Reloading 9mm, OAL not turning out correct..

[marketermac]

Sorry wasn't sure where to post this.

I just got a Dillon 550b, and set it up to reload 9mm for the first time today (never reloaded anything before).

Per the suggestion of the shop where I bought it, they sold me some cast 122g FN PC coated projectiles (see them here). I have a ton of saved up brass from my previous outings that I'd been saving until I got a press.

I went to load up a few rounds, and I adjusted the die that seats the round numerous times, and attempted a number of my expended cases (both using the die that opens the mouth of the case and not using it, also with a number of adjustments).

My problem is this - when I try to seat to a length known to work in my firearm (1.156") the boolit seems to get pushed to far into the case, and is easily moves up and down before crimping so I can't get a uniform length (if I pull it before crimping I can move it up and down in the case by hand, even though it isn't easy to remove). If I move the seating die up so it doesn't get pushed in to far and become loose, and gives me an overall length that is too long.

It seems like the lube grooves cause this issue (they are right in the middle of where I want to seat the boolit). I didn't want to seat it too far in because I read about overpressure and ruining my cases. Is this because of my cases? The boolits? Bad press setup? Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks for the help!

[Handloader109]

Slow down and go read a lot more. A couple of comments. I would NOT suggest powder coated bullets for your first try at reloading. I have no experience with this brand, but my cast and PC bullets tend to cause issues with going into battery..... So first I would get you a hundred or so cheap round nose plated. Berry's or similar. They are sized small enough not to cause problems...
Now, you are wanting to open up the mouth of the case just enough to place a bullet onto the case and it barely fits at just the top. I'm assuming Dillon dies. The die at the powder feeder is VERY sensitive to this on the 9mm. You can very easily over expand the case. The Bell should be slight. Then the seating die should push the bullet into the case and if adjusted correctly crimp Bell back pretty straight. The crimp die should crimp ever so slightly. Issue is probably over expansion and seating die. Also, expect with most 9mm that overall length may be too long. Read your manual again. Slow down. Don't expect perfect results immediately. Id not have powder in play for a while. You can always take rounds apart..... Keep asking your questions.

[winelover]

Where to start.......First mistake was starting with a progressive, rather than a single stage. Second, is starting with cast powder coated, rather than jacketed. Third, semi-auto handgun reloading has more of a learning curve than straight walled handgun cartridges. You need to fully understand the basics of reloading, first, before delving into advanced techniques. Recommend you read everything you can on reloading. Might want to start with the sticky's found on this site. Lyman's Cast Bullet Manual is a must read.

A better boolit choice would have been the PC 9 115 RN or better yet, the PC 9 124 RN without the lube groove. Lube grooves are unnecessary with powder coated boolits. If you want to salvage the ones you bought.....seat deeper so the whole lube groove is below the case mouth and reduce the powder charge, accordingly. Seating deeper does increase pressures but boolits moving under recoil is just as dangerous.

BTW, this forum is meant for boolit casters, not for those that want basic reloading guidance using store bought projectiles.

Winelover

[Bonz]

1. Find a mentor, reloading is more complicated than you think
2. Practice/Develop your reloading skill with copper plated bullets (Xtreme or The Bullet Works because they are some of the highest brinell hardness)
3. Buy a reloading manual, Modern Reloading 'Second Edition' by Richard Lee

[smoked turkey]

Welcome to the forum marketermac. From the tone of your first post it seems you have pretty good grasp of things. It just takes time to get the feel for everything. After you have pulled the press handle a few hundred or a few thousand times you will be getting the hang of it. You have a nice press and it will produce a good load for you when you get it set up right. I think you have been given some good advice so far. Keep asking questions because as was stated reloading is not an easy process. There is lots of room for error along the way. Pay attention to each step in the process and check often to see that all is well. A mentor is a great help, but having this resource here on castboolits is not bad either.

[captaint]

Thank you Winelover. Thank you Bones. marketermac - you need to learn how to load ammo on a single stage press before you get mass producing ammo on a Dillon. Seriously, believe me. Reading up intenesly and understanding the entire process first is of utmost importance. There are plenty of pitfalls to be avoided in the process. I always tell myself - remember, you are assembling little bombs here, so pay attention.. I really enjoy loading ammo and I do it on a single stage and a manually operated turret press.

[happy7]

While there are easier bullets you could have chosen to start with, you have these now, and they should work just fine.

I have had a 550 for over 30 years. It sounds like your basic problem is the bullet is loose in the case when you are seating it. This is not as it should be. When I read your post I did not see if you said if you sized the cases first. If you didn't do that, that would be your problem. One the fired cases have been resized, they are supposed to be small enough so that the seated bullets fit tight in the case when they are seated. Another possibility is that your bullets are slightly undersized. This does happen more often than you would think. A micrometer would tell you if the bullets are the correct size or not. If you do not have one, I would recommend that you buy one for your reloading bench. Unlikely, but possible, is the the expanding powder funnel is oversize or that the sizing die is oversize. This is not likely, but is possible.

As has been said, if the bullet is not tight in the case, it is not a safe round. You should not be able to move the bullet in the case even if you push pretty hard on it. If loose, the bullet will get forced deeper in the case during chambering in the gun and that can cause dangerous pressure increases. 9mm is particularly vulnerable to pressure increase if this happens due to the small powder volume.

The fact that the bullet has a lube groove is not relevant to your problem. 9mm bullets have had lube grooves in them for over 100 years. However, you cannot have the bullet seated so that the rim is in the middle of the lube groove. The bullets has to be seated so that the rim is supported by solid lead and crimped against it (with a taper crimp).

Also, your problem has nothing to do with the adjustment of the seating die. You first have to solve the issue of why the bullet is loose and then you can seat the bullet and it will stay put.

[Geraldo]

I think happy7 hit the nail on the head. When you set seating length start with your cases in station #1 and size them.

If someone is going to start with a progressive, I think the 550 is good and bad because you index it manually. The good is that you can make sure everything that needed to happen did happen before you spin the shell plate. The bad is that you can get wrapped up in a problem with sizing or seating and not index the shell plate with a case in the powder station. Go slow to start!

[DCP]

BTW, this forum is meant for boolit casters, not for those that want basic reloading guidance using store bought projectiles.

Winelover

I don't believe most of the folks here feel this way.
Don't be afraid to ask your ?s.
Use your 550 in manual and don't put a primer or powder until you can hand cycle your rounds through your pistol

Good luck

[DCP]

http://www.dillonprecision.com/docs/...structions.pdf

http://leeprecision.com/instructions.html

[Dragonheart]

marketermac, I can understand your frustration. You probably depended on the advice of those wanting to sell you something and ended up with problems. I suspect your problem is unsized cases or improperly adjusted dies.

Yes, most of us started out with single stage presses and for me 50+ years ago that was the only choice I had. Your Dillon 550 is a great press, I used to own two of them. Please understand reloading can be a safe and rewarding hobby, but there is an element of danger involved. The first thing you need to do is understand the reloading process; books are great, but you will be much safer and progress much faster under a mentor. I live in Katy, Texas and would be happy to show you the ropes, but the odds are you are in a different part of the country. Maybe you can find an experienced hand to help you set up your press and get you started in the right direction? It has been my experience most handloaders are more than willing to bring another over to the dark side.

[Amiaji]

Did you run the cases through the resizing die first? When I first got my Dillon and was playing around with it and setting it up I had a similar problem with bullets loose in the case. I was loading them strait into the expander/powder station without resizing them first. The bullets would move up and down inside the case with very little pressure. Running them through the resizing die before seating the bullet and they are firmly in place.

[blikseme300]

Did you run the cases through the resizing die first? When I first got my Dillon and was playing around with it and setting it up I had a similar problem with bullets loose in the case. I was loading them strait into the expander/powder station without resizing them first. The bullets would move up and down inside the case with very little pressure. Running them through the resizing die before seating the bullet and they are firmly in place.

marketermac, this is a good starting point. Take one step at a time and it will come together. Install only the decapper/sizer die in the first station and decap/size one case. Inspect it and then try to fit a bullet into the case by hand off the press. You should not be able to and can compare to a unsized case for reference.

As to bullet size and OAL. I visited the link you included and it states that the bullets are sized to .356 and this is a red flag to me as they are on the small side in my experience. I don't PC my bullets but have found in all on my 9mm pistols that .3575 work best even when softer alloy is used. Fit is king. OAL is relative to the bullet used and not an absolute. Search and read about the "plunk test" as well as short leade chambers.

BTW, welcome to you and Amiaji to this forum.

[marketermac]

While there are easier bullets you could have chosen to start with, you have these now, and they should work just fine.

I have had a 550 for over 30 years. It sounds like your basic problem is the bullet is loose in the case when you are seating it. This is not as it should be. When I read your post I did not see if you said if you sized the cases first. If you didn't do that, that would be your problem. One the fired cases have been resized, they are supposed to be small enough so that the seated bullets fit tight in the case when they are seated. Another possibility is that your bullets are slightly undersized. This does happen more often than you would think. A micrometer would tell you if the bullets are the correct size or not. If you do not have one, I would recommend that you buy one for your reloading bench. Unlikely, but possible, is the the expanding powder funnel is oversize or that the sizing die is oversize. This is not likely, but is possible.

You (and a few after you) hit the nail on the head. I was trying to adjust the press accurately, so I was using each stage as a single stage to see what it would do and how it changed as I moved the dies up and down. Because of this I skipped stages, especially because I didn't want a primer in the round while I was trying to set things up the first time (and so the casings didn't get sized). I also was not seating the bullet deeply enough (I could still see the lube groove when loaded before, now it is seated so the lube groove is in the case).

The short bullets also made me nervous, thus me ending up asking here. I talked with a few people at the range (who happened to also have experience with the same boolits) and they reported them being short but working as intended. I appreciate the advice and help, I got my first 15 rounds loaded from the advice here and successfully took them to the range today to test the various powder charges I tried to see what would cycle my gun. Everything went great, and I now have my charge data for this round and my M&P, and some great 3 shot groups.

Again thanks everyone for the help, looking forward to moving into casting my own after I get this reloading thing completely down.

[Geraldo]

Congrats on solving your problem. You made a good decision to test a few powder charges. I had been loading 9mm a while when I decided to try a new powder. Loaded up 50 and went to the range, where I hand cycled each one of them because the starting powder load wouldn't. On accessory I'd recommend is a light so you can see your powder charge when you use the 550. I have one from http://inlinefabrication.com/ but I've also used a small reading light.

[Plate plinker]

Glad to see you are making headway. Your on the right track walk before you run. There is nothing wrong with starting on a 550. I learned on a 1050 just fine. A good practice is to run one case all the way around from beginning to end until you understand what you are doing very well then proceed slowly running the entire press as it was meant to be operated.

I often do this on the 1050 when tweaking with some settings just for total control and focus.