I know this has been beat to death and I have heard all the arguments against handguns for bear defense.That aside,if you were carrying a hand gun for protection and last resort against bear attack where would you adjust your sights(Max distance?)the line in the sand so to speak.The actual distance where you know that its time to either meet your maker or put the bear down.How close will you let a bear thats out to kill you bear get?
Last edited by white eagle; 07-28-2015 at 08:40 AM.
Hit em'hard
hit em'often
I have the utmost faith in my Colt 1911; I have it sighted in at 50 yards and I suggest that anybody depending on a handgun should sight it in so that it shoots point of impact at the limit of point blank range.
Gun control is not about guns.
A better question is at what distance do you consider a bear to be a threat? "Last resort" means walking away, playing dead, running, and climbing didn't work. A 50 yard zero seems adequate to me.
Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.
you shoot a bear at 50 yds and you'll have lot's of explaining to do.
25yds is a bit too close for comfort, and is about the danger zone of charge or leave for the bear.
they don't see too well.
if they come in aim low.
First I have to agree with wch.
If sighted in at 25 yards the difference between that and 50 yards should not be large. It is just my opinion, but it would seem to me that 50 yards is fire one shot in the air to give the bear a chance to turn around range. If the bear charges, your 25 yard zero should be right on the money. By the time it covers that 50 yards (Just a few seconds btw, they can flat as MOVE when they choose) you should be out of ammo and looking at other options, like finding a tree or an edged weapon, or scream like a girl as you assume the fetal position. By that time either the bear has changed his mind, is dead/wounded, or you are totally out of luck.
Do NOT run, all preditors seem have a built in "it moves, it runs, chase it and kill it" instinct.
Be aware of your surroundings, make enough noise so the bear hears you a distance off.
My 10yr old son is in Montanna (outside Kalispell) with his grandparents right now. Last night when he called home he told me he came on a bear in the woods at 50ft. He backed away slowly until out of sight and ran to the house. Not what a Dad wants to hear. I can't wait until he gets home Saturday. He's been gone 5 weeks.
It will depend on the length of the barrel. 50 might be to far for a shorty. With my hunting revolvers, there is little difference from 10 to 50.
added a few more lines
I wasn't referring to hunting bear per se but defending your person from enraged bear
Hit em'hard
hit em'often
At times bears will false charge and stop @ 10 yards. In most States you will be in violation if you shoot at 25 yards or more. The reality is you get two shots of with a DA revolver if you are average, 3 if exceptional, I would take one shot away for single action and plan on 3 with a 45 auto. IMO, if a bear is 50 yards away he is where he wants to be adn you should be Ok with that.
[The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze
Yes, barrel rise with a big bore might need a closer sight setting. Carry guns in a big bore will be short with a huge rise so 50 will be too far. If I had Ruger Alaskan, I know 50 is a lark so I would sight for 10. Anything farther is hunting.Originally Posted by white eagle
I may be way off base here, but my Redhawk is zeroed at 50 yards. At 25 I can still hit pop cans.
Assuming a bear was charging me, I would be amazed if I could keep them all inside a paper plate at 25 yards given the effects of adrenaline on my system.
Fortunately for me however, most animals that have the ability to effect my nerves and aim are larger than a paper plate by a good margin.
In fact, one could say that the size of the creature is exponentially linked to the size of my groups, and therefore is of no consequence.
Seems to me, the important considerations are as follows:
1. Have a gun with you in the first place
2. Make sure you have practiced enough with it that the fine motor skills required to manipulate it are built in and rehearsed to the point that you can perform them under extreme duress.
3. Make sure both 1 and 2 happen with a firearm with enough thread in its shorts to get the job done.
4. Same point as #3 but pertaining to the ammunition.
Precision in the wrong place is only a placebo.
No Tim you are not way off base. As you are aware sight settings are just simple trig. Trajectory is more complicated since it is a parabolic curve.
Barrel length has no effect other than the value of the clicks on an iron sighted gun. Barrel rise from recoil is also not a factor. Sight height and trajectory are the only two considerations.
On an iron sighted handgun 25 or 50 yards makes very little difference since the bullet rises so little to the line of sight. On a scoped handgun sighting to close puts you way to high at 50 yards since the angle to get to the line of sight is so much greater.
This is for a scoped air rifle but it covers the basics fairly well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABp7nc_93jE
Last edited by M-Tecs; 07-28-2015 at 02:00 PM.
Excellent!
Therefore, I suggest everyone print this thread out and keep it with you. If you find you are in a situation where you are being charged by a bear, pull it out and read it carefully. Make fine adjustments on the sights of your handgun and prepare to defend yourself properly with a fine 2" group in the chest of the charging bear. While your at it, sprinkle yourself with paprika salt and pepper.
Me, I'm going to pull my gun and shoot the **** bear and read the instructions later over a glass of iced tequila while I eat bear jerky.
Precision in the wrong place is only a placebo.
If I see a bear 50 yards from me or should I say, if a bear sees me within 50 yards and I will shoot if it looks like he is coming. Who knows how far that bears was from me when I shot. Bears (or animals) can cover ground at a very short time. I will worry about the distance once I see the animal is down.
Flame suit is on
How about Howdah, a pistol that was used against tigers? Maybe it could teach us something?
Modern reproduction:http://www.davide-pedersoli.com/tipo...ah-hunter.html
These were used at VERY short distances. When a tiger (or a bear) really attacks, the sighting distance is probably the last of your worries.
OOOOOoooooooh that there is a great idea
they used to be available in 12 ga as well as 20 hmmmmmm. wonder if they still are
Hit em'hard
hit em'often
Lar45 has one as his avatar. I've seen it, and it is impressive.
Precision in the wrong place is only a placebo.
For my own purposes, a 50 yard zero means no worries about windage or elevation at any shorter distance.
If he's not attacking, neither of us has an issue. I'll just leave quietly.
Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.
Most people visualize a bear charging from 50 yds & think they are looking at a whole bear, well, it usually doesn't happen that way. A bear is a predator & most times they like to get close before all hell breaks loose but if one does decide to charge from 50 yds figure on 3 seconds, yup, if its a full blown charge thats just enough time to get your gun out & no you won't be looking at a whole bear. He'll most likely be in some cover so you only see parts of him, are you counting....tick, tick, tick! You will probably only have a head shot & a bears head moves around a fair bit when he's running hard. If you were smart you drew your gun when you first seen him, no matter how far away he was, you never take a chance when you spot a bear, get your damn gun out now! Big bullets really help, if a bear means business, fast, light bullets are going to cause you a lot of grief. If his head is low & he's coming fast then he's all in, you better start hitting him, if his head is bobbing a bit & he's changing pace, you've got a pretty good chance he's bluffing. Just remember what I said about getting your gun out early, thats what the smart guys do. Tick, Tick, Tick!
Dick
All the above info is good but relative. Lots of variables, Black or Brown bear, size, attitude of the bear, distance. I have seen a few browns put down, some go easy some go hard. Grant you these were large (800lbs+) problem brown bears. Other than finishing them off, it was done with large cal high powered rifles. I don't want to get into a flame war here, just stating an opinion based on some very scary personal experiences. I've lived in this state for 40+ yrs. Been in the SE where you have both blacks and browns (big ones) and worked on the remote coastal radio sites, with really big browns, not to mention Kodiak. Been stalked and charged by a few browns (Cape Hinchinbrook, Montegueue Is, Yakatat just to name a few) A large cal hand gun is the last resort in my opinion, yes its been done. But if one is to err do it one side of overkill. I prefer something that will put over a ton of energy into the "problem". Getting MEDIVACed is NOT an option. If one decides to shoot, shoot to kill, a lot of the "problem" bears had been shot before but not killed. They were a very angry, in pain creature, with a bad attitude, and were very difficult to put down. It's simply amazing how much punishment these animals can take and still keep coming. bushman
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