cooking charcoal

[bigted]

question ... can you over cook the wood in the container in which you are making charcoal? in other words ... what would happen if you left the container in the fire after the wood turns to charcoal?

I am close to giving it a try making some powder and I have access to western Oregon willow, red alder as well as most of the softwoods. I have everything needed except the charcoal so it is time to get off my butt and make some so I can turn in a batch of powder for the first try.

just lookin for a pointer on making the charcoal.

[Texantothecore]

We have no idea. Everyone pulls the retort when the smoke stops coming out of the hole.

You probably could over cook it, but most of us are so excited about our charcoal we may pull it off the fire too early.

[nagantguy]

According to the skilled folks at the George Dickel distillery yes you can over cook it, and while it's still charcoal per say, it'll burn quick and not hold a coal as long as it should.

[Texantothecore]

The smoke coming out of the retort can be lit and you can watch as a merry flame shoots from your retort. When the fire goes out try to light it again. If you can't it is basically done.

I have had flames which were quite long and which might have measurable thrust. Very cool.

[Good Cheer]

When the off gassing stops pushing out of the opening(s) then oxygen can start migrating back in.

[dondiego]

Keep cooking and you will end up with ash.

[GoodOlBoy]

Yep you cook it long enough you get ash. Usually fairly clean ash. This is actually a method that has been used by some when making hardwood ash to get lye from for lye soap and hominy.

GoodOlBoy

[bigted]

cool. thanks for the tips. I have a lot to learn in the BP making and I guess it shows.

[Fly]

Well better a little over cooked then not. It take a lot to over cook it to ash. But BE SURE to make sure it is air tight when you pull it from the fire.
Most ash happens if a little air is exposed to it.
Fly

[Baron von Trollwhack]

Now, time for serious study if the product is to excel. http://www.laflinandrand.com/madmonk/Swiss_Booklet.pdf

BvT

[bigted]

Now, time for serious study if the product is to excel. http://www.laflinandrand.com/madmonk/Swiss_Booklet.pdf

BvT

now if only there were a text describing the new GOEX OL E.

that was a very interesting read and I thankyou for the text reference.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

I myself see a lot of understanding in this report of American black powder manufacture. To me it seems just like the UNION Ordinance Department buying powder from American powder makers to support the national war effort. Some was very good, some was mediocre to unusable, most was within specs.

http://www.laflinandrand.com/madmonk/history.pdf

Seems like having a lock on the market, with the only modern concerns being BIG GUN powder for Uncle and that not much, the rest of the market (us shooters) could take the leavings. Perhaps with the current state of the market, our domestic producer has decided to be truly competitive. But even home made powder beats none.

Bit a good study beats the "ell" out of the initial speculation too.

BvT

[Good Cheer]

The Swiss info about cutting wood when the sap has risen and brought up the sugars that were stored in the roots...
If that's an important step then why not give nature a boost with a sugar water soak for the wood?
Just asking seeing as I haven't made powder since fifth grade.

[bigted]

GoodCheer ... I would think that a good brown sugar concoction that would dissolve properly in a tub of warm water should be the shis nits ... then put the split and "DRY" wood chunks in and weigh em down so they stayed under the brine for about a week would/should add some sugar to the charcoal when cooked off. interesting thought.

[Good Cheer]

Reckon the left over water could be used in another process and distilled later for bore solvent.

[blueeyephil]

What size of black willow do you use when making charcoal? I have access to plenty, just need to cut some.

Also how much wood would be needed to make a couple of pounds? In volume. Based on how wet the wood is would change the weight quite a bit I'm sure.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

I haven't made any powder either. I have saved that FOXFIRE book for emergency reading though.

BUT it seems to me that if one were to acquire alder saplings of more similarity to the saplings the Swiss used(species similarity, age, climate, harvest time, drying process, bark removal, and the like), and gave up the immediate spontaneous desire to go SOAK wood in sugar water as a "great leap forward" there might be more meaningful progress in efforts to make Swiss quality powder. How about a WIKI search for a start and more research on manufacture? Any body called the Swiss people for historical and available technical information as an interested shooter?

Somewhere in that info I provided is a discussion of how one of the companies in the chain of powder making between DuPont and the current owners had troubles because one of the contract wood suppliers took it upon themselves to substitute the wood specified and used and thereby screwed up a couple of years of production before the problem of bad powder was figured out. And this by experts in the business. I think wood is simply not any old wood, just as it is not any old wood for such as AIRPLANE PROPEllERS, or fine furniture. Maybe there is some clue in Foxfire V, since the colonials early on started powder mills, and until the 1880's there were many, many, independent black powder makers that made darn fine powder right here.

BTW is anyone aware that Brownells has some king of special pure ground charcoal for tempering and maybe case color hardening that is specially manufactured. This may or may not need sugar added if it could possibly be used in powder making.


It is nice to be exuberant though.

I know all have seen those ancient early moving pictures of the airplane with the huge rotating blades on top....that also cycled up and down. Oh, not so good for the aviation breakthrough.

BvT

[bigted]

BVT ... I see where you go with that and I do have a endless supply of "red alder" saplings of a smaller nature { say 1 to 3 inch in diameter at the ground} that should need no splitting ... just harvest ... peel when wet ... dry and follow with the cook off into charcoal.

could it really be that stinkin simple?

[blueeyephil]

We'll I'm pretty convinced that during the civil war the confederates here in northern Arkansas used willow. There were several sites along the rivers were there were caves that they got saltpeter from. Or at least harvested bat guana from. And there is black willow all along the creeks and rivers. There are a few cast iron kettles around a bought 3 feet across that had been used. But they are all broken in some way because the North raided the powder works and rolled the kettles down the bluffs to destroy them.

Adler may be better but not what I have available.

[bigted]

oh I do not know about this red alder ... just that I read that the good stuff was and is made with "buckthorn alder" ... now I do not know how our red alder stacks up to the buckthorn but I plan to try it along with our willow that is just about the same size and in places it grows like weeds.

what id really like to use and plan a test with is our western Oregon "viney maple". after years of crawling thru the crud [logging and hunting both] ... id like to find a use for the $&!#.