Bedding with jb weld

[LAGS]

A Question ;
Are you just bedding the front lug area and back Tang ?
And what are you using for a Guide Screw when you set your action and barrel back in the stock ?
I dont have any long Guide Screws that have the thread for the Nagant receiver.
So I used a 4" long section of 1/4" wood dowel threaded into the Front action screw hole. with release agent in it of course
It acts as the guide, and plugs the waxed Hole on the recoil lug.
Then when everything is cured, you can pull the dowel out thru the bottom of the stock with pliers, and for final fitting the hole can be drilled a little larger for the action screw.
I take it you will be bedding your bottom metal seperatly, and after the action is bedded ?
Or did you already bed your bottom metal at both front and rear tangs, and that will give you your alignment for your action to be dropped in ?
On a MN it can be done either way.
I usually bed my action with the internal inletting in the stock like for the trigger space and magazine well filled with clay.
Then I bed the bottom metal to tighten it up in the inletting.

[corey012778]

after all of the post on these thread. I am about to say forget and just order the shim kits that are out there. or make the shims. at least I have done that in the past

[Safeshot]

I like to use the "SLOW" cure "Epoxy" with fiber glass fibers and aluminum flakes or powdered stainless steel and some carbon black or brown pigment (to help stop light and its effects). I think it is very important to have the epoxy saturate/penetrate into the grain of the wood. It does not take any longer to apply the "Slow Cure" stuff and some extra working time can be a big help. Also agree that it is best not to "rush the curing". Give it an "extra" 24 or 48 hours before disturbing it. Just my opinion.

[LAGS]

Dont ever settle for the EASY way out.
The Shims take a bit of Knowledge to get them to fit your action to your stock.
Plus, If you start simple, and take your time, You are banking Knowledge for your Next Project, or for this Project if you want to in the future try a more complicated bedding job.
We are here to TEACH You.
Years ago I started with a MN and point bedded it, then point bedded the Bottom Metal.
What a differance, so then that gave me the confidance about 6 months later, to grind out the bedding, and do both the barrel and action this time with the barrel Free floated.
The handguard had a crack in it, so then I was able to use my bedding Knowledge to fix it with epoxy like I was bedding a barrel channel. (I sold that rifle 10 years ago but Still have that Handguard)
If you need more detailed help, then PM myself, or some of the other members.
Now that I got my computer to be able to post pictures, I am sure I can be of more help.

That First MN was rebuilt at least 5 times from 1977 til 1995.
I learned a lot from that one rifle, and a friend of a friend is still shooting it.

[LAGS]

OK,
I found this stock in my closet.
It is an ATI plastic stock, that I point bedded with JB Weld
I also installed an 1/8" aluminum shim to the stock since it was so poorly fitted from the factory.
I did the front receiver area but not the barrel rear, the rear Tang and the built a spot up at the tip of the stock that has Zero up pressure, but fits the contour if the barrel.
I also bedded the front tang on the bottom metal to insure there was the proper compression on the front action screw when it was tightened down and does not warp or bind the magazine.
This improved the stock greatly. but I like wood stocks better, so this one just sits in the closet for Horse Trading away or some other future project.
(It has been in the closet for 8 years I think)

BTW
the trigger well was also inletted for the Timney trigger, and that is why you cant see the whole rear action screw hole.

[corey012778]

Was going hit the area with sand paper to rough up the wood.

[LAGS]

You might take up to a 1/16" of wood off in critical areas.
Remember, your stock has been exposed to Oil over the years, and that can act a a release agent.
On Oily stocks, I drill a series of 1/8" diameter holes in critical areas th act as anchors for the epoxy.
I do the same on Plastic Stocks, because epoxy doesnt want to stick to most plastics.
But you can see in the pic's what areas are needed to get the action to set in the stock solidly.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I doubt if there are many benchresters using anything but fully floated barrels. There is no doubt that this is the way to the ultimate accuracy in ideal conditions. The surest way to make anything consistent, is to make it consistently zero. But there are problems in taking that into more everyday shooting, and I don't consider them entirely absent from bedding the forend tip and floating the rest.

Floating a sporter-weight forend by the thickness of a business card is a snare and a delusion. If you use a shooting sling, you exert some sideways tension that may produce contact. Dirt can easily fill that gap, and water will stay in there, and travel along it, by capillary action. Water is pretty hard stuff when things happen quickly enough, as a bad high-diver can show you, and that is motion far slower than barrel flip. That is even without the water turning into ice. A narrow gap doesn't do much for even cooling of the barrel circumference either. Nearly all heat insulating materials involve trapped and static air.

I'd keep floated barrels for rifles on which you can leave a gap wide enough to get a towel or string through. Otherwise I would just bed the full length of the forend. Done simple, the tiniest change of shape can change from pressure to no pressure. One idea which I think gave good results (though I never tried the same rifle glass-bedded without it) was to incorporate a piece of high melting-point rubber sheet in the tip of the forend. When you dismantled the rifle, you could feel that rubber pad rising very slightly proud of the epoxy.

I'm sure there is nothing at all wrong with Accraglas, although I would have to buy it from overseas, and their cheapest kit comes just over the £15 threshold which would let me in for import taxes and an iniquitous admin charge. I don't like giving money to governments. It only encourages them. As to whether general-products are as good, Brownells also tell us their blue paint-on release agent is the best for the job because... I am sure there is a "because" in it someplace. But it isn't what people in the recent thread on release agents say. I suspect that some contract supplier somewhere is filling Brownells-marked tubs and bottles from just the same epoxy vat as they do other people's.

[nekshot]

Lags, has that stock been thru the rodeo of shooting? I never dreamed JB would hold up like that. Maybe my JB is too old. I buy some for a little job and then it sets in storage for a year or 2 and doesn't seem to work as good as when new. I am a strict agra glass gel guy for most anything in this nature.

[corey012778]

I have the bedding setting with the barrel. clock is on. 24+ hours of wait. it is not going to be that bad. started working on other projects to work on. sadly it is in my way right now for those lol

[Shooter6br]

PC7 is a good choice

[LAGS]

That ATI MN stock was shot a lot.
It was on the rifle all the time I was making a wood stock for that action and has been on a couple other actions while I was refinishing the stocks on those rifles.
That is why you can see a few Dremmel Sanding disc scratches on the sides behing the recoil lug , where I had to sand it just a little wider to fit a different action than what it was originally bedded for.
Everything held up just fine.

[LAGS]

Corey.
Did you make your Sign ?
Pictures of how you clamped it would help too.
I cant wait to see how it turned out.

[corey012778]

no, just moved after hitting it once or twice in the corner of my shop that is out of the way. forgot the paper. not going to touch it till I get my nap from work and figure out what I am fixing for dinner. feeding the beast that run around my house (2 dogs and a kitten). lol

[corey012778]

used large plastic spring clamps.

note: just showing type of clamp I used.

[ak_milsurp]

I've used JB Weld, in the industrial size package for YEARS... NEVER had a problem with it. I save all my brass trimmings from grooming cases and add it into the JB weld mixture. Adds strength.... And helps strength.....

[ak_milsurp]

Damn autocorrect!! Makes a great bedding compound very strong, stable and heat resistant

[LAGS]

I too have added Metal shavings to JB Weld to Beef It Up.
When I am done filing metal like making and polishing parts, I take an old speaker magnet and run it across my bench and the floor to pick up the metal filings before I sweep up.
That is saved and put aside for adding to epoxy.
I also use steel wool that has been rinsed off in acetone, or like you said, brass trimmings.
The epoxy mixed with metal also makes it transfer electricity, like if I am epoxying nuts to a steel plate to use when I am powder coating bullets.

Corey
Your clamping is perfect.
That should keep the receiver down right where you need it.

[LAGS]

One note,
I noticed that you did not put tape on the outside of your stock.
I always do that and put release agent on the tape to prevent any epoxy that gets on it from sticking.
It is better to get into the habbit of protecting the outside of the stock even on a Bare stock.
You will have bedding jobs that the epoxy has to Spooge out to fill all the way up along the sides of the receiver and barrel channel. and then be removed while it is setting up , but not fully cured.
The tape prevents it from running onto your stock when it overflows, and sticking to the stock.
The tape also protects the stock if you end up getting epoxy on your hands, and grab the rifle.

[MBTcustom]

I just want to put my 2 cents in here for any who are interested.
There are only two bedding compounds I recomend and use (although, JB is an excellent choice other than the fact that it's so runny. I prefer a more viscous compound).
These two are Acraglass and Devcon 10-110, with Devcon being the one I always try to use. The only drawback to 10-110 is its grey color. On high end rifles I use Acraglass because it can be stained to be more visually appealing to the eye. However, Acraglass is not filled, and as such it will shrink slightly, and you just don't get that awesome fit that 10-110 provides (JB weld is filled to a lesser extent, but shrinks very little.)

The main consideration when bedding a rifle is preparation and skilled execution.
It is important to apply the epoxy with the act of cracking things out later kept in mind at all times. Also, it is imperative to hold the action in place with just enough pressure to set things in their correct position. Too little, and you will have issues. Too much and you wasted your time.
For a very in depth and well explained tutorial on bedding a rifle, I suggest you read everything this man has to say on his site, and buy his tools if you require them:
http://erniethegunsmith.com/catalog/i130.html
I had my own ideas on what it takes to properly bed a rifle, based on observation of pressure and its effect on the components of the rifle, and Ernie the gunsmith pretty much backs up everything I believe to be correct, and for the same reasons. His site is richly embellished with instructions and demonstrations with pictures and I was excited to see someone who understands things like I do. Educate yourself by reading what he has to say and you cannot go wrong. The difference between a world class matchgrade bedding job and a garage shop hack job is in the preparation and execution.

The final thing I will leave you with is an observation I have made after bedding many many rifles and cleaning up after others who tried to do it:
The amateur gunsmith gets bedding compound EVERYWHERE. It gets on the stock, on the barrel, on the bench, on the gunsmith, on the trash can, and on the roll of paper towels.

The professional gunsmith also gets it in the rifle where it belongs.