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Thread: Questions.

  1. #1
    Boolit Master


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    Questions.

    Hi guys.

    I've been lurking and checking in and out a couple times a year.
    I'm wondering if this paper patched addiction has a place in my reloading world.
    Has anyone paper patched 308 or larger 30 cal mags with success? What type of accuracy are you guys getting?
    I bought an NOE 311365 mould for my 300 RUM figuring it would work ok at moderate loads and so far not too good at all. I was wondering if PP would help this at all?
    If so I would be shooting that rifle every week instead of every blue moon. I'm trying to justify getting into this new addiction.... Uh I mean hobby.
    Thanks in advance guys !

  2. #2
    Boolit Master maxreloader's Avatar
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    I need to do my due dil, just ran into a hoch .451 mold that is smooth... may work in my 45/70 with correct paper. Wish I had more paper experience to help! Best of luck!
    Looking for Ideal mold 419181 (44 Evans Long)
    "Joined Dates" are deceiving if you factor-in "lurk" dates.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master
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    Michael,

    To answer your questions. I PP the 308W to 3000+fps (chrono'ed) with subMOA at 100 yds. My son and I are working on loads for the 300 H&H (max.3200+ fps w/150 gr. LBT LFN) and the 375 H&H (3000+fps w/235 gr. custom design) with hunting accuracy at 100yds. We still need to carefully refine these loads to reduce group sizes further. Likewise, I started hi-vel PP for a 300 Savage.

    Also, in the 70s the NRA achieved about 1 MOA with a 300 Win. Mag at about 3000+fps( download free NRA Cast Bullet Manual at Cast Pics which describes this). Bottom line? It's doable! However, it requires careful load preparation and attention to detail to achieve hi-vel.

    Most importantly, enjoy the journey! In this environment, when component sales can be stopped at any time, this is an excellent skill to achieve and motivates one to be self-sufficient.

    Best regards,

    CJR

  4. #4
    Boolit Master


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    Thank you!

    Can you share any of your info any the hi el loads for your 308 or H&H? Would it be reasonable to size down my 311 bullets small enough to PP them? Or should I look for a different mould to start?

  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    Michael,

    Sure thing. To date, the best accuracy with the 308W is with the 150 gr. LBT LFN. When you size the CB down to 0.301-0.3015"D, I suggest you size them in a couple of steps. Reason? Sometimes I've sized them in one step and they were fine. Other times, the one step sizing produced more sizing on one side of the CB then the other side. Looking at the grease grooves showed this problem. The charge used was 50 gr. W748,a progressive burning powder that builds pressure slowly and reaches a lower peak pressure but has a higher average pressure for higher velocity with a lower combustion temperatures. The other PPCB designs are a 160 gr. and a 180 gr. NRA PPCB clone which are very close to the 150 gr. LBT LFN in accuracy but not there yet. Pick an OAL so that a small portion of the front bare cylindrical part of the CB aligns IN the BORE, then adjust the PP location so it's against the chamber's forcing cone. The NRA did this in their PP work. Check PPCB runout. Minimum runout and alignment in the bore is key to accuracy. One(1) degree runout equals one(1) inch group at 100 yds. Factory barrel chambers can be machined offset or machined at a slight angle with the the bore axis. Therefore it's best to FL resize the case (Redding Type S FL Sizer/Bushing Die ), partial size the neck to allow unsized neck to align case in chamber, then align the CB's bare forebody with the rifle bore axis and the PP against the chamber's forcing cone. This appears to minimize unsized and/or bent cases from forcing the PPCB one way or another during the chambering process.

    For the 300 H&H, the 150 gr. LBT LFN is launched with 65 gr. of W760 for about 3200+ fps. Our 180 gr. NRA clone is launched with 65 gr. of W760 for about 2900+ fps.

    Hope this helps! Remember; Enjoy the journey!

    Best regards,

    CJR

  6. #6
    Boolit Master


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    Bump from the dead.

    So Do you think the NOE 311365 would be a decent candidate for PP? I guess I'm going to need a 301 sizer.... or I could ream out a smaller Lee sizer I guess.
    One of these days I'm going to finally do this and wish I did it sooner I'm sure

  7. #7
    Boolit Grand Master 303Guy's Avatar
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    There is another approach one can take and that is heavier and slower patched boolits but they do use up more lead and not necessarily less powder. Just an option if the rifle's throat demands it.
    Rest In Peace My Son (01/06/1986 - 14/01/2014)

    ''Assume everything that moves is a human before identifying as otherwise''

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Michael,

    What bullet style you want to order depends on what type of shooting you want to do. If you want to only do PP, order the NOE NRA cloned PPCB moulds, i.e. 301618 or 301620 and size in ONE step to 0.3015"D.. If you want to shoot greased CB at lower velocities (around 1800-2200 fps) and occasionally shoot high velocity PPCB (3000+fps), I'd recommend the 150 gr. LBT LFN, sized down in a COUPLE of steps to 0.3015"D. Whatever the choice, enjoy the journey! Life's short.

    Best regards,

    CJR

  9. #9
    Boolit Master


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    Good info.
    I do already have the 311365 though so I was wondering if that would work ok for PP higher velocity. ?

  10. #10
    Boolit Master
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    Michael,

    Since you already have the NOE 311365; that design is close to 200 gr. In a 308Win, you should be able to drive it about 2400 fps with W760 powder. You will not achieve 3000+ fps with that CB in a 308Win. If you're happy with 2400 fps, PP it and see what kind of accuracy you get.

    Best regards,

    CJR

  11. #11
    Boolit Master


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    As long as the design should work then I'm happy. I'm mainly looking for this for the 300 RUM

  12. #12
    Boolit Grand Master 303Guy's Avatar
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    A 200 gr boolit Doing near 2400 fps is a very respectable beast indeed! It may even be a little fast for a hunting boolit but it would be great as a target boolit with considerable range (providing it is accurate of course, which it may well be). Try it and see.

    I made a boolit mold for a rifle I had that weighed in at 208 gr and with the load I was using and it was amazingly accurate at 100 m (open sights from two centuries ago and eyes from almost as far back - 1800's for the sights and 1900's for the eyes. OK so the eyes were still pretty good ). Velocity wasn't really up to longer ranges though.

    To me it sounds as though you have the makings of a respectable patched boolit with decent velocity and range. Only one way to find out.
    Rest In Peace My Son (01/06/1986 - 14/01/2014)

    ''Assume everything that moves is a human before identifying as otherwise''

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check