guarantee nobody makes one or wants to make one of these "wildcats."

    If I was a gunsmith making a new one I would get a blank .257" barrel by Douglas or some such. Few gunsmiths are set up to bore and rifle barrels in the first place. Yes, some firms do reboring but offering the option of an already made barrel in .257" for any and all other guns (Contenders or some such) has appeal more so than reboring what is likely a soft steel barrel originally intended for low pressures and soft lead bullets. High pressure jacketed use probably will see a short life expectancy for a "rebored" shot out small caliber barrel found in old guns. Not sure I'd want to subject a soft steel barrel to 50,000 psi jacketed. Not saying that you would.....but why limit the options of somebody who doesn't have a barrel to rebore and wants to use off the shelf?

    If we're starting with a new barrel, that would make doubly questionable the idea of making .251" instead of .257." No jacketed reforming needed in .257" either. The more high performance you go, the more .257" makes sense. Actually in terms of barrel availability and quality .257" makes more sense at low pressures and velocities as well. More bullet designs available by far, in appropriate weights as well.

    The proposed rifling twist for the cartridge seems to be needlessly fast given the capacity and likely bullets to be used.

    Not sour grapes so much as wondering why. The bottom line is it's your cartridge and your idea, but for good reasons I'm allergic to .251" barrels. Said by a .25 caliber guy, BTW.
    Last edited by 35remington; 10-26-2015 at 09:32 PM.

  12. #12
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    35remington, I can’t speak for Chev William, but for me this, cartridge is a way to shoot some very fine antique handguns and rifles that I own. Anything that helps to bring back an old classic like a Steven Favorite or a Crackshot rifle in 25 rimfire to the range works for me. I currently have 4 guns that were 25 RF’s, three of those are now converted to centerfire’s and this cartridge is feeding them.
    Safe shooting, Gar
    "An armed society is a polite society" R.A. Heinlein 1907 - 1988

  13. #13
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    Gar,
    Yes, I would Like ot try some your "RCBS 25-050-RN" Bullets as I Presume they are 50 grain round nose without the Flat tip.

    I will send A PM with my Mailing address in a bit.

    35remington,
    As Gar said this is a project for Reusing existing older Rifles in .25 Stevens (Long) RF by converting the Action from RF to CF.
    The Ruger is a Separate Idea that would use a Lothar Walther (LW) ".25ACP/6.35mm Browning" Chrome-Moly Steel "Pistol Barrel Blank", Which LW states is about 1.10" Diameter by 23.8" long and is 6 grooves 1:9.4" twist (LW Revised their On line Catalog to list this Barrel Blank a having a 1:9.8" Twist) .246"/.250" Bore/Groove Diameters. I already have two blanks I purchased over the last two years to be used for NEW High Grade Steel Replacement barrels for project Rifles, one a conversion of a Steel Receiver Marlin Model 56 to .25ACP Lever repeater.
    I also have one TJ 'Hammer forged Liner in .25ACP purchased through "track of the Wolfe" which measures 7/16" diameter by 26" long.
    The Old Stevens barrels are cut with .250" to .251" groove diameters and .246" to .248" Bore diameters according to Slugs made and measured by my Gunsmith. These were designed for Soft Lead bullets in the 67gr to 74gr range and Black Powder Loads so are not really suitable for modern Jacketed bulllets; but will take an occasional jacketed bullet of .250"-.251" accurately.

    Stevens seems to have made his barrels to the minimum Bore/Groove side of what Specifications existed at the time which resulted in a reputation for Accurate Shooting Barrels.

    Back in time a bit; a Mr. Halsted developed a CF cartridge for use in Stevens barrels that had been 'shot out' and re-rifled to the slightly larger .257" barrel minimum Specifications. He specified a Soft Lead Bullet in a Reformed Hornet case that reduces the Body diameter to .276" and base diameter to.278", reduces the rim to .340" diameter by .050" thick so it would fit the existing .25 Stevens chambers.
    The cartridge is named the ".25-10 Halsted" which alludes to the Marlin, Remington, and Winchester use of ".25-10 RF" to refer to the .25 Stevens cartridge without using his name for it on their rifles.

    Yes other makers used .257 bullets in Rifle Cartridges to 'rival' the Stevens and separate their CF designs from his RF designs. RF cartridge production was halted in the beginning of WW2 to support War Production but existing stocks were still sold well into the 1950s. then in the 1960s some Canadian made and some South American made .25 Stevens short cartridges were imported but fund 'wanting' in performance as they used the old 'Short' Loading data which used a light bullet at light loading for short range and gallery shooting.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 12-11-2015 at 11:38 AM. Reason: Slight Editing and typo corrections.

  14. #14
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    If the old barrel is in good condition, no problem with leaving it .251" but I'd wager good condition original barrels that had a regular diet of blackpowder or corrosive priming might be few and far between.

    Good for you if you can obtain good .251" barrels reasonably so no issues with the decisions there save the twist of 1 in 9.4 seems awfully fast for a short bullet/cast bullet shooter. If much spitzer or jacketed use is figured into the deal I'd avoid the sizing hassle and go .257" from the get go as those bullets are much easier to obtain in that diameter with no "limited runs" of availability depending upon whenever Hornady or whomever is in the mood. Overall, for me "going modern" or not will depend on the usage. The best quality barrels are likely to be had in .257".

    I'm sure you'll have fun no matter what, which is the whole point.

  15. #15
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    At my current age and Physical Condition, 100 Yards and Paper targets is generally my Distance for Shooting. So far I have found, using Grade 2, .27 Cal., Powder Tool Loads and a Breech seated Bullet in these old Stevens Barrels provides accuracy at least as good as my Holding Ability Off Hand Sitting. Even the one I have that has about .0005" deep Rifling left will group usably.
    Lead 53gr at 1100fps seems to work just as well now as it did in the 1890s. Jacketed 50gr seems to be about the Same group sizes at these speeds. I am still looking for a 67gr Lead bullet to try in this set up. (Hornady #2510 60 grain Soft flat point jacketed would be nice to try but are "Temporarily Unavailable".)
    I Do Think converting to CF will make This style of Shooting simpler, Just being able to Reload the Brass is a Good Start on 'cheaper Shooting' as the Box of 50 each .25 Stevens Long RF I bought at a Gun show cost $60.00 so I don't shoot them often.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William
    Last edited by Chev. William; 11-15-2015 at 01:15 PM. Reason: Addition and Editing .

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    Still waiting on My replacement/new sizing dies and additional push punches from Lee.

    This Last week I got A "Work call" from my Union Dispatcher that yielded three days last week and promises eight more in the coming two weeks before Thanksgiving, so It looks like I will be having a Good Thanksgiving Holiday after all. The Work hours are 0600 to 1430 so I am getting up at 0300 to get to the Job site on time.
    This is 'confusing' my two dogs as it has been a LONG Time since my last 'long' work call.

    Best Regards,
    Chev. William

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    That Work call Got me three More days This week, for a total of 6 Work days, Great for my future Pocket Book. Now to Wait for the Paychecks to be Mailed (a 53+ mile round trip to pick up the Check in Person would waste too much of the Gains). Interestingly, my 1986 Dodge Ram50 Pick up, which is loaded with my Working Tools, got 20.6 to 21.4 Miles to the Gallon for this commute. Traffic in the Morning was 'smooth and flowing' but coming home in the Afternoon it was 'slow and jerky' until I got back to the Southbound I-5 Freeway when it finally opened up to 'smooth and flowing' again.

    The Commute route Going to Work Was I-5 north to I-118 West to I-405 South over Sepulveda Pass (through the I-405/I-101 Interchange) to Pico then to 20th Century Fox Studio Lot Parking.

    Pico Avenue off Ramp is just 'North' of the I-405/I-10 Interchange which is another of the Southern California "Bottle Neck Spots" on our Los Angeles 'Freeway' system, Better now that the last Major enlargement project is complete. The I-405/I-101 interchange has been "Improved" also by reworking as far as Possible but is still only three lanes of Through traffic on the I-405 North under the I-101 Bridges, funneling down the 6 lanes of Traffic Coming down hill from the South is still a "Bottle Neck" that causes many "Grinding Teeth" Sessions for the Daily commuters that Try to do 65-70 MPH through it when Traffic is doing 0-25 MPH.
    Wednesday Afternoon there were three Cars pulled to the Side with tow truck and CHP in attendance, an "oops" moment perhaps?
    Still, it IS Doable daily if you Keep your cool, I have done it for past commutes to Sony Entertainment Studios on Culver Blvd and to International Rectifier in El Segundo, which is even further down the Same Route.
    Work is Where You find it, and Home is Where you Start and End your days.
    Best Regards,
    Chev. William

  18. #18
    Boolit Master

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    Thought I give you a quick update on those cases you sent.
    I ran them 2 hours in the tumbler with SS pins and it really didn’t remove much of the poly coating. I finally soaked them in acetone and buffed them with steel wool and that did the trick but it’s way to time consuming. I’ll have to think on it some more.
    The 32mm cases are a tad too long to chamber in any of my Stevens so I had to trim them down to 29mm. I have them loaded up in .3 grain increments starting a 1 grain of Unique thru 2.2 grains.
    It has rained quite a bit here in the last week and I can’t get out to the range until the mud dries up. I’m hoping by Sunday or Monday I can get to the range and fire them across the chronograph and get some speeds and group sizing.
    I also loaded up the same loads in the 22 Hornet parent cases to compare.
    I’ll post the results when I get them.
    "An armed society is a polite society" R.A. Heinlein 1907 - 1988

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    Today, I confused my dogs by NOT getting up at 0300 to get ready to go to work and by being around all day instead of being gone most of it.
    Watered my Trees and Shrubs this morning, and after a week, they needed it.
    My replacement Bullet sizing die (.250") came but no case sizing die nor Seating die arrived so I will be calling Lee tomorrow to check on their progress as Lee Said they would ship them all in one package to save me shipping fees.

    29mm (1.145+") seems close to the typical Stevens chamber Length, is this deliberate on your part? Or are your chambers longer than the ones I have (1.150" -1.153" range)?

    I have one "model 44" barrel that is reamed longer, to take 1.260" case length, but my gunsmith is still out of town on a 'lucrative" movie Job, both as an Armorer and as a Talent Actor/Extra, and making good money with the rents of his firearms collection in addition to the Pay.
    So my "model 44" action is on hold partly Converted to CF capable.
    I am hoping my Paycheck comes in either Friday or Saturday Mail but it may be as late as next week.
    Best Regards,
    Chev. William

  20. #20
    Boolit Master

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    I chose the 29mm length based on the shortest camber, my Model 35 tip-up which is almost 1.150" (1.147") in length. At 1.145" the cartridge will camber in any of my 25RF's.
    It's been dry and sunny for the last two days, a couple of more and I should be able to get to the range.
    "An armed society is a polite society" R.A. Heinlein 1907 - 1988

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check